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All you have to do is read 4 Maccabees 10:15 for yourself. The text uses the word aidios in connection with pious men. Men have a beginning. Therefore the word aidios in 4 Maccabees 10:15 is not being used with reference to eternal pre-existence. I included both the Greek and the English and bolded the pertinent words for easy comparison.
READ IT!!!
4 Maccabees 10:15 No, by the blessed death of my brothers, by the eternal destruction of the tyrant, and by the everlasting life of the pious, I will not renounce our noble brotherhood.
::Sigh::The first "eternal" referencing the tyrant destruction is aionios. The aidios refers to God (who IS the everlasting life) who provides the everlasting (unending but not without beginning) life that is PROMISED TO the pious.
You don't like what the text says, so you just claim that it's in error. There are only two references to the word ἀίδιος in the Bible which is not sufficient to determine its range of meaning. 4 Maccabees 10:15 provides a bit more information about the word.
Dear Mike: Do not be slow!
If you read it carefully, you will see a difference between Jude 1:6 and Jude 1:7, whereas, they do not use the same Greek WORD. The fire speaks to that of an age, a period of time, not something that is without a beginning or an end.
This is true concerning the two different words that are used. “aidios” (eternal) is used in Jude 6, whereas “aiōnios” (age lasting) is used in Jude 7.
However, whereas the “eternal chains of darkness” are indeed eternal, the text seems to say that the fallen angels will be kept in that eternal darkness only until “the judgment of the great day”
Source of the all, Guide of the all, Goal of the all
If you read it carefully, you will see a difference between Jude 1:6 and Jude 1:7, whereas, they do not use the same Greek WORD. The fire speaks to that of an age, a period of time, not something that is without a beginning or an end.
This is true concerning the two different words that are used. “aidios” (eternal) is used in Jude 6, whereas “aiōnios” (age lasting) is used in Jude 7.
However, whereas the “eternal chains of darkness” are indeed eternal, the text seems to say that the fallen angels will be kept in that eternal darkness only until “the judgment of the great day”
Source of the all, Guide of the all, Goal of the all
Dear Mike: Do not allow senior citizen status to obscure the view of aidios. There are actually more than two verses speaking of the Aidios One. But make zero mistake, the ONLY word for eternal in Canon is aidios and is ALWAYS in reference to the Eternal One!
"For His invisible nature, His eternal power and deity from the creation of the universe, being clearly understood in the things that have been made, they are without excuse."
Dear Mike: Do not allow senior citizen status to obscure the view of aidios. There are actually more than two verses speaking of the Aidios One. But make zero mistake, the ONLY word for eternal in Canon is aidios and is ALWAYS in reference to the Eternal One!
"For His invisible nature, His eternal power and deity from the creation of the universe, being clearly understood in the things that have been made, they are without excuse."
"His invisible nature">>>>>
"His eternal power & Deity" =
His aidios nature......His aidios power & Deity
What does anyone's age have to with the topic? Do you really need to do that to try to make your point appear valid?
All you have to do is read 4 Maccabees 10:15 for yourself. The text uses the word aidios in connection with pious men. Men have a beginning. Therefore the word aidios in 4 Maccabees 10:15 is not being used with reference to eternal pre-existence. I included both the Greek and the English and bolded the pertinent words for easy comparison.
READ IT!!!
4 Maccabees 10:15 No, by the blessed death of my brothers, by the eternal destruction of the tyrant, and by the everlasting life of the pious, I will not renounce our noble brotherhood.
::Sigh::The first "eternal" referencing the tyrant destruction is aionios. The aidios refers to God (who IS the everlasting life) who provides the everlasting (unending but not without beginning) life that is PROMISED TO the pious.
The context in which the word ἀίδιον is used in 4 Maccabees 10:15 concerns the everlasting life of the pious. It is not referring to God who provides the everlasting life.
4 Maccabees 10:15 No, by the blessed death of my brothers, by the eternal destruction of the tyrant, and by the everlasting life of the pious, I will not renounce our noble brotherhood.
4 Maccabees 10:15 μὰ τὸν μακάριον τῶν ἀδελφῶν μου θάνατον καὶ τὸν ]αἰώνιον τοῦ τυράννου ὄλεθρον καὶ τὸν ἀίδιον τῶν εὐσεβῶν βίον, οὐκ ἀρνήσομαι τὴν εὐγενῆ ἀδελφότητα.
