Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
for many applications UX is the most important part, and often software developers get it wrong. you make it sound like it's just drag and drop of some text boxes and buttons
why would it shock you that a graduate from the #1 ranked school computer science school in the country would be well paid in this field?
i'm sure those who focus on HCI at berkeley and go to work for apple or another silicon valley company have similar starting salaries
If I wanted to do CS, then the choice would have been CMU. Also, I know Berkeley grads from CS and EECS and they make that NOW after 13-15 years.
So, that starting salary is definitely a bit of stretch with just a bachelors. But the top students from those programs can probably get it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SOON2BNSURPRISE
Other things that you want to do that are noble and good for the world can be better done when you have a large income or at least have the basics out of the way. I know engineers making six figure incomes. My wifes cousin makes $200,000 a year as a ME. Lets say that you took that path and became an engineer. (Not sure about the outsourcing as I know lots of them that are working) Lets say that you worked your way up and were making a good 6 figure income. Your plan is to save the world so you work hard, invest your money and retire early. You spend the remainder of your life saving the environment, writing a book, or finding a cure for cancer.
LOL! at Mechanical Engineers making 200K a year!
We've told you this over and over. That's an anomaly. You probably have a better chance of starting your own business with only a HS degree and making that amount than as a Mechanical Engineer with a pHd working for somebody.
We've told you this over and over. That's an anomaly. You probably have a better chance of starting your own business with only a HS degree and making that amount than as a Mechanical Engineer with a pHd working for somebody.
Not sure. She has a Masters and is an ME. The people that she works with make that kind of money as well. I know others making in the 6 figures with ME's. On top of that So Cal is not the only place that ME's or EE's can make the big bucks. Other parts of the nation are paying that kind of money. Granted these may not be people that are fresh off the College band wagon, still the potential is there for someone to make that kind of money.
On top of that many places like where I work hire ME's to run major facilities and the pay starts in the $150K range. I know some facility managers with either an ME, EE or even a CE that bring in six figures. The director of my department brings in $225K. You can't even get one of those jobs without some kind of Enginering degree.
If you are good at methematics you can look into other areas where that field applies - one that immediately comes ot mind is Actuarial Science. Actuaries make very good $ and don't bust their hump as bad as other people who make the same $. It's different then Engineering but I wouldn't say it's more exciting.
You make your own excitement and creativity in your career. Sure, some are more amenable than others but yes, even engineers, accountants, actuaries, etc. do exciting things and even artists do boring things. Much of it has to do with who you work with and the types of projects you apply your knowledge to.
This fall, I will be starting college. I got into CCNY's engineering program, but I am definitely not enthralled by the idea majoring in engineering. I applied because my parents say my strengths lie in math and science, and that those skills are what make money. My initial plan was to major in environmental engineering, because I would get to be outside often and possibly help with reversing climate change. Noble motive, indeed.
However, I don't have fun trying to find tangents, or finding atomic masses to the nearest thousandth, or calculating the energy of a spring. I wouldn't go as far as to say I hate those subjects, but they do bore me more than a typical engineering major should be.
Ugh, I HATE it when parents are picking their kid's major and practically forcing them into it. I know there are quite a few parents on this board, but seriously, this is one of the most detrimental thing a parent could do to their child. On the same note, OP, you're an adult and you shouldn't let your parents pick and choose what you should be doing for the rest of your life.
Before going on to what you want to do in the future, we have to look at what you're doing now. Do you even like what you're doing now? Are you miserable? Do you see yourself doing this for nearly the rest of your adult life? This isn't a question that can be answered based on a few classes. I would research some actual careers, maybe shadow someone for a bit, and base your decision on that.
All I can say is that I don't care if I was getting paid $200K+ a year, if the job makes me miserable and I hate it, I'm not touching it. Find out what's important to you. For me, yes, being financially secure is important, but I don't need a McMansion in the 'burbs, I don't need a fancy car, I don't need vacation homes in other states. Plenty of people lead successful, fulfilled lives on $50K a year and plenty of people couldn't pull this off on $500K a year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DemureDoll
Conversely, a lot of my enjoyment comes from storytelling. Novel writing, animation, film-making, song writing, take your pick. Just the idea of something I create affecting someone else on a deep level is just... I don't know, but I like it.
