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Location: NY/NJ/CT Tri-state Area (Farmington Valley, CT)
12 posts, read 18,443 times
Reputation: 11
Rail and o/a transportation system mgt. abysmal in CT
The rail system (and overall transport system) in Connecticut clearly needs to be overhauled because,
A) traffic has gotten awful in the 95/Merritt, 91, and 84 corridors
B) the awful accidents this thread centers on
C) the ridiculous cost of Amtrack service between Hartford and anywhere else
D) slow, inefficient (and yet still apparently unsafe) train speeds
E) we should spur economic growth/retarding stagnation in the NOT Stamford cities of the above corridors
New York money is and always has been a boon to our state economically, and we should focus on funneling more of it deeper into the state with high-speed MNRR service extended to Hartford, and upgraded tracks for downstate areas and Shore Line East. It's ridiculous for our state to be focusing on useless busways that won't yield anything in terms of ROI, or even rail connections to Springfield as our state would definitely be on the giving end of that deal without much to receive. The current management of our mass transport is abysmal.
The state needs to stop excessive wasting of funding for "socially responsible" projects or illogical Hartford-centric regional projects (let's face it, as it stands, 21st century Hartford is no magnet for economic activity & growth). We must focus on the bigger picture in terms of transportation systems, and start at the least coming up with plans that confer some sort of fiscal/economic benefit to the state. If public works/publicly subsidized projects cannot turn a profit, there will be no more capital to fund anything "socially responsible."
Location: NY/NJ/CT Tri-state Area (Farmington Valley, CT)
12 posts, read 18,443 times
Reputation: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10
Those who know me, know that I ain't no Mlassof defender. His post was really to bring up an issue -- if conductors are in fact overpaid. His style was perfectly normal for a NY / CT fella. Get over it.
Couldn't have said it better myself. People are oversensitive to the point being made. With all due respect, the list of duties of commuter train conductors that Nexis posted do not seem difficult, nor seem to require great brain power or level of education to perform.
Necessary? Arguably, but a necessary occupation does not mean a lucrative one. Nor should it. Generally speaking, the most necessary of things are relatively easy to produce/provide service for (i.e. picking fruit, packaging goods, mailing crap, etc.).
The rail system (and overall transport system) in Connecticut clearly needs to be overhauled because,
A) traffic has gotten awful in the 95/Merritt, 91, and 84 corridors
B) the awful accidents this thread centers on
C) the ridiculous cost of Amtrack service between Hartford and anywhere else
D) slow, inefficient (and yet still apparently unsafe) train speeds
E) we should spur economic growth/retarding stagnation in the NOT Stamford cities of the above corridors
New York money is and always has been a boon to our state economically, and we should focus on funneling more of it deeper into the state with high-speed MNRR service extended to Hartford, and upgraded tracks for downstate areas and Shore Line East. It's ridiculous for our state to be focusing on useless busways that won't yield anything in terms of ROI, or even rail connections to Springfield as our state would definitely be on the giving end of that deal without much to receive. The current management of our mass transport is abysmal.
The state needs to stop excessive wasting of funding for "socially responsible" projects or illogical Hartford-centric regional projects (let's face it, as it stands, 21st century Hartford is no magnet for economic activity & growth). We must focus on the bigger picture in terms of transportation systems, and start at the least coming up with plans that confer some sort of fiscal/economic benefit to the state. If public works/publicly subsidized projects cannot turn a profit, there will be no more capital to fund anything "socially responsible."
The state is in the process of upgrading the New Haven-Hartford-Springfield line to provide commuter rail service on the corridor. The tracks between New Haven and Springfield are being expanded to provide double tracks so service can be implemented.
Also, in case you do not realize it, the world does not completely revolve around New York. Hartford is home to many major companies and is the largest employment center in the state. To dismiss a major transportation project like the busway that will serve this employment center as "useless" is just shortsighted and narrow minded. The costs of implementing rail service beyond existing corridors is unbelieveably expensive and takes years. Too many people are dismissing the busway before the service is even started. I suggest you research the history of the project to see why it is being built rather than just dismissing it. Jay
Amtrak is currently working on installing Fiber and moving cables off the track alignment, but I found this article about how the FED are not going to supply CT/MA with the money to continue building it. Right now they have some project from TIGER which are between $10M and $40 for adding platforms and such. Does anyone know if this is true?
The busway will serve a purpose when they start working on the viaduct in Hartford, but DOT won't know until 2017 what they will do, if anything. Then engineering, budget and issuing contracts. I don't see the viaduct in Hartford being built/repaired/replaced for at least another 10-15 years (completion time frame).
