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This is one of the phrases construed to denote His "return" that are used in the New Testament books.
"the coming of the Lord,"
"the sign of Thy coming,"
"the day of Christ is at hand,"
"the Son of man coming in the clouds,"
"the Day of the Lord"
All of these phrases refer to the same event. To understand what event these phrases refer to, we must go to Scripture, and not to the pre-conceived ideas and teachings of "theological" philosophy and "end times" merchandisers.
The apostles and Jews of the first century clearly understood what the above phrases meant, because they read it many times in the Old Testament books. These phrases were very common in the Old Testament books. Such language was used many times in the past whenever God would overthrow and destroy a single nation at a specific time. While reading the following examples from the Old Testament books, notice how similar these phrases are to the same expressions used in the New Testament books.
The Lord's Coming in the Old Testament
In scripture, “the day of the Lord” has never referred to a physical, literal return of the Lord. “The day of the Lord” has always referred to the Lord's judgment upon either a city or nation of people. It refers to a destruction from God Almighty:
"Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come" (Joel 1:15).
It refers to the destruction upon the heathen:
"For the day of the LORD is near upon all the heathen" (Obadiah 1:15).
It refers to the anger of God upon a nation not desired by Him:
"Gather yourselves together, yea, gather together, O nation not desired…before the fierce anger of the LORD come upon you, before the day of the LORD'S anger come upon you. Seek ye the LORD…it may be ye shall be hid in the day of the LORD'S anger" (Zephaniah 2:1-3).
The following are some examples of “the day of the Lord” and “the Lord riding on a swift cloud and shall come” being fulfilled upon many people throughout scriptural history:
Jeremiah 46:2,10, "Against Egypt…For this is the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood: for the Lord GOD of hosts hath a sacrifice in the north country by the river Euphrates."
This was referring to the destruction of the Egyptians, and this was fulfilled when Pharaohnechoh king of Egypt went up against the king of Assyria to the river Euphrates (see 2 Kings 23:29).
Isaiah 19:1, "The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD rideth upon a swift cloud, and shall come into Egypt"
This was referring to the destruction of Egypt, and this was fulfilled in 480 BC.
Ezekiel 30:3-4, "For the day is near, even the day of the LORD is near, a cloudy day…And the sword shall come upon Egypt "
This was also referring to the destruction of Egypt, and this was fulfilled in 480 BC.
Isaiah 13:1,6-9 – “The burden of Babylon…the day of the LORD is at hand…the day of the LORD cometh.”
This was referring to the destruction of Babylon, and this was fulfilled in 539 BC.
Zephaniah 1:4,7,14-15 "I will also stretch out mine hand upon Judah, and upon all the inhabitants of Jerusalem…for the day of the LORD is at hand: …The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD:…That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness."
This was referring to the destruction of Jerusalem, and this was fulfilled in 586 BC.
Amos 5:18-20, "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD!…the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light…Shall not the day of the LORD be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?"
Note that it is "Woe unto them" that desire the day of the LORD. This was referring to the destruction of Israel, and this was fulfilled in 722 BC.
Since only Scripture can interpret Scripture, when we read of "the day of the Lord" in the New Testament books, it can only refer to God's judgment upon a nation of people. Specifically, in the New Testament, it refers to the destruction of Jerusalem, which occurred in 70 A.D. We shall now examine just one of the many passages which clearly show this. Next
I've been accused of so many things since I've been on CD (R&P), which hasn't been long. I was even accused of being blasphemous and self-righteous because of the screen name that I use. There's a reason for it, just like my being here. It wasn't an accident I stumbled across CD in 2006.
There's been so many questions and disagreements about the end times. Here's what I believe, and here's what the screen name means. Once again, I will state my purpose; to spread God's message of the salvation through Jesus Christ His Son to acheive an eternal, immortal life in heaven with God.
"Day of the Lord" is derived from the many times this term is used in the Bible to refer to the rapture of the church, as well as Jesus' second coming. Some seem to be confused by the fact that they are not one in the same, so I want to clear that up if possible. There will be a 2nd coming, but it's actually in two phases.