But the related college majors (English, art, film studies, music, etc.) are majors that statistically have higher unemployment. Even if you do get a job, either you get some entry position that takes any college degree, or a low paying job that while related to your interests, doesn't pay the bills. (I don't want to be a teacher, by the way; it's too socially demanding for an introverted person like myself. I know because I recently had a part time job as a teacher's assistant for a summer school.)
When I first went to college, I was a pre-veterinary major. Then I briefly switched over to nursing before dropping out of school for a couple of years. Last year, I graduated w/ a BA in writing and television. No, I'm not doing great financially, I don't own a car or a condo or have stocks anywhere. Do I regret my decision? No. Well, I do regret not taking on more technical, computer based courses like TV production or web design where I could have played around with the Adobe Suite and Final Draft. Otherwise, I have no regrets. I got the spiel from family members about what can I do w/ a writing degree, got it every year when I visited home. My answer to them was basically "a lot of things". Getting such a degree doesn't mean you have to teach or write. You have other options if you know how to apply your skills to other jobs.
Before you pursue a career in the arts, you need to do a little more soul searching as this above paragraph comes off as very vague. Pick a field you want to focus on and research different ways you could apply the skills you learn in this major in other jobs. Most importantly, let go of any preconceived notions or ideas that your first job out of college will relate to your field of study. That first job is less about jumping into your dream field and more about making ends meet while you further develop yourself as an artist. I work a retail job and while I'm not making the big bucks, the job is so brainless that it allowed me time to work on my art at home, something I know I wouldn't be able to do if I had to work a stressful, hated, full time job instead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DemureDoll
People talk about how engineering gets outsourced, which is true. However, I'd say a larger percentage animation gets outsourced. I'd also say that a lot of people are competing to become authors, or animators, or anything creative, really. I haven't heard about rampant competition for engineering jobs in the states, which leads me to conclude that getting a job, regardless of pay, isn't too challenging.
I guess my question is this: should I pursue a creative major in college, or should I stick to engineering (or something else with low unemployment), and keep my storytelling passion as a hobby?
Or hey, maybe suggest a third option for me. I would greatly appreciate some insight.
Thanks for reading.
EDIT: I noticed my thread title has a grammar error. Sorry about that.
I think when it comes to the arts, there is no real direct competition. I personally don't need to worry about someone out there writing a story exactly like mine, don't need to worry about, for example, finishing up my young adult, post apocalyptic Romeo & Juliet story and getting it published before someone else finishes their young adult, post apocalyptic Romeo and Juliet story. In the past, most of the major competition stemmed from the fact that major publishing houses could only publish so many books a year. With the advent of self publishing, the competition isn't as fierce as it used to be. The same could be said for music, film, and even television in that you don't need that middle man as much and can just distribute your art to the masses via the internet.
Still, working in the arts is about 30% actually working on your art, 30% networking, and 40% marketing and enhancing your skills. Since graduating, I've spent a bit of change going to writing conventions, bars, alumni meetings, bookstore readings, and open mics, along with paying to build and maintain my site. It's not easy work and you'll have to break through that introverted shell if you want to succeed (I'm introverted, shy, and suffer from anxiety and trust me, a lot of that melts away when you are in a room full of like minded people talking about "the craft"!).
So my third suggestion to you would be to maybe take a break from schooling and take time to discover what you really want to do-not what your parents want you to do, not what some article on Yahoo says you should do- and regroup later on. Look into ways on blending what you enjoy to do and whatever STEM skills you have b/c this may be a bit of an untapped market.
I think it depends. I just graduated from college and I've known people who have creative degrees get really awesome jobs because they are truly talented and networked really well, while I've seen finance majors who were only "so-so" not get jobs for months... and I've also seen the people with arts degrees move home, wait for a year, then go to law school (even though they didn't really want to) because they didn't know what else to do.
