So Bottom Line: I Believe In Faith + Works. Am I Going To Hell? (disciples, Holy Spirit)
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Of course if we could earn our salvation, what do we need Jesus for? If the original disciples said by keeping the Law you would be justified, why were they believers at all? They would essentially continue Judaism.
Some say Jesus claimed He was the Messiah, along with a bunch of others during that time period. So after He died, His following should have ceased. Yet they continued after His crucifixion. In order to continue preaching the name of Jesus, there had to be some extraordinary claims from the beginning. There would also have to be an explanation why He died on the cross. Why did He die? He died for the sins of mankind. He rose again for our justification. So if we are justified in Him already, what is left for us to do, to earn God's favor? It's all done. It doesn't make sense to say Jesus paid my way to God, but I'm paying my way to God. Is it paid or is it not paid?
This shows us that out of all the big name followers of Jesus, Paul probably got this message the best. Well, either Paul or John. (John's name by the way means "God is graceful") The works that we do, will determine the rewards we receive in Heaven. Yet concerning Heaven, it's a done deal. We are the adopted sons and daughters of God in Jesus. We are now in the family business of the kingdom of heaven.
I like the way you're thinking and presenting yourself. No games, no hidden agenda. No senseless backbiting those who think differently. Just a heart for pleasing God. It's refreshing.
So here's the bottom line issue on all these posts I've made about Paul. I implicitly reject his gospel "by grace are ye saved through faith alone; not of works".
I embrace Jesus' gospel "Whosoever believes on the Son shall not perish" + "What must I do to inherit eternal life? Do not steal; do not bear false witness; Love God and do good to your fellow man."
So am I going to eternal damnation because I reject salvation by faith alone, or am I going to heaven because I believe salvation involves believing in Jesus plus doing good works for my fellow man?
Whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. Your works won't save, or doom you.
Romans 9
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
The Pharisees were approaching God with the Law.. They did not submit to the righteousness of God which is of Faith in who God sent - JESUS Christ.
Luke 20:17-18
King James Version (KJV)
17 And he beheld them, and said, What is this then that is written, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner?
18 Whosoever shall fall upon that stone shall be broken; but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
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The Jews did not receive Jesus as God's Sent on anointed Messiah that was to save them from their sins.. Instead of approaching God as a guilty Man pleading for His mercy in forgiveness through Christ, they attempted to approach God with their own righteousness of the Law..
And they stumbled at that stumbling stone..
John 8:20-25 (KJV)
20 These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come.
21 Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
22 Then said the Jews, Will he kill himself? because he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come.
23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
25 Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.
They never received JESUS Christ.. they died in their sins..
Romans 10:3
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Philippians 3:8-10 (KJV)
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
As a literalist . . . he will never actually think about or reason out his answers. His questions are rote defensive dogma. The idea that our "fruits" are the indicators of our "belief ON" Jesus . . . (not our proclamations of belief) . . . is unacceptable. ANY implication that we have any requirements to actually DO anything besides "believe" is simply not acceptable.
Ironically . . . Vizio is right as regards our salvation but not for the reasons he thinks. NONE of us have anything to do with our salvation. Jesus did it for us all, period. But we DO have to concern ourselves with our sanctification under His love for us all by striving to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't. That is how we attune our Spirits to His and achieve the cover of His perfection for our imperfections.
The work of salvation is complete. We only need to access what is freely available... it's the "Way".
It gives me pause to believe anyone can know what another "thinks"... that is the pretense of knowledge.
Whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. Your works won't save, or doom you.
....and how does one display that they believe ?____________- James 2 vs 19,26
If you really believe the weatherman that it is going to rain or snow hard do you exercise that belief in his forecast to be prepared by taking the proper actions when necessary ?
How did Jesus show his belief according to Luke 4 v 43 ?
And how did Jesus say we should show our belief according to Matthew 24 vs 13,14?
Ironically . . . Vizio is right as regards our salvation but not for the reasons he thinks. NONE of us have anything to do with our salvation. Jesus did it for us all, period. But we DO have to concern ourselves with our sanctification under His love for us all by striving to "love God and each other" daily and repent when we don't. That is how we attune our Spirits to His and achieve the cover of His perfection for our imperfections.
Funny....but scripture outright contradicts what you say. But I know--you can't be bothered with little things like what scripture actually says. You instead claim to have some deeper understanding of who God is...and by virtue of this special understanding of God, you tell us the rest of us are wrong.
I'm sorry...I'll believe scripture over some 21st Century Mystic. You never have been able to tell me how we know who is right when 2 mystics get contradictory answers.
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