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Also your numbers do not include the actual square miles. NYC for instance has data pushing micro densities over 200K in the way you are using them for Atlanta. The ppsquare miles is useless without the actual square miles it covers.
Usually when people list it, they include the square miles. For instance certain neighborhoods, or boroughs.
Just a comparison, since you want to play with numbers
let us put things in perspective b/c OBVIOUSLY people on this board are not getting it and why so many people think Atlanta is well, just not urban by a lot of peoples standards
Atlanta is population 540,000 people in 131 square miles. Giving it a density of 4,000 people per square mile to achieve a little over half a million folks.
Let's see how Manhattan can surpass that... to see the MASSIVE difference in the makeup of the cities.
Manhattan community districts 6, 7, 8 is 560,000 people ... in 5.3 square miles with a density of 105,000 people per square mile.
So what it takes for Atlanta to achieve half a million people 120 or so square miles, New York can do it in under 5.
This means that at the level of half a million people, which is a pretty good critical mass, NYC is almost 25X MORE CONCENTRATED.
Chicago can achieve this in under 20. San Francisco and Philadelphia are not far behind, and might even be ahead as well!
Is this stuff starting to get through your heads? Do you see why a lot of people just don't consider Atlanta urban? Especially since you are comparing cities IN THE SAME COUNTRY. So by U.S. standards, Atlanta is just not that urban, sorry. ATLANTA IS ONLY "urban" BY GEORGIA STANDARDS. The numbers do not lie, only people do.
As usual the Census infomation means nothing when it comes to Atlanta. That data is 10 years old and much of the info you find when looking through Census tables often is. When it comes to Atlanta, 10 year old info is completely useless. Do you realize how much Atlanta has grown in that time? It's like a whole other city larger than Boston or Baltimore has been added to it's Metro since then. Much of that growth has been intown adding to it's density.
When it comes to Atlanta you're likely going to have to dig into your pockets and pay a marketing firm to give you half way accurate info. and even then we are talking estimates. Otherwise it's wait until the next Census figures come out and you will see info drastically different from what you saw on the last Census.
Galounger, good post. Atlanta certainly has similar "amenities" that NYC does, at the same level of quality I am sure. What it doesn't offer is the same "city life" in terms of lifestyle.
When people make them out to be the same lifestyle, that is when things get fuzzy, and people question their motives.
Atlanta would do better promoting itself as what it is. Great amenities, restaurants, night life, more space, and a lower cost of living.
However, if you want "city life" like something like NYC, Chicago, SF...Atlanta is just not going to fare well.
As usual the Census infomation means nothing when it comes to Atlanta. That data is 10 years old and much of the info you find when looking through Census tables often is. When it comes to Atlanta, 10 year old info is completely useless. Do you realize how much Atlanta has grown in that time? It's like a whole other city larger than Boston or Baltimore has been added to it's Metro since then. Much of that growth has been intown adding to it's density.
That is the only accurate data, even if were to use new data, the stats would be similar.
I love how census information means nothing for atlanta, but every other city has to play by the rules. righttt
Please run the 2009 census estimate numbers then if you think they are so "innacurate" and somehow misrepresenting Atlanta. They aren't. But you won't run those #'s will you, b/c it will show you the same thing.
*crickets*
Why can't you address my post instead of getting on a tangent and trying to dismiss it.
"A whole other city as large as Boston" ... Paraphrased >>> The population of Boston has been dispersed over the Atlanta metro in a primarily suburban environment.
You guys aren't fooling any body, we have the #'s, and we have been to the city. Please just stop. Atlanta does not defy the laws of physics, and no cherry picking or outright non disclosure of data is going to support it.
That is the only accurate data, even if were to use new data, the stats would be similar.
I love how census information means nothing for atlanta, but every other city has to play by the rules. righttt
Please run the 2009 census estimate numbers then if you think they are so "innacurate" and somehow misrepresenting Atlanta. They aren't. But you won't run those #'s will you, b/c it will show you the same thing.
*crickets*
Why can't you address my post instead of getting on a tangent and trying to dismiss it.
"A whole other city as large as Boston" ... Paraphrased >>> The population of Boston has been dispersed over the Atlanta metro in a primarily suburban environment.
I won't run those numbers because I long long time ago stated that Buckhead is no where near as dense as Hoboken. But that doesn't keep it from offering many urban amenities that Hoboken has and many you can't even find in Hoboken. Also much of this stuff is within walking distance if you live in the most built up areas.
I've said this over and over and over and over!!!! as have other Atlanta posters. But you just aren't listening!!
I won't run those numbers because I long long time ago stated that Buckhead is no where near as dense as Hoboken. But that doesn't keep it from offering many urban amenities that Hoboken has and many you can't even find in Hoboken. Also much of this stuff is within walking distance if you live in the most built up areas.