I think that if you want a creative degree, you should go to a university that has a college of art/art school/department that's really well known and has an outstanding reputation. I believe that will help you network.
Ugh, I HATE it when parents are picking their kid's major and practically forcing them into it. I know there are quite a few parents on this board, but seriously, this is one of the most detrimental thing a parent could do to their child. On the same note, OP, you're an adult and you shouldn't let your parents pick and choose what you should be doing for the rest of your life.
It's mostly because they care about their kids. In some cases, it's because they want their kids to enter a prestigious career so they can brag to their friends, but by and large, the parents who push their kids towards well paying fields do so because they want their kids to be HAPPY.
And it's because they are OLDER and WISER and know that having a stable living is important for getting things that can make us happy. Parents who don't care about their kids could care less what they majored in.
Case in point. I have a friend whose mom pushed him into Pharmacy. He hated it with a passion. He had no interest in it and it's a difficult major. Now, in his mid 30s, he works for CVS (or Walgreens), has made bank for over a decade despite being a party animal and fairly irresponsible for much of that time, and his mom was telling mine he was so glad that his mom pushed, because he never would have finished otherwise. Now, he has a house, nice cars, and a cute wife.
Not sure. She has a Masters and is an ME. The people that she works with make that kind of money as well. I know others making in the 6 figures with ME's. On top of that So Cal is not the only place that ME's or EE's can make the big bucks. Other parts of the nation are paying that kind of money. Granted these may not be people that are fresh off the College band wagon, still the potential is there for someone to make that kind of money.
On top of that many places like where I work hire ME's to run major facilities and the pay starts in the $150K range. I know some facility managers with either an ME, EE or even a CE that bring in six figures. The director of my department brings in $225K. You can't even get one of those jobs without some kind of Enginering degree.
I don't doubt you, but it's not typical. Even for MEs or CEs who move into upper management, they usually make less.
The guy 2nd in charge at my last firm made 150K and it's a huge, well know firm in engineering.
It's mostly because they care about their kids. In some cases, it's because they want their kids to enter a prestigious career so they can brag to their friends, but by and large, the parents who push their kids towards well paying fields do so because they want their kids to be HAPPY.
And it's because they are OLDER and WISER and know that having a stable living is important for getting things that can make us happy. Parents who don't care about their kids could care less what they majored in.
Case in point. I have a friend whose mom pushed him into Pharmacy. He hated it with a passion. He had no interest in it and it's a difficult major. Now, in his mid 30s, he works for CVS (or Walgreens), has made bank for over a decade despite being a party animal and fairly irresponsible for much of that time, and his mom was telling mine he was so glad that his mom pushed, because he never would have finished otherwise. Now, he has a house, nice cars, and a cute wife.
Unfortunately, $ is important in this world.
You can care about your kids with dictating such an important decision. What next, picking their spouse? Hell, there are people in some countries where arranged marriages are still common that could post something similar to the above. Using that argument, you might as well pick your child's career, spouse, and child rearing methods because that are, ahem, "older and wiser".
You have 18 years of making important decisions for your kids. If you did something right, you shouldn't need to dictate what college major they should pick or what career to pursue. Even if the kid messes up, chooses to major in acting or whatever and is bagging groceries as a result, it's still their life, their stumbles to make. There's a BIG difference between offering your child guidance and forcing their hand.
I tutored at both of my colleges and I SWEAR, some of the most miserable students I encountered were the kids majoring in something they didn't want to major in like accounting and the kids at my art school who were more or less disowned for pursuing an art career (this was especially common among my Asian students, one of whom was sent into a major depression spell b/c her parents disowned her when she dropped out of the state college and transferred to pursue fashion studies). I've seen first hand how much these students either disliked their chosen major or disliked their parents for not supporting them in any way when they changed majors.
Money may be important, but I don't need nice cars, don't need a big house in the burbs. Money is important but I for one will not trade in a big paycheck for personal happiness (of course, plenty of people are happy and making big bucks, but this is referring more to the OP's predicament).
