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Since I quit following man and his own religions, which come from his own thoughts, interpretations, pride and arrogance, I have found so much peace ..
I don't need the security of a label from the different denominations of religion any more..
I don't depend on a you-tube message or the televangelists for my spiritual food anymore..
The Holy Spirit now leads me through scripture instead of all the commentaries, different versions, and different articles I used to depend on for my knowledge..
He has enabled me to have a closer relationship with my creator through His Son..
When this thread first began, I searched Calvin and imo, he was not a nice person at all..
Even Paul admonished the early Church not to call themselves followers of any man..
As far as the op's question goes about sharing the Gospel..Yes I believe a calvinist or anyone who is born of the spirit can share the Gospel (the good news of Christ)..But there is a way of sharing without insulting, harrassment or meaningless arguements with other Christian brothers and sisters of a different denomination over scripture..
The best way of sharing is by showing Christ in you with your words, deeds and life you live, along with sincere, humble answers to questions..
Christ came to build the Church, not to divide it up into different groups headed by a man such as Calvin or any of the others..
Fundy, it seems to me that we can get so caught up with defending an religion/sect that it can take away from the gospel (GOOD NEWS).
Should Calvinists preach their interpretation of the "gospel" ........... should Catholics preach their interpretation ......... JWs .......... Arminians? - or should we seek truth and God for ourselves and not getting totally caught in interpretations?
What the person in the video was saying is contradictory - from what I can gather calvinists believe that God has elected/chosen some to salvation and the rest he will torment eternally. The person in the video says they send themselves to hell because they do not believe. To me one negates the other if God chooses the elect and does not choose the rest then the rest do not have a choice.
If the reason they go to hell is because God did not elect/choose them that means God has sent them to hell and it is not because they did not choose God (salvation is in their hands)
Fundy, it seems to me that we can get so caught up with defending an religion/sect that it can take away from the gospel (GOOD NEWS).
Should Calvinists preach their interpretation of the "gospel" ........... should Catholics preach their interpretation ......... JWs .......... Arminians? - or should we seek truth and God for ourselves and not getting totally caught in interpretations?
What the person in the video was saying is contradictory - from what I can gather calvinists believe that God has elected/chosen some to salvation and the rest he will torment eternally. The person in the video says they send themselves to hell because they do not believe. To me one negates the other if God chooses the elect and does not choose the rest then the rest do not have a choice.
If the reason they go to hell is because God did not elect/choose them that means God has sent them to hell and it is not because they did not choose God (salvation is in their hands)
Actually He is not contradicting himself, you are are contradicting him from your own interpretation. He is only going from what he reads in scripture, we do not try to fill in the blanks like you are. Are there things that are hard to understand? yes, are there things hard to stomach? double yes, but that is not for us to decide what is right or wrong; good or bad because we can't we are a fallen creation; we are perverted and warped in our understanding of what makes God good separate from scripture. Calvinist don't bring God to our level and understanding, we go to His level and understanding and much we can't understand because if we did then we would be God.
We can only go from what is in scripture, if he is guilty then He is only guilty of what He sees in scripture with no presupposition other than God does everything for His glory.
Calvinist don't bring God to our level and understanding, we go to His level and understanding and much we can't understand because if we did then we would be God.
You have got to be kidding
Your following quote proves you try and bring God down to your own understanding.
"What no refute for the interpretation of your verse? just the world means the world? so when I tell my friend, the world is going to bow at his feet because he really put on a great performance, that means every person on the planet?"
God is not vague concering His word or exaggerates what He means , God would never tell your friend the whole world was going to bow at his feet unless it was going to happen.
His word accomplishes that which it was sent for. His word means what it says.
Actually He is not contradicting himself, you are are contradicting him from your own interpretation. He is only going from what he reads in scripture, we do not try to fill in the blanks like you are. Are there things that are hard to understand? yes, are there things hard to stomach? double yes, but that is not for us to decide what is right or wrong; good or bad because we can't we are a fallen creation; we are perverted and warped in our understanding of what makes God good separate from scripture. Calvinist don't bring God to our level and understanding, we go to His level and understanding and much we can't understand because if we did then we would be God.
We can only go from what is in scripture, if he is guilty then He is only guilty of what He sees in scripture with no presupposition other than God does everything for His glory.
From what I can see calvinists, arminians, catholics, baptists, JW's etc, etc have all got their conflicting theories from scripture and you seem to be saying that calvinists are the only ones who have the truth.
In scripture we are told that the natural man does not receive the things of God, If God chose the elect and gives them the ability to turn to him and not the rest then the rest can NOT choose God because God has not given them the ability - it is an impossibility.
An illustration:- If someone is blind no matter how much I tell them to see they are not going to be able to see.
When this thread first began, I searched Calvin and imo, he was not a nice person at all..
I understand Martian Luther wasn't a such a nice guy either to the jewish people around him in his day. And I don't know if I read it here or on my own awhile back, but he was obessed toward the end of his life with the idea that the church then was "the beast" in revelations. And yes, the church was a crooked institution for sure, but did not pan out the way he thought it would! I don't know any thing about Calvin, but it just shows me that even inspired men are still men!
We know that the Bible says that Christ was slain before the foundations of the Earth. We know that not even the will of man or man's understanding of things can be more powerful than God's. (Or we may as well be God) well I think we all know how that would turn out which is why we aren't God.
