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I don't know the validity of that statement but I would wager that it's not that some people find it immoral but concentrate too much on the physical aspect of gay relationships and since it's not their orientation they can't rationalize it or understand it. You fear what you don't understand.
So if I fear nothing then I must know everything, no it doesnt work that way. I do not fear the homosexuals but I do pray for them.
Pascal's Wager was the argument that Blaise Pascal used for believing in God. He basically said, what could it hurt? If there is no God, then you wasted nothing by believing. If there is a God, then by believing, you only benifit yourself.
Personally, I do not like this wager very much. Though it may seem like the "safest" choice to believe in God, I really think that there is something not covered; especially when considering a Christian God.
The problem arises from the fact that individual chooses to believe in God because it is "best for them". I think that a Christian God would not really view this person in a favorable light. Essentially the individual is for the lack of a better description, "covering their behind"; which I consider selfish. More importantly, I feel it may help someone "feel good about themselves" but it really does not answer the question to whether or not God exists. Also, when I make my decision I would want the reason to be because it is true, not because it is best for me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTO Luv
If I don't believe God is real why waste my time just to cover my ass when I die? Plus there are many things in christianity I don't agree with and want no part of just to hedge a bet.
Though I understand your point of view, I also do not want to believe something not to be true because I do not agree with it. If God exists, absolute truth exists; whether or not I agree with it will not change it.
Some may argue that we can not understand God (if he exists) by using logic, however I feel that He would have not given it to us unless it could be used to understand Him/Her/It. This is also assuming God wants a personal relation with us or wants us to understand him.
Last edited by Ajeck; 12-09-2008 at 03:06 PM..
Reason: extra thought
I'm glad that I met the Lord as a young adult. I know the exact moment that my life was changed by the power of the Holy Spirit.
There is no doubt in my mind that God is real.
Growing up in church does not mean that you're a christian.
Ajeck here's my advice to you and you can follow either variation.
Don't do to others what you do not want done to you
OR
Do to/for others what you would like done to/for you.
Then enjoy your life (within responsible fashion) without all the bag of rituals and cartwheels to please some imaginary being people have shaped into their own image since time began. You will find this relatively short life we live much easier to deal with.
I'm glad that I met the Lord as a young adult. I know the exact moment that my life was changed by the power of the Holy Spirit.
There is no doubt in my mind that God is real.
Growing up in church does not mean that you're a christian.
Becoming a christian is a choice....
Great post,I agree with you 100%,one does know through the power of the Holy Spirit how and when it changed their lives and that one wants God to be the main focus of their life.
Ajeck it is about the heart and wanting the Lord to be the main focus of your life and seeing how the Holy Spirit works through you once you receive Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour. Anyone can go to church,carry a Bible around,have the appearance of a Christian,but until we accept Him as Lord and Saviour our hearts and mind are not right and we stay in a confused and unhappy state going off on tangents of other beliefs ,not knowing who to put our faith and trust in,but as Christians know God through His Son Jesus Christ is the only way.
Before I get into the main topic, I suppose a little background is needed.
Pretty much every member of my family is a Christian. My parents raised me as a Roman Catholic and my uncle is Pastor at a Protestant Church. So all my life I was surrounded by those who believed in a Christian God. Before going to college, I honestly felt like I had some sort of relationship with God. I prayed everyday, went to Church essentially every Sunday, took part in youth groups, etc.
However, during the past few years I have begun seriously doubting my faith. I've spent the last year or two trying to resolve these doubts (reading apologetic, taking philosophy of religion, being part of the Christian community at my school, praying for an answer) yet with each attempt it seems to be getting worse. I understand that some will probably say "this may be a time to test and strengthen your faith" or "maybe you did not have faith originally"; however, I really do not find solace in such responses if that's all they have to offer.
I believe the main problem is that because I was raised in a Christian environment I was not presented with any alternative. Now that I am in a more "eclectic" one, I am allowed to entertain alternative views. Like many Christians I used to strongly believe that "Jesus was the only way"; yet, this same type of sincerity can be found in other faiths. Since I try to the best of my ability not to be a dense or naive person, I can no longer just simply say "well that belief is wrong." What makes them wrong and what makes Christians right?