I BELIEVE THER WORD "KAI" IN THAT VERSE MEANS EVERYTHING ON BOTH SIDES THAT THAT KAI ARE THUS EQUAL.. IT MEAN MORE THAN JUST "AND"..
LIKE GOD KAI FATHER IT MEANS BOTH OF THESE ARE EQUAL/ and one ON BOTH SIDES OF THAT "KAI"
.
Rev 22:16
¶
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and(KAI) the offspring of David, the bright ( KAI) morning star.
Rev 22:17
¶
And(KAI)
the Spirit and( KAI) the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
the example given in KAI is
Father Kai= to God
so the Son)
( root kai= to offspring
kai = to
Bright
kai = to morning star )
thus He is one with
Kai = to
( The Spirit
which is Kai=
to The Bride )
or they are all one in saying "come........." .
but our word "and" can make to very unsimilar things appear quite similar because "going" is the subject of a sentence.. . just because there is a kai " the son of David " is Kai = to the Bride ( daughter in law ) .. which means they are one/ married.
that placement of that one kai makes all on both sides of that Kai to be equal or the same.
the Kai in that verse above is Kai only in its "time" is the true subject of that verse.., and is not in the meaning of the people/subjects of that sentence as they are clearly not equal/ married / one etc. so Mark play with that kai in her sentance
4 Maccabees 10:15 μὰ τὸν μακάριον τῶν ἀδελφῶν μου θάνατον καὶ τὸν ]αἰώνιον τοῦ τυράννου ὄλεθρον καὶ τὸν ἀίδιον τῶν εὐσεβῶν βίον, οὐκ ἀρνήσομαι τὴν εὐγενῆ ἀδελφότητα.
something in there is equal and balanced/ one . the tyrant and the pious that will both be doing something equal for uncountable numbers of days or ages .
. It serves as copulative( look up this word, to become one?) i. e. to connect (Latin et, atque, German und);
1. it connects single words or terms:
a. universally, as οἱ Φαρισαῖοι καί Σαδδουκαῖοι, Matthew 16:1; ὁ Θεός καί πατήρ, he who is God and Father (see Θεός, 3); ἐν καρδία καλή καί ἀγαθή, Luke 8:15; πολυμερῶς καί πολυτρόπως, Hebrews 1:1; it is repeated
and yes the pious could live forever or as long as and equal/ one in the same time as the tyrants are punished.. because I think that Kai makes that equal or balanced / one/ in time.
The context in which the word ἀίδιον is used in 4 Maccabees 10:15 concerns the everlasting life of the pious. It is not referring to God who provides the everlasting life.
Dear senior citizen Mike: There are a number of reasons the books including Maccabees are not included in Canon.
The context in which the word ἀίδιον is used in 4 Maccabees 10:15 concerns the everlasting life of the pious. It is not referring to God who provides the everlasting life.
The illogic of pretending the pious have everlasting life given that we ALL die, pious or not, is just one of the many illogical and irrational mistakes you make, Mike. It is a promise from the one who IS everlasting life - God. It is that promise they refuse to renounce.
In your desperate attempt to justify a ghastly dogma, you are reaching for something beyond your present grasp of the Aidios God of glory!
"But if your eyesight is bad, your whole body will be dark. If however the very light within you is darkness, how dense must the darkness be!"
Canonicity isn't the issue. Word usage, how words were used by the ancient writers is the issue. In 4 Maccabees 10:15 the word ἀίδιον is used for the everlasting life of the pious. The writer of 4 Maccabees chose to use the word ἀίδιον to express his thought.
I'm not the one who is desperate. That would be you Universalists who will go to any length to avoid the clear meaning of the usage of the term αἰώνιον in the Bible.
What I notice is that Christ reigns as long as it takes to deliver the kingdom to God
it seems to me that is the length of the aion, and that is what aionios refers to
1Co 15:21 For since death is through man, also through a Man is a resurrection of the dead;
1Co 15:22 for as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But each in his own order: Christ, the firstfruit; afterward those of Christ at His coming.
1Co 15:24 Then is the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God, even the Father, when He makes to cease all rule and all authority and power.
1Co 15:25 For it is right for Him to reign until He puts all the hostile ones under His feet; Psa. 110:1
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