1 Thessalonians 5:1-2
"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night."
Let me just take a moment to dissect these two verses.
NOW = change in topic.....NOT "now", as in right this minute.
Like we would say in conversation; "Now, I want to talk about something else." TIMES (plural)= (greek=chronos) = chronology EVENTS (plural)= epoch (kairos) = happenings
"Times" and "events" that lead up to the "day of the Lord" FIRST "YOU" = Paul is speaking to Christian people 2ND "YOU" = Paul is speaking to ALL
In this instance, the "day of the Lord" refers to the day the Lord returns briefly to collect the believers or the body of Christ.
This is the order of things to come:
1. Rapture (day of the Lord, day of "visitation', day of wrath)
2. Rise of the AntiChrist (7 year reign)
3. Salvation of Israel
4. Opening of the seven seals
5. Sounding of the trumpets
6. The 2nd coming of Christ
7. Battle of Armageddon
8. 1000 year reign of Christ
9. Binding of Satan for 1000 years
10. Release of Satan for a short time
11. Final stand or rebellion
12. Great white throne judgement
13. New heaven and the new earth will be created
Essential message:
Believers will not face this day of wrath (day of rapture and God's wrath)
Unbelievers WILL face this day of wrath (the day of wrath for unbelievers)
What you must do to be raptured:
1. Acknowledge your sin
2. you must confess your sin to Jesus
3. You must trust on Jesus....accept Him by faith
I could go on, but I will stop here so as to not make this any longer than it already is and to allow for discussion.
DOTL: YOU are assuming things! Two phases of the 2nd Coming? The Day of the Lord is DERIVED FROM the many times it refers to the "Rapture?" The Scriptures teach no such thing. You are reading the fictional version of the "rapture" into such verses!
The conjunction, "de," ties chapter 5 to chapter 4, so let's back up to chapter 4. Paul uses personal pronouns that very much include him and his first-century listeners and readers! Notice--"For this WE [Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy] say to YOU [the Thessalonians], . . . that WE [those of the first-century!] who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep [OT saints, pre-A.D. 70 in Hades]. . . . The dead in Christ will rise first. . . Then WE [Paul and his contemporaries] who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with THEM in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus WE shall always be with the Lord. Therefore [YOU--first-century saints] comfort one another with these words." That is the audience relevance; that is the context!
Chapter 5 follows with this SAME topic only now Paul begins to deal with the timing of the things he has just spoken of. Paul did not need to tell them again about the timing because THEY knew "perfectly" that the day of the Lord spoken of in chapter 4 would come "as a thief in the night."
Those in darkness would be taken by surprise. Then follows the same coordinating conjunction "de" translated BUT. THEY [those of the first-century to whom Paul was directly writing] would not be taken by surprise because THEY were "all sons of light and sons of the day." The Day of the Lord would not overtake THEM [not us!] as a thief. Then Paul says--"Let US [Paul, Silvanus, Timothy and those of PAUL'S day] watch and be sober." Again, in light of all of this and the coming wrath to which THEY were not appointed, THEY were to comfort one another!
Based upon the clear CONTEXT, DOTL, Paul is not using the first YOU to speak of all Christians in general. It is a YOU of direct address to THOSE first-century believers! Why would he personally address far-distant believers about not needing to write to them? That makes no sense in the CONTEXT! In the second YOU, Paul is NOT speaking to ALL. He is speaking first of all to the THESSALONIANS! Read the first chapter and first verse--"Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy, TO the CHURCH OF THE THESSALONIANS in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
YOU have determined that the Day of the Lord is still future to us today, THEREFORE, YOU determine that Paul could not have been personally addressing believers of HIS day! You are reading this into the text (eisegesis).
Furthermore, your order of things is merely futurist teaching that bears no resemblance to the teachings of the Scriptures. Where is your biblical support for any of it? Most of it comes from the Book of Revelation and, therefore, cannot mean what futurists force it to "mean" since the Revelation concerns those things that were to SHORTLY take place in John's day!!!!! The time was THEN near!