As a side note, I think I've mentioned this before, but I think it's ironic that the busway is being built so people can stop traveling the highways and ease up on congestion. Meanwhile, DOT just bought a parking garage in downtown Hartford (target area of the busway) for like $35M and it needs like $5M in upgrades and on top of that it was only assessed at $9? Not only does it contrictidut what they point of the project is, it is always financially backwards. And on top of all that, they don't own the land so they lease it from the City of Hartford for $3M a year.
Amtrak is currently working on installing Fiber and moving cables off the track alignment, but I found this article about how the FED are not going to supply CT/MA with the money to continue building it. Right now they have some project from TIGER which are between $10M and $40 for adding platforms and such. Does anyone know if this is true?
The busway will serve a purpose when they start working on the viaduct in Hartford, but DOT won't know until 2017 what they will do, if anything. Then engineering, budget and issuing contracts. I don't see the viaduct in Hartford being built/repaired/replaced for at least another 10-15 years (completion time frame).
As a side note, I think I've mentioned this before, but I think it's ironic that the busway is being built so people can stop traveling the highways and ease up on congestion. Meanwhile, DOT just bought a parking garage in downtown Hartford (target area of the busway) for like $35M and it needs like $5M in upgrades and on top of that it was only assessed at $9? Not only does it contrictidut what they point of the project is, it is always financially backwards. And on top of all that, they don't own the land so they lease it from the City of Hartford for $3M a year.
You are right that the Feds are not giving the state more money for the New Haven-Hartford-Springfield project but that could change. Part of the problem has been Congress' inability to do anything. The state needs to show that the service and the additional money needed will be well spent and useful. I think that will happen and the politics in Washington will work it out eventually.
The I-84 project is going to be enormous when it is done. It will likely change the city of Hartford for the better overall by dropping I-84 down and moving the train tracks to the north, eliminating the need for large bridges. Other options are being considered but for many reasons this option is the favorite and will likely be selected. Still the project has a lot of hurdles to overcome including environmental reviews and funding both of which will take years to iron out.
As for the garage downtown being purchased by the state, the price of the garage being paid is what it would cost the state to build a new structure minus the cost of the upgrades. It is a pretty big garage and is located near the two office towers the state is purchasing adjacent to Constitution Plaza. They are required by union contracts to provide parking for their employees so they do not have much of a choice but to either buy the garage or build a new one for those buildings. Jay
Location: NY/NJ/CT Tri-state Area (Farmington Valley, CT)
12 posts, read 18,443 times
Reputation: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayCT
Also, in case you do not realize it, the world does not completely revolve around New York. Hartford is home to many major companies and is the largest employment center in the state.
I appreciate the sarcasm, thanks for that. Yes, obviously the world does not revolve around NYC. However, Connecticut, immediately bordering SE NY, as well as having its southernmost border coming within less than 20 miles of the city limit itself, is hardly representative of this "world" at large which does not revolve around NYC. Connecticut always has and always will be affected by the city's economic and cultural gravity.
So many people in Hartford cling to the notion that it's still this great old Northeastern city yada yada yada and that it has a draw of its own blah blah blah--this really doesn't hold true anymore. Within the economic and political arena of the Northeast Corridor, Hartford is becoming increasingly irrelevant and overlooked.
The metro area, less the city itself, remains prominent and shows some promise mainly due to excellent education as well as the relocation of firms that have migrated out of Hartford and even some--gasp--that have come in from NY.
Hartford itself has utterly failed to attract significant, sustainable investment that places better connected to NYC, such as Stamford, have.
Where do most college-aged kids in greater Hartford want to end up post-grad? In the city, or in Boston. Not Hartford. It's the harsh reality. While it may be the largest employment center in the state, I believe that is likely due to the masses of state and city employees. In terms of private enterprise (the only genuine measure of economic progress), Stamford has much higher growth and, if it hasn't already, may have more private sector jobs very soon.
There is also not very much for young adults to do in Hartford (that they want to do); the "going out" scene is very redundant and pales in comparison even to New Haven. Urban entertainment is something very important to us Millennials, and Hartford just is not cutting it.
The worst part of all of this is that so many people from the Hartford area are too prideful, too stuck in the past, and too reluctant to come to terms with its obvious shortcomings. Such people would rather espouse the deluded view that Hartford still means something [to America, the Northeast, the world, whatever] in 2013 and as such all roads in the state should lead to Hartford, rather than better integrating it as a smaller part of the Northeast corridor as a whole and allowing it to serve as a semi-regional transportation hub and launch point for real future growth and development.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayCT
To dismiss a major transportation project like the busway that will serve this employment center as "useless" is just shortsighted and narrow minded.
