Mom hikes 30 miles to save stranded family in snow near grand canyon

[mishigas73]

Originally Posted by lvmensch

Not really workable anymore. You can print your own maps but in a decade or so it will no longer be possible to buy them.

I'll be interested to see what technology "they" come up with to replace the back-country paper maps that we have.

Honestly, I cannot see paper maps disappearing in this realm until such time as a reliable and convenient replacement comes along.

[Parnassia]

Originally Posted by lvmensch

Not really workable anymore. You can print your own maps but in a decade or so it will no longer be possible to buy them. And maps and compass are no where near as accurate as a gps in many circumstances. Simply flat snowy country or heavy forest and you will not be able to get anything resembling an accurate fix. As I said before GPS we would sit for 5 or 6 hours outside some harbors. With good radar it might have been possible to safely enter...but with much better compasses than any hand held we knew better.

Better a second GPS. Or even a primitive one to go with a map. Or even a third.

Well, this is where research ahead of the trip makes sense. Pinpoint accuracy isn't necessary in every situation. There are many sources of local information especially for areas with active visitor orientation programs so arriving without a clue is just stupid. There are many ways to find your way in wilderness areas without a map too. Even if you don't have a map of a place you are lost in you can still orient yourself if you have researched it ahead of time, understand the terrain and how to "read" it. These things can guide you to water, to shelter, to some sort of possible calories, and maybe even to the most likely place searchers can locate you. Better yet, stay with your vehicle on or near that original roadway instead of wandering off in the snow!

Many years ago I bought a fascinating book about reading nature's maps. Learning how to use local vegetation and geology to stay oriented while walking in terrain, finding water, finding cooler or warmer places to shelter, where snow might be shallower or not even present, predicting where food might be had, even how your own body will bias how you cover the ground. Even if the examples in the book were specific to a different area the concepts are applicable in many situations and they do make you more aware of the place you are in. I will probably never need all the skills the book suggested, but I find myself applying some whenever I am out and about just to enjoy the place more.

[lvmensch]

Those of you who are all so fond of the topo map might want to go and see what is actually going on.

In fact the old topo is no more. The USGS no longer does any direct work to create maps. What it does now is suck in various GIS data bases to create its maps. One of the common sources is the data bases of the the GPS manufacturers. They are trying to move to public domain data bases to prevent limits on the use of its maps. The census Tiger maps are the primary source.

So basically what you get on a Topo is some version of the stuff on GPSs.

In fact any topo you buy now is simply printed from the GIS data base. If you do it yourself you can select layers and stuff to build your own.

But get the message. The classical topo is no more. The USGS no longer surveys anything and no one goes to the field. You get what is available electronically and that is it.

Read all about it.

https://www2.usgs.gov/faq/categories/9797/3579

[mishigas73]

Originally Posted by lvmensch

Those of you who are all so fond of the topo map might want to go and see what is actually going on.

In fact the old topo is no more. The USGS no longer does any direct work to create maps. What it does now is suck in various GIS data bases to create its maps. One of the common sources is the data bases of the the GPS manufacturers. They are trying to move to public domain data bases to prevent limits on the use of its maps. The census Tiger maps are the primary source.

So basically what you get on a Topo is some version of the stuff on GPSs.

In fact any topo you buy now is simply printed from the GIS data base. If you do it yourself you can select layers and stuff to build your own.

But get the message. The classical topo is no more. The USGS no longer surveys anything and no one goes to the field. You get what is available electronically and that is it.

Read all about it.

https://www2.usgs.gov/faq/categories/9797/3579

Interesting.

Seems like they're "still working on" actually getting data that would be useful for me (remote roads, for example).

Which is probably why the maps that we use for our area, Green Trails, won't be going the way of the dodo any time soon.

https://greentrailsmaps.com/about

Good thing we don't have to rely on the USGS for the information we need.