How many people blindly follow this unbiblical order of events and never question it? These teachings are NOT doctrine; they are fiction. And Hal Lindsey has made millions from this deception!
DOTL: YOU are assuming things! Two phases of the 2nd Coming? The Day of the Lord is DERIVED FROM the many times it refers to the "Rapture?" The Scriptures teach no such thing. You are reading the fictional version of the "rapture" into such verses!
I am not assuming anything. This is how I and millions of others have come to discern the scriptures through the Holy Spirit and study. The rapture is just a word used to describe what is going to happen. Where did you get that from? The word "rapture" is not even in the Bible! What IS IN the Bible is the reference to the saints being "caught up" with the Lord:
1 Thessalonians 4:17
"After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."
There is nothing fictional about this. This is a scripture from God's Word, which I know to be the truth.
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The conjunction, "de," ties chapter 5 to chapter 4, so let's back up to chapter 4. Paul uses personal pronouns that very much include him and his first-century listeners and readers! Notice--"For this WE [Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy] say to YOU [the Thessalonians], . . . that WE [those of the first-century!] who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep [OT saints, pre-A.D. 70 in Hades]. . . . The dead in Christ will rise first. . . Then WE [Paul and his contemporaries] who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with THEM in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus WE shall always be with the Lord. Therefore [YOU--first-century saints] comfort one another with these words." That is the audience relevance; that is the context!
This is all conjecture and your own personal belief. Your belief is contrary to what is being said in the Bible. If the coming of Christ had already happened (which it has not), then the event would have clearly been described and recorded in the Bible. It is not. You have absolutely nothing to prove what you are saying.
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Chapter 5 follows with this SAME topic only now Paul begins to deal with the timing of the things he has just spoken of. Paul did not need to tell them again about the timing because THEY knew "perfectly" that the day of the Lord spoken of in chapter 4 would come "as a thief in the night."
Those in darkness would be taken by surprise. Then follows the same coordinating conjunction "de" translated BUT. THEY [those of the first-century to whom Paul was directly writing] would not be taken by surprise because THEY were "all sons of light and sons of the day." The Day of the Lord would not overtake THEM [not us!] as a thief. Then Paul says--"Let US [Paul, Silvanus, Timothy and those of PAUL'S day] watch and be sober." Again, in light of all of this and the coming wrath to which THEY were not appointed, THEY were to comfort one another!
Again, conjecture and personal beliefs. And more attempts to confuse those seeking the truth of God's Word and the Biblical prophesies that have yet to be fulfilled. The Bible is full of prophecies that have been fulfilled AND prophecies that have not been fulfilled. Because we are in the end times, the end time prophecies are now being fulfilled. It is my duty as a Christian to warn of these things and put things in perspective as to what is to come and the order it will be coming. I have the knowledge, and I am directed by God and His Word to share that knowledge so that no one may perish.
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Based upon the clear CONTEXT, DOTL, Paul is not using the first YOU to speak of all Christians in general. It is a YOU of direct address to THOSE first-century believers! Why would he personally address far-distant believers about not needing to write to them? That makes no sense in the CONTEXT! In the second YOU, Paul is NOT speaking to ALL. He is speaking first of all to the THESSALONIANS! Read the first chapter and first verse--"Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy, TO the CHURCH OF THE THESSALONIANS in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
Yes, Paul IS using the YOU to speak to all Christians...then AND NOW. The Bible is for all of us....ALL GENERATIONS. It was applicable then and it is applicable now. That would be the LIVING part of God's Word.
Hebrews 4:12
"For the word of God is LIVING AND ACTIVE. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."
2 Samuel 22:31
"As for God, his way is perfect; the word of the Lord is flawless. He is a shield for all who take refuge in him."
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YOU have determined that the Day of the Lord is still future to us today, THEREFORE, YOU determine that Paul could not have been personally addressing believers of HIS day! You are reading this into the text (eisegesis).