As you can see on the map, the busway will only shuffle people from ghetto to ghetto. Yes, there are some stops through nicer, safer areas, but they are still sandwiched between ghettos on this line. This will not only scare and frighten middle class and student, i.e., riders away (bad enough it's a bus to begin with), but it will do nothing economically. In fact, it will probably lower property values in Newington by A) obstructing views/affecting the town aesthetic and B) enabling people from economically worse-off areas easy access to the town. As horrible and un-PC as the latter sounds, perception is critical in the real estate market and mark my words this will no doubt have a negative effect in this regard.
I appreciate the sarcasm, thanks for that. Yes, obviously the world does not revolve around NYC. However, Connecticut, immediately bordering SE NY, as well as having its southernmost border coming within less than 20 miles of the city limit itself, is hardly representative of this "world" at large which does not revolve around NYC. Connecticut always has and always will be affected by the city's economic and cultural gravity.
So many people in Hartford cling to the notion that it's still this great old Northeastern city yada yada yada and that it has a draw of its own blah blah blah--this really doesn't hold true anymore. Within the economic and political arena of the Northeast Corridor, Hartford is becoming increasingly irrelevant and overlooked.
The metro area, less the city itself, remains prominent and shows some promise mainly due to excellent education as well as the relocation of firms that have migrated out of Hartford and even some--gasp--that have come in from NY.
Hartford itself has utterly failed to attract significant, sustainable investment that places better connected to NYC, such as Stamford, have.
Where do most college-aged kids in greater Hartford want to end up post-grad? In the city, or in Boston. Not Hartford. It's the harsh reality. While it may be the largest employment center in the state, I believe that is likely due to the masses of state and city employees. In terms of private enterprise (the only genuine measure of economic progress), Stamford has much higher growth and, if it hasn't already, may have more private sector jobs very soon.
There is also not very much for young adults to do in Hartford (that they want to do); the "going out" scene is very redundant and pales in comparison even to New Haven. Urban entertainment is something very important to us Millennials, and Hartford just is not cutting it.
The worst part of all of this is that so many people from the Hartford area are too prideful, too stuck in the past, and too reluctant to come to terms with its obvious shortcomings. Such people would rather espouse the deluded view that Hartford still means something [to America, the Northeast, the world, whatever] in 2013 and as such all roads in the state should lead to Hartford, rather than better integrating it as a smaller part of the Northeast corridor as a whole and allowing it to serve as a semi-regional transportation hub and launch point for real future growth and development.
As you can see on the map, the busway will only shuffle people from ghetto to ghetto. Yes, there are some stops through nicer, safer areas, but they are still sandwiched between ghettos on this line. This will not only scare and frighten middle class and student, i.e., riders away (bad enough it's a bus to begin with), but it will do nothing economically. In fact, it will probably lower property values in Newington by A) obstructing views/affecting the town aesthetic and B) enabling people from economically worse-off areas easy access to the town. As horrible and un-PC as the latter sounds, perception is critical in the real estate market and mark my words this will no doubt have a negative effect in this regard.
I can't believe you would label a city with a metropolitan area population of over 1 million people and that is home to some of the largest financial companies in the country as well as a major Fortune 100 corporation "irrelevant and overlooked". Of course Hartford is not Boston or New York and to dismiss it is just plain narrow minded. Any city the size of Hartford would be more than happy to have the number and type of companies Hartford has. Not every city in this country is a New York but you certainly seem to expect it to be. Do you even know anything about cities in this country beyond New York or Boston?
Also the busway goes well beyond connecting "ghetto to ghetto". If you look at the actual service planned you will see it goes well beyond running buses from New Britian to Hartford. Buses from west of Hartford would feed into the busway to bypass heavy traffic on I-84. It is not meant to be all encompassing but it is a start and a lot better than doing nothing.
I really think your expectations are unreasonably high for a city the size of Hartford. Too many people think that if it is not like Ny or Boston, it is not a great place to live. Not everyone wants to live in or near a large city like that and deal with the hassles and costs involved. A city the size of Hartford offers some of the big city conveniences without those hassles or expense. I much prefer that over either of those cities you seem to think everyone loves. JMHO, Jay
I think main thing that's missing re: Hartford transportation is a direct connection to New York and Boston. A three hour train ride to New York-- and often change of train in New Haven is ridiculous, and, it's way too expensive. Hartford should be a bigger part of the regional transport system. It makes perfect sense for people to take the train from New Haven to Hartford, but the current Amtrak shuttle service is severely lacking.
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Rail and o/a transportation system mgt. abysmal in CT