Consider if you will..... There were two trees in the midst of the Garden. One of those trees was the tree of life (Jesus). The other was the tree of the Knowledge of good and evil. God told man that he could eat of every tree in the Garden except the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Now I find it a bit strange don't you that Adam didn't notice that of all the trees that he was able to partake of how God had separated a particular good tree from all the rest and yet placed it right next to the forbidden one. Now at this point some might naturally think Adam had a choice to pick from either tree. However, here lies the paradox.... had Adam been able to truly choose of his own so called free will then he would have partaken of the Tree of Life (Jesus) but it wasn't the appointed time then and Adam would have in a sense become like God and or eventually been accredited for having saved mankind in man's eye's. And then we wouldn't have the Son of God as our Saviour. And the Name of Jesus was to be the name above all names from the foundations of the earth.
Jesus was the second Adam. He came came to do what the first Adam failed and was never designed to do. And that was to do the will of the father. Whether the so called conventional free will of man exists or not why would one want to be subject to it. Jesus didn't do his own so called free will. But he did only the will of the Father. Having a free will is a not issue if you want to do the will of the father. Not my will but his be done...
To be truly free is to be in a place where one's will is free to do the will of the Father. That then if you can see would be True "Free" will. In order to be free to do that one must first have been given Faith which is a gift from God. And without that Gift from God a person will not even begin to realize or call on the name of Jesus.
Jesus said we must be born again. And that we were dead in our trespasses. Well a dead person doesn't breath, think, reason etc. a dead man has no free will he has nothing he is dead. However, because "Jesus" is the power of the resurrection and we are not we have hope. Hopefully we are born again and became new creatures in him as Jesus said we would become if we were born again.
God with his free will manifests his love/grace to us by giving us the gift of faith to believe in his only begotten Son. After that you will know them by they're fruit. Jesus would not have worn a bracelet with WWJD or WWID if he had worn a bracelet saying anything it would have been (Do the will of our/your father who is Heaven)
Jesus said there is "None" good but the father. So you see God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son and it pleased God to crush his own Son to accomplish the ultimate act of love.
Yes they told Adam he could have eaten of the tree of life before the fall but is very clear that it wasn't God's will that Adam do so because he states later in the next chapter that if they didn't kick Adam out of the Garden that Adam would have after his disobedience then partaken of the tree of a life and lived forever. There had to be death by Adam for us to understand and have life through Christ. Adam was designed to be A DAM to cut us off from God so we could be reconciled to the father through Christ and then truly understand the Grace and love of God and live forever like him.
If you forward to Ephesians Chapter 5 you may understand that this was all so that the Lord would be the one who would lay his life down for his bride so that he would present "Her" to "Himself" spotless and without wrinkle.
The woman is referred to as the weaker vessel throughout scripture. The woman is an analogy of the church/bride of Christ. She could not save herself so because he loved her so much he freely gave himself for her.
After she receives from God the revelation/gift of Faith in Jesus (Tree of Life) she is then able to partake of/understands what her lover has done for her. That which she could not have done on her own because she was dead in sin. Now if one is truly saved you will know them by they're fruit. Fruit of the Holy Spirit. They will be in the world but not of it. A truly saved person will not act like the world. Will not watch things on TV that God would disapprove of or live the lifestyle of the world.
Be a bondservant of the enemy your father the devil or a bondservant of the Father in Heaven through Christ. You cannot serve two masters. But perhaps if God loved you enough to save you from yourself and your depraved state you may someday finds yourself so humbled and happy that he first loved you before you could have loved him and realize that this age old argument has left a field of division and broken bones. The bible said that not one bone of the body of Christ would be broken......hundreds of years later when he was crucified not one bone was broken. (Inspite of Roman customs)
We are supposed to be bone of his bones and flesh of his flesh. So in a spiritual sense we as a body (his body) are not supposed to be broken, arguing etc. So I would encourage us all to consider that we aren't supposed to be broken. Be careful with passing judgement. Be careful when being critical. Suffer the little ones to come unto him and don't forget we should all be walking in fear and trembling for if it wasn't for the Grace of God we would have no Jesus and no hope.
"In Love as best as I currently know how. May the Lord keep you and reveal his love upon you forever" T
Location: Comunistafornia, and working to get out ASAP!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Blue
Since I quit following man and his own religions, which come from his own thoughts, interpretations, pride and arrogance, I have found so much peace ..
I don't need the security of a label from the different denominations of religion any more..
I don't depend on a you-tube message or the televangelists for my spiritual food anymore..
The Holy Spirit now leads me through scripture instead of all the commentaries, different versions, and different articles I used to depend on for my knowledge..
He has enabled me to have a closer relationship with my creator through His Son..
When this thread first began, I searched Calvin and imo, he was not a nice person at all..
Even Paul admonished the early Church not to call themselves followers of any man..
As far as the op's question goes about sharing the Gospel..Yes I believe a calvinist or anyone who is born of the spirit can share the Gospel (the good news of Christ)..But there is a way of sharing without insulting, harrassment or meaningless arguements with other Christian brothers and sisters of a different denomination over scripture..
The best way of sharing is by showing Christ in you with your words, deeds and life you live, along with sincere, humble answers to questions..
Christ came to build the Church, not to divide it up into different groups headed by a man such as Calvin or any of the others..
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