1st shoe drops for Washington florist under fire for faith
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I did grasp what you used to back up your opinion, it just isn't relevant and neither are your insults. The florist has rights and responsibilities as a business and one of them is to obey the laws. This religious rights you and others keep bringing up apply in your minds strictly to business owners? If these rights were what you think there are should they not also apply to employees, police, fire fighters and even judges?
LGBT people have the same rights as those who are not, nothing more but certainly nothing less. It is rather a simple notion to understand.
I was insulted first by a cadre of people including JJRose who started. At this point gloves are off. If you go back as long as JJRose was decent I THANK HER FOR THE INFO. Step back and shut it.
The Supreme law of the land is the 1st Amendment. Which trumps state laws. Period. There is no argument on that. Judges being what they are have sent down unlawful laws contradicting the Constitution illegally; because to change it you have to have a Constitutional amendment. THIS THEY HAVE NOT DONE WITH REGARDS TO THE 1st Amendment. Which the Sodomites are trying to do by: by passing the process via CORRUPT JUDGES. Doesn't make it right. Does it.
AGAIN I ASK YOU WHAT IS THE FLORIST RIGHTS AND CHRISTIANS RIGHTS???
can't answer can you? Just keep by passing,
Should they apply to CIVIL SERVANTS? that are paid for by taxes? Don't sodomites pay taxes?? THINK BEFORE YOU THINK YOU ARE BRILLIANT.
In fact the 1963 Law only applied TO CIVIL SERVICE.....public places BECUASE BLACK PAID taxes and were entitled to those service.
What the sodomites are doing is PEVERSING THE LAW via corrupt Judges.
Answer the question: WHAT IS THE Chrisitan FLORIST RIGHTS?
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
2,365 posts, read 2,146,559 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeonGecko
No, there is not. Once again - she has every right to believe in whatever she wants. Her church has every right to preach against gay marriage and to refuse to perform them. They have the right - repugnant as the idea is - to teach their children to hate gay people as hell-bound demons.
They do NOT have the right to enforce these beliefs on OTHER PEOPLE. No matter how firmly you believe that gay people - or blacks, or women, or Jews, or Satanists, or whatever - are breaking your religious laws, you do not have the right to discriminate against them outside of your church, in a public place of commerce. It is specifically against the law.
And that in no way abrogates your right to belief. In no way.
She has Freedom of Religion. But the other side of that coin is that the rest of us are guaranteed Freedom FROM your religion.
You do whatever you want within your own church. As long as it doesn't involve the direct abrogation of human rights you can think and profess whatever you want. Eg, you are not allowed to whip a gay person to get the devil out of them because that is a violation of his human rights, but you can refuse to marry him to his lover in a church service because that is a religious issue that directly impinges on church functions.
You also cannot stop him or her from being married by another preacher in some other church, or by a justice of the peace or judge. No matter how firmly you believe it is an Abomination.
You may not refuse services or goods to someone just because you think you have a religious prerogative. That is YOU trying to force YOUR religious beliefs on others. We don't allow that in this country, thankfully.
That's the law. No amount of spouting off about your right to religious freedom is going to change that, nor will it change the fact that obeying the law in this case is not a violation of said rights.
No one is telling you you can't believe however you want. Well, actually, I'm telling you that that particular belief is disgusting and wrong - but no one is trying to pass legislation that would make it illegal for you to profess such a belief or to teach it to your poor, innocent, vulnerable children.
Believe whatever you want. Just don't expect to be allowed to ACT on that belief against people who aren't even in your church and who don't share your weird superstitious belief set.
I certainly haven't defined ANY of this. It was decided by legislation, that was passed to support the majority opinion because this is what our society supports - both freedom OF and freedom FROM religion.
Your 'yous' and 'YOUR's' are rhetorical. They dont apply to me personally, no matter how willing you are to slap them on my back.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeonGecko
Sorry, but the fact that there is no violation of one's religious rights in this case is not a tangent. Its the very crux of the matter.
Its not going to hit the Supreme Court because the Supreme Court doesn't hear specious cases.
She should feel guilty because she has guilt. She has performed an act of bigotry and is trying to justify this through her religious beliefs.
She is in error if she thinks her religious beliefs trump the law, and so are you.
That looks like someone saying her freedom of religion, or anyones for that matter, is not a part of the law. YOU ( and I mean you personally) clearly make a seperation between the two. You dont think you could be wrong. I (this is me, speaking for myself) think either side could be wrong.
I hope the case does get to the U.S. Supreme Court.
One way or the other, it will put the matter to rest once and for all, and people can stop defaming others, and raging, regardless of the Cheif Justice's verdict.
So if I were white and wanted to hold KKK rally and I called a catering company to provide the catering, would they be able to refuse? Or would that be discrimination?
And this is something that likely will happen as there are still such gatherings held.
So if I were white and wanted to hold KKK rally and I called a catering company to provide the catering, would they be able to refuse? Or would that be discrimination?
And this is something that likely will happen as there are still such gatherings held.
This question has already been asked and answered several times on this thread. The answer has been and continues to be that hate groups are not a protected class. Therefore, no, it would not be discrimination.
This question has already been asked and answered several times on this thread. The answer has been and continues to be that hate groups are not a protected class. Therefore, no, it would not be discrimination.
So now certain people are eligible to be a 'protected class' interesting. I thought everyone should just be equal. So only certain people deserve to be "protected". Gotcha.
So now certain people are eligible to be a 'protected class' interesting. I thought everyone should just be equal. So only certain people deserve to be "protected". Gotcha.
All people are members of protected classes. We all have a gender, a race, and a sexual orientation.
Edit: to clarify further, the catering company cannot refuse to serve the KKK based on the members' gender, race, or sexual orientation. That would be discrimination as gender, race, and sexual orientation are protected classes. (Sexual orientation is not a protected class in all states). The catering company can refuse to provide service based on the members' point of view. Point of view is not a protected class.
Last edited by Petunia 100; 04-03-2015 at 07:40 PM..
All people are members of protected classes. We all have a gender, a race, and a sexual orientation.
And again who decided what made these particular things "protected" and others not. Pretty soon you will have Nambla members saying they should be a protected class.
I remember there was this racist white man who owned a restaurant in my city and and I went there for years not really knowing he didn't really want us there. I stopped going when I found out. Now in his defense what I'm about to say may not be true, but supposedly the did things to the food for his black patrons. Since then I never want someone to serve me just because they are "forced" to to comply with the laws. That's just me but everyone is different.
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
2,365 posts, read 2,146,559 times
Reputation: 3814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Petunia 100
This question has already been asked and answered several times on this thread. The answer has been and continues to be that hate groups are not a protected class. Therefore, no, it would not be discrimination.
So, you have to be a protected class? No one can ever discriminate against a white person, even if they refuse to serve them in the same manner everyone else expects to be served?
What if the Klansman ordering the catering happens to be in a wheelchair, have HIV/AIDS (because that disease is not limited to only gay people and drug addicts) or some other disability? He is now a protected class, right?
Can anyone refuse to cater an event for him, for whatever reason? Can he demand his right to have a minority member contract a performance for him?
I say that ALL people have the right to not be discriminated against.
When I was in the 8th grade, I took a state required Civics class. We learned about our government, our Constitution, etc. One of the main principals taught, which I remember to this day, is that one person's rights end where another person's rights begin. Surely my particular 8th grade class was not the only one teaching this principal?
Anyone else recall being taught this?
Sure do.
But I don't remember anything about the right to buy flowers. I do remember something about the free exercise of religion though.
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