I have determined nothing. The Bible determines what I believe, and the Bible tells us all that the coming of the Lord is AT HAND. The reason it is AT HAND is BECAUSE we are living in the end times according to Biblical prophecy and signs we are told to watch for.
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Furthermore, your order of things is merely futurist teaching that bears no resemblance to the teachings of the Scriptures. Where is your biblical support for any of it? Most of it comes from the Book of Revelation and, therefore, cannot mean what futurists force it to "mean" since the Revelation concerns those things that were to SHORTLY take place in John's day!!!!! The time was THEN near!
The order of things that I have listed in the OP are the order in which the Bible tells us these things will happen. I am a believer in what the Bible says. I'm a Christian....not a futurist. That's a man-made label. I simply believe what the Bible is actually saying to be truth. I have given all the Biblical support for all of it, time and time again. Your refusal to recognize it has nothing to do with the fact that it is the Truth.
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How many people blindly follow this unbiblical order of events and never question it? These teachings are NOT doctrine; they are fiction. And Hal Lindsey has made millions from this deception!
People who believe the truth of God's Word are following Him and it's all Biblical. No matter how the events unfold, the ones who believe in Jesus Christ and His teachings that He will be returning are looking forward with hope for the blessed day that it will happen. Christians are not hung up on how, but we do understand from the Word of God that it is coming very, very soon. To say otherwise is not Biblical, nor is it of Christ.
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What saith the Scriptures, DOTL?
The scriptures say the Lord has not returned, but will be returning in the very near future. Not being able to grasp that is leaning upon your own understanding, which the Bible teaches NOT to do.
I've been accused of so many things since I've been on CD (R&P), which hasn't been long. I was even accused of being blasphemous and self-righteous because of the
Quote:
screen name that I use.
There's a reason for it, just like my being here. It wasn't an accident I stumbled across CD in 2006.
"Day of the Lord" is derived from the many times this term is used in the Bible to
Quote:
refer to the rapture of the church, as well as Jesus' second coming.
Some seem to be confused by the fact that they are not one in the same, so I want to clear that up if possible. There will be a 2nd coming, but it's actually in two phases.
I could go on, but I will stop here so as to not make this any longer than it already is and to allow for discussion.:)
You are sadly mistaken on your personal interpretation of the phrase, "Day of the Lord". You obviously didn't look at Old Testament prophesy to interpret what this phrase means.
As we can see here, "Day of the Lord" is not a good thing.
Amos 5:18-20, "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD!…the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light…Shall not the day of the LORD be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?"
Note that it is "Woe unto them" that desire the day of the LORD. This was referring to the destruction of Israel, and this was fulfilled in 722 BC.
Scripture tells us there is no light in DayoftheLord.
Please tell me 'Where in the world you get "rapture" and Christ's "second" coming from here in this verse'? Read the other scripture I provided from the OT. Please explain to me where the rapture is taking place? Where Christ's second coming is?
Isaiah 13:1,6-9 – “The burden of Babylon…the day of the LORD is at hand…the day of the LORD cometh.”
This was referring to the destruction of Babylon, and this was fulfilled in 539 BC.
Also, by examining the language in the above verse, we see that "the day of the Lord is "at hand". The day of the Lord "cometh".
AT HAND
sound familiar?
DayoftheLord Please answer this question.
When Day of the Lord is mentioned in Isaiah 13, till the time of the destruction of Babylon in 539 BC, how much time had passed?
DotL, you can look at the beginning of Isaiah to see what kings were ruling, also there might be some internal clues. As we already know the outcome of the prophecy of the destruction of Babylon, perhaps we can research how long God terms "at hand" to be. (especially since we discovered the truth about day of the Lord, by OT) I know it is nowhere near 2000+ years. Perhaps we can discover more truths by going to the OT.
In case DayoftheLord dosen't care to answer, then I would encourage others to please open their bibles.
Sound like to much work?
Hebrews 11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Don't think words have much meaning?
Matthew 12:36-37, "But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned."
Proverbs 6:2, "Thou art snared with the words of thy mouth, thou art taken with the words of thy mouth."