I've said this over and over and over and over!!!! as have other Atlanta posters. But you just aren't listening!!
Why not?? You just claimed my numbers are useless. Don't you want some useful data? Oh wait, my numbers are EXTREMELY useful and you already know if you did run the numbers not much is going to change. Feel free to use my data.
That is the only accurate data, even if were to use new data, the stats would be similar.
[quote]
Quote:
I love how census information means nothing for atlanta, but every other city has to play by the rules. righttt
Please run the 2009 census estimate numbers then if you think they are so "innacurate" and somehow misrepresenting Atlanta. They aren't. But you won't run those #'s will you, b/c it will show you the same thing.
*crickets*
Why can't you address my post instead of getting on a tangent and trying to dismiss it.
"A whole other city as large as Boston" ... Paraphrased >>> The population of Boston has been dispersed over the Atlanta metro in a primarily suburban environment.
You guys aren't fooling any body, we have the #'s, and we have been to the city. Please just stop. Atlanta does not defy the laws of physics, and no cherry picking or outright non disclosure of data is going to support it.
Now let's listen to Crickets while we wait for you to show me how Hoboken's nightlife compares to this or how their restaraunts stack up or shopping. IF all that mattered in urban living was density then the slums of Bangladesh would have better urban living than New York City. How about you show me something Hoboken has besides density.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galounger
Since the name of this thread is actually city life and Access and not "which city is the most crowded and looks more urban?" I thought it would be fun to explore a topic more along the original question.
Buckhead probably doesn't offer as many bars as Hoboken since it got rid of many of them but it still offers pretty good night life. I can only wonder how Hoboken compares since I've only been there once and all I have to go on is what my sister that used to live in Bayonne has to say about it. I think Buckhead's night clubs might be better while Hoboken wins with bars.
Here's some scenes of nightlife or the bar scene in Buckhead recently. The same way Hobokeners can get more nightlife by crossing into Manhattan Buckhead residents can get a lot more by traveling a couple miles down to Midtown and Downtown as well as some of the burbs.
I looked into Hoboken's bars and nightclubs. There are a couple of decent techno clubs but other than that it's just bars. I imagine most in Hoboken have to go to New York to do more than chug drinks. This kind of thing has to do with urban living as well.
Why not?? You just claimed my numbers are useless. Don't you want some useful data? Oh wait, my numbers are EXTREMELY useful and you already know if you did run the numbers not much is going to change. Feel free to use my data.
I was refering to spending time to look up 2009 estimates. And you know as well as me that 10 year old census info. when talking about Atlanta is as obsolete as a 20 year old cell phone.
The ego of some Atlanta posters is so wrapped up in their own city that data sets are completely illogical! It's obvious I can't have a logical discussion with you, because you are hell bent on boosting Atlanta no matter what numbers I could possibly come up with. I'm not interested in subjectivity.
PS my 540k number is the 2009 census estimate already...
Quote:
Atlanta is population 540,000 people in 131 square miles. Giving it a density of 4,000 people per square mile to achieve a little over half a million folks.
so not sure why you are talking of 2000 census data. I never used it to run my own numbers. I can certainly go back to using 2000 census data numbers however if you wish, but Atlanta will not fare better of course.
The ego of some Atlanta posters is so wrapped up in their own city that data sets are completely illogical! It's obvious I can't have a logical discussion with you, because you are hell bent on boosting Atlanta no matter what numbers I could possibly come up with.
The OP asked which city offers better Urban Living not which has more Urban translated by you into more dense living. I never participated in this density match in the first place. If your formula of More Density= Better Urban Living was true then the South Bronx or the Cabrinni Green projects of Chicago offer better urban living than Downtown Seattle or the Backbay in Boston which is ridiculous. I'm just trying to get back to the original question that was so terribly derailed and hijacked by density fiends like yourself. Which city offers the bestCity living.
Or as I stated before.
Now let's listen to Crickets while we wait for you to show me how Hoboken's nightlife compares to this or how their restaraunts stack up or shopping. IF all that mattered in urban living was density then the slums of Bangladesh would have better urban living than New York City. How about you show me something Hoboken has besides density
The OP asked which city offers better Urban Living not which has more Urban translated by you into more dense living. I never participated in this density match in the first place. If your formula of More Density= Better Urban Living was true then the South Bronx or the Cabrinni Green projects of Chicago offer better urban living than Downtown Seattle or the Backbay in Boston which is ridiculous. I'm just trying to get back to the original question that was so terribly derailed and hijacked by density fiends like yourself. Which city offers the bestCity living.
Or as I stated before.
Now let's listen to Crickets while we wait for you to show me how Hoboken's nightlife compares to this or how their restaraunts stack up or shopping. IF all that mattered in urban living was density then the slums of Bangladesh would have better urban living than New York City. How about you show me something Hoboken has besides density
I'm Waiting
key word access, it is next to manhattan, game over.
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