The one thing I am truely aware of is a being's capacity to deceive oneself. I don't want to say I believe because the purely Bible says it to be true; just because one believes something doesn't make it any more true. If that was the only reason I would be essentially "tricking" myself into having faith; more specifically blind faith. I can also see this happening to individuals who practice other faiths.
I still go to Church regularly, however if this doubt continues, I can see myself becoming a "fake" or "dead" Christian as I would continue to go just be because it "makes me feel good" or "I should go just because."
I know that there are others out there that have had similar experiences; as I know what I am going through is most likely not unique, and would like to hear from them. However I ask... Please, do not just post scripture and tell me to take it at face value... it is not helpful.
Also, if there are any questions feel free to ask and I will try to answer them.
The wind you can not see but you know it is there, you can not see your brain or heart but without them you would be dead.Some thing are to be accepted by faith.It is a great accomplishment for Satan, when Christians more so than others to stop believing in God,I know he has attacked me severely at times with all kinds of situations,God always pulls me out.Do not let Satan lie to you rebuke him and he must flee.Their were times that I thought God had forsaken me but He never did I believe that Gad allows things to happen to test our FAITH,I know it is hard at times but keep your eyes on God resist the devil and continually pray.I will pray for you in this.Stay strong in Christ.1Peter5:8,
I figure I should follow up on this topic as I’ve come to a decision in the past week.
So since my last post I’ve continually examined scriptures, prayed and asked others for guidance. Though I can say I do have better knowledge of the subject, I still do not feel like I have progressed in strengthening my faith in a Christian God.
With such doubts I feel like I am lying to myself as well as others if I make the claim: “I am Christian”. I do not truly believe as I used to. I understand some think this doubt is “because of the Devil”. Taking such an approach means that every strand of doubt or analysis of faith is caused by Devil. More importantly… how can I trust a single thought I have if that is possible? I refuse to believe that a creator would not allow us to come to know him through attributes he has given us… such as logic. I would hope that doubt would be encouraged by a Christian God in order for us to truly get to know Him instead of blindly follow “what you are told”.
So after reading Matthew 7:7-8 I came to a final decision.
Quote:
"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; those who seek find; and to those who knock, the door will be opened.
The words ‘seek and you will find’ kept running through my head. I thought to myself... “I am seeking… if the Christian God is the true then I will eventually find the truth.”
Frankly I don’t know what I believe anymore… but I can't force myself to believe something that I don’t.
I figure I should follow up on this topic as I’ve come to a decision in the past week.
So since my last post I’ve continually examined scriptures, prayed and asked others for guidance. Though I can say I do have better knowledge of the subject, I still do not feel like I have progressed in strengthening my faith in a Christian God.
With such doubts I feel like I am lying to myself as well as others if I make the claim: “I am Christian”. I do not truly believe as I used to. I understand some think this doubt is “because of the Devil”. Taking such an approach means that every strand of doubt or analysis of faith is caused by Devil. More importantly… how can I trust a single thought I have if that is possible? I refuse to believe that a creator would not allow us to come to know him through attributes he has given us… such as logic. I would hope that doubt would be encouraged by a Christian God in order for us to truly get to know Him instead of blindly follow “what you are told”.
So after reading Matthew 7:7-8 I came to a final decision.
The words ‘seek and you will find’ kept running through my head. I thought to myself... “I am seeking… if the Christian God is the true then I will eventually find the truth.”
Frankly I don’t know what I believe anymore… but I can't force myself to believe something that I don’t.
OK you say that God should be able to show Himself with logic, I can agree with that. Logically according to statistics evolution on the scale it would take for even a cell to be created would be impossible within the time period the most liberal scientists give the world and the universe. Logically moral standards would be impossible to develope without an intellegent designer(God). Logically it would be impossible for this planet to have had the perfect amosphere, vegitation, minerals, nutrients, sunlight, time line(day and night) to produce or sustain life without and intellegent designer (God). Logically you would have no desire for the truth fi there was no one to set the standards for what is the truth. I hope this helps in your search for the truth.
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