Proverbs 30:5-6, "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."
You are sadly mistaken on your personal interpretation of the phrase, "Day of the Lord". You obviously didn't look at Old Testament prophesy to interpret what this phrase means.
As we can see here, "Day of the Lord" is not a good thing.
Amos 5:18-20, "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD!…the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light…Shall not the day of the LORD be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?"
Note that it is "Woe unto them" that desire the day of the LORD. This was referring to the destruction of Israel, and this was fulfilled in 722 BC.
Scripture tells us there is no light in DayoftheLord.
Please tell me 'Where in the world you get "rapture" and Christ's "second" coming from here in this verse'? Read the other scripture I provided from the OT. Please explain to me where the rapture is taking place? Where Christ's second coming is?
Isaiah 13:1,6-9 – “The burden of Babylon…the day of the LORD is at hand…the day of the LORD cometh.”
This was referring to the destruction of Babylon, and this was fulfilled in 539 BC.
Also, by examining the language in the above verse, we see that "the day of the Lord is "at hand". The day of the Lord "cometh".
AT HAND
sound familiar?
DayoftheLord Please answer this question.
When Day of the Lord is mentioned in Isaiah 13, till the time of the destruction of Babylon in 539 BC, how much time had passed?
DotL, you can look at the beginning of Isaiah to see what kings were ruling, also there might be some internal clues. As we already know the outcome of the prophecy of the destruction of Babylon, perhaps we can research how long God terms "at hand" to be. (especially since we discovered the truth about day of the Lord, by OT) I know it is nowhere near 2000+ years. Perhaps we can discover more truths by going to the OT.
In case DayoftheLord dosen't care to answer, then I would encourage others to please open their bibles.
Sound like to much work?
Hebrews 11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Don't think words have much meaning?
Matthew 12:36-37, "But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned."
Proverbs 6:2, "Thou art snared with the words of thy mouth, thou art taken with the words of thy mouth."
Proverbs 30:5-6, "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."
Well, duh.....the "Day of the Lord" is never going to be good for unbelievers!!
And as usual, the preterist belief is twisting and distorting scripture. The scripture from Amos was warning Israel, who expected to be exalted on "this day" and that's why they "longed" for it, but it WOULD NOT come as they expected because Israel had not been faithful to God.
Just because they were longing for it doesn't mean they were going to get what they were hoping for. Amos was warning that the day would come, but NOT AS they expected BECAUSE of their unfaithfulness.
Big difference there, pal. I suppose you thought that I wouldn't know what was being referred to here and that you could mislead others uncontested. Wrong.
The Day of the Lord is a day of great hope and light for Christians, as promised, that HAS NOT YET COME.
The Day of the Lord is a day of great darkness for unbelievers.
1 Thessalonians 5:2-6......"for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people (unbelievers) are saying, "peace and safety", destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. But you (all believers), brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief. You (all believers) are all sons of the light and sons of the day. We (all believers) do not belong to the night or to the darkness. So then, let us not be like others (unbelievers), who are asleep, but let us be alert and self-controlled."
Please stop distorting the Holy Word of God for your own intents and purposes.
You are sadly mistaken on your personal interpretation of the phrase, "Day of the Lord". You obviously didn't look at Old Testament prophesy to interpret what this phrase means.
As we can see here, "Day of the Lord" is not a good thing.
Amos 5:18-20, "Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD!…the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light…Shall not the day of the LORD be darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?"
Note that it is "Woe unto them" that desire the day of the LORD. This was referring to the destruction of Israel, and this was fulfilled in 722 BC.
Scripture tells us there is no light in DayoftheLord.
Please tell me 'Where in the world you get "rapture" and Christ's "second" coming from here in this verse'? Read the other scripture I provided from the OT. Please explain to me where the rapture is taking place? Where Christ's second coming is?
Isaiah 13:1,6-9 – “The burden of Babylon…the day of the LORD is at hand…the day of the LORD cometh.”
This was referring to the destruction of Babylon, and this was fulfilled in 539 BC.