You can care about your kids with dictating such an important decision. What next, picking their spouse? Hell, there are people in some countries where arranged marriages are still common that could post something similar to the above. Using that argument, you might as well pick your child's career, spouse, and child rearing methods because that are, ahem, "older and wiser".
You have 18 years of making important decisions for your kids. If you did something right, you shouldn't need to dictate what college major they should pick or what career to pursue. Even if the kid messes up, chooses to major in acting or whatever and is bagging groceries as a result, it's still their life, their stumbles to make. There's a BIG difference between offering your child guidance and forcing their hand.
I tutored at both of my colleges and I SWEAR, some of the most miserable students I encountered were the kids majoring in something they didn't want to major in like accounting and the kids at my art school who were more or less disowned for pursuing an art career (this was especially common among my Asian students, one of whom was sent into a major depression spell b/c her parents disowned her when she dropped out of the state college and transferred to pursue fashion studies). I've seen first hand how much these students either disliked their chosen major or disliked their parents for not supporting them in any way when they changed majors.
Money may be important, but I don't need nice cars, don't need a big house in the burbs. Money is important but I for one will not trade in a big paycheck for personal happiness (of course, plenty of people are happy and making big bucks, but this is referring more to the OP's predicament).
Nobody can 'force' you into doing anything. These parents are just pushing in a certain direction. If that kid wants to pay his own tuition and major in fashion, then go for it. She can run off and join the national guard and nobody can stop her either.
I don't know how old you are, but I used to be just like you. Now, I realize that if I'm not a little smarter with my career decisions, I could be broke and alone in old age. You don't know how many people I've seen in their 50s in that predicament. All college educated, all who 'worked' their whole lives. Smart, practical career decisions are not even about being rich these days. It's just about having a roof over your head and food in your belly.
If I had listened to my parents, I wouldn't be worrying about any of that stuff. And I majored in something that most people would consider well paying and practical (but still not what they wanted). To be honest though, they really didn't even push me.
Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against people who want to take the gamble and do art, but neither do I have a problem with parents pushing their kids in practical directions ... none at all.
Well, on this I have to agree with the parents. Not many kids have the maturity and strength to sustain long periods of unemployment due to wrong major choice, not to mention the forethought to plan for their future. Decades ago, my dad steered me to Computer Science when all I wanted was to be a teacher. I remember the big fight we had over that but now I'm glad that he stuck to his guns on that issue. I'm now able to earn a more than decent living and use that money to pursue / buy other things I'm passionate about (those French artisan chocolates that I love, my travel to far flung places, etc).
The OP mentioned his / her interest in creative writing. Most writers have full time jobs in unrelated field before they are secure enough in their writing career to become full time writer. One of my most favorite authors was a geologist working for an oil company and used to write in between her oil digs until she sold several manuscripts and finally felt comfortable enough to quit her full time job to pursue writing full time. Another favorite author of mine that a few years ago hit No. 1 New York Times list was working in insurance company before she became full time writer. The OP can do the same if he/she is really passionate about writing.
Back to OP's original question about school major, I think Environment Engineering is a cool major. It has so many potentials for sub majors, and the most up & coming one is Energy (whether it's energy sustainability, life cycle energy, etc). Just know that this is not a major where you graduate and done. I mean, of course you can stop at Bachelor's degree but know that most people in this field have PhDs. In terms of potential employers, you can take your pick from commercial to federal sectors, or you can go to consulting route via well known consulting firms (Deloitte, etc).
Another area in Engineering to consider is Electrical Engneering, especially wireless.
I would not pursue the creative major, unless you are comfortable hussling for work all the time. Beginning of Rant - This is why this country is falling behind because so many kids prefer the easy majors. We need more kids in science & enginering majors. Heck, even Samsung has cornered Apple in terms of market share and their latest Samsung Galaxy is above and beyond Apple in terms of product innovation. - End of Rant
Last edited by graceC; 08-13-2013 at 01:38 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