Also, by examining the language in the above verse, we see that "the day of the Lord is "at hand". The day of the Lord "cometh".
AT HAND
sound familiar?
DayoftheLord Please answer this question.
When Day of the Lord is mentioned in Isaiah 13, till the time of the destruction of Babylon in 539 BC, how much time had passed?
DotL, you can look at the beginning of Isaiah to see what kings were ruling, also there might be some internal clues. As we already know the outcome of the prophecy of the destruction of Babylon, perhaps we can research how long God terms "at hand" to be. (especially since we discovered the truth about day of the Lord, by OT) I know it is nowhere near 2000+ years. Perhaps we can discover more truths by going to the OT.
In case DayoftheLord dosen't care to answer, then I would encourage others to please open their bibles.
Sound like to much work?
Hebrews 11:6 But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Don't think words have much meaning?
Matthew 12:36-37, "But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned."
Proverbs 6:2, "Thou art snared with the words of thy mouth, thou art taken with the words of thy mouth."
Proverbs 30:5-6, "Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."
No I think it's you has misunderstood the meaning here. In Amos 5:18-19 here "the day of the Lord" means the imminent destruction by the Assyrian army as well as the future day of God's judgment. For the faithful Christians "the day of the Lord" will be glorious, but for the unfaithful it will be a day of darkness and doom.
DOTL, Hiram, Preterist (& others who have participated in this thread, you know who you are )....I think you just may have to agree to disagree on this topic. I'm telling you this as a sister in Christ so please do not take it the wrong way. You obviously are all firmly convinced that your position is the right one and I understand that completely. And I think it's pretty obvious that none of you are going to be convinced to change your position any time soon. It's also true that not all of you can be right and because of this I think you all need to leave it up to the Lord to show whoever holds the wrong position his (or her) error.
There are certain things we as Christians should never change our position on. Things that would be considered the building blocks of our faith. These would include the fact that Jesus is the son of God, the virgin birth, the fact that Jesus was crucified and rose on the third day....you know the things I am talking about. Whether or not Jesus returned in 70 A.D. or is coming some time in future is not something we need to hang our salvation on. It just really doesn't matter when you look at the big picture.
Again, please don't take this the wrong way. I just thought this thread was getting a bit heated and felt the need to post and hopefully give you all something to think about.
Amen!
People generally don't change their minds on these issues. Years ago I loved to debate and argue but sometimes I think it wastes time. Nothing wrong with saying what you think God's truth is but the issue is Christ and Him alone.
I always go back to Judges..."Will not the judge of the world do right" I don't understand it all but I trust God has His perfect plan in motion.
I know I am saved and my job here is to love God with all my heart and love my neighbor.
God Bless
DOTL, Hiram, Preterist (& others who have participated in this thread, you know who you are )....I think you just may have to agree to disagree on this topic. I'm telling you this as a sister in Christ so please do not take it the wrong way. You obviously are all firmly convinced that your position is the right one and I understand that completely. And I think it's pretty obvious that none of you are going to be convinced to change your position any time soon. It's also true that not all of you can be right and because of this I think you all need to leave it up to the Lord to show whoever holds the wrong position his (or her) error.
There are certain things we as Christians should never change our position on. Things that would be considered the building blocks of our faith. These would include the fact that Jesus is the son of God, the virgin birth, the fact that Jesus was crucified and rose on the third day....you know the things I am talking about. Whether or not Jesus returned in 70 A.D. or is coming some time in future is not something we need to hang our salvation on. It just really doesn't matter when you look at the big picture.
Again, please don't take this the wrong way. I just thought this thread was getting a bit heated and felt the need to post and hopefully give you all something to think about.
Thanks Deb in VA, but I don't consider myself to be a Christian.
Um...ok. Call yourself whatever you like but that wasn't the point of my post and I'm pretty sure you're aware of that.
I don't want to take this too far off topic but according to the American Heritage Dictionary, the suffix "ian" means "one relating to, belonging to, or resembling". Knowing that, I have no problem referring to myself as a Christian.
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at hand
