Dallas Plastic Grocery Bag Ban-Need Help (Howe: school, taxes, live in)

[BigDGeek]

Originally Posted by VegasMan_72

It's so funny you said that. I still have a bunch of Carrefour bags, I use them at Aldi.

I still have a stack of folding orange bags from Sainsbury's. My bags from other countries got torn eventually. They DO wear out eventually, but it takes a damn long time. It probably helps that the bags from Europe are of better quality than a lot of bags here. The 99 cent bags here tear eventually if you overload them. I have a couple of bags I bought at Sprouts 5 years ago that just recently bit the dust.

[HockDad]

Originally Posted by BigDGeek

I agree. I think we're using the word "rights" kind of loosely here. Does someone have an inherent right to pollute, or to litter? I don't think so. That's just my opinion.

I just don't know where it stops. Lets take cigarettes. I hate them. People litter with them, they pollute the air, they are harmful, etc. Most of us would be happy if they just disappeared. However, I don't like the idea of the government regulating them to such an extent that the regulations influence people's (adults) behavior. In the case of tobacco, the government keeps raising taxes to "encourage" people to stop smoking. Most voters are probably ok with this government action and are not mindful of the phrase that the "power to tax is the same as the power to destroy." Of my friends (40-50 year olds), exactly zero of my friends smoke (except the occasional cigar). Thus, to a large extent, the government has been successful.

However, I could make a good argument that alcohol is a far worse vice for society than smoking. On NYE in Dallas we will have several innocent people killed as a result of drunk driving. We will also have innocent people injured as a result of alcohol fueled fights. People lose their jobs every day as a result of alcoholism and coming to work drunk. Family violence is often fueled by booze.

I know I am going off on a tangent, and criticism on switching the subject is warranted. Moreover, it is a leap from plastic bags to booze, but the point is the same. I want the government to keep me and my family safe in a safe environment, but I am skeptical of any governmental regulation that wants to change people's behavior or that ban's behavior.

[elan]

Oh man, thanks irresponsible people, all hail the Nanny State. This may help the folks south of us, but we are still going to get trash when it floods. To be effective, Denton and Collin counties need to ban them too. Heck, they should probably be banned all the way to Oklahoma. All this stuff is coming from way way upstream. Walk any creek leading to Harry Moss Park and you'll see plenty of junk. Check out the neighborhoods though, they aren't the ones trashing it. We'll see, but I'm not to optimistic. I'm not buying a reusable plastic bag, they get nasty if not washed after each use. Whole Foods uses paper and I'll just carry a crate or something obnoxious for Tom Thumb.

[octo]

The nanny state argument is a bit funny in Texas. We are so nanny here that we even ban marriage equality, which is a human right, so the anti government crowd should not have a problem with something as benign as a plastic bag ban.

[bencronin04]

I had to pay for someones bag at 7-11 yesterday because they wanted to throw a ridiculous fit about it and yell at the clerks. A whole nickle. This guy was wearing a fairly sharp tailored suit and driving a Bentley GT. Yes Mr. Jerk, it is the clerks fault.....the nerve of some people.

[HockDad]

Originally Posted by octo

The nanny state argument is a bit funny in Texas. We are so nanny here that we even ban marriage equality, which is a human right, so the anti government crowd should not have a problem with something as benign as a plastic bag ban.

There are plenty of people that are concerned with government overreaching that could care less if gays want to marry. As my political advisor Chris Rock says, "Hell, let them be miserable just like all of the other married people..."

[BigDGeek]

Originally Posted by bencronin04

I had to pay for someones bag at 7-11 yesterday because they wanted to throw a ridiculous fit about it and yell at the clerks. A whole nickle. This guy was wearing a fairly sharp tailored suit and driving a Bentley GT. Yes Mr. Jerk, it is the clerks fault.....the nerve of some people.

My Facebook feed is full of Dallas residents griping about a flippin' nickel. It isn't like they didn't know about this new bag tax/fee/whatever you want to call it beforehand.

Talk about first-world problems!

One lady even compared the 5 cent charge to the Holocaust.

[bencronin04]

Originally Posted by BigDGeek

My Facebook feed is full of Dallas residents griping about a flippin' nickel. It isn't like they didn't know about this new bag tax/fee/whatever you want to call it beforehand.

Talk about first-world problems!

One lady even compared the 5 cent charge to the Holocaust.

HAHAHA. People are so amusing. To be honest, I ever forgot about the bag policy yesterday while picking up some wine for my wife. Luckily they let me carry it out bag-less, though I wouldn't have cared much about paying the 5 cents.

[BigDGeek]

Originally Posted by bencronin04

HAHAHA. People are so amusing. To be honest, I ever forgot about the bag policy yesterday while picking up some wine for my wife. Luckily they let me carry it out bag-less, though I wouldn't have cared much about paying the 5 cents.

Yeah, really; if I end up having to pay five cents for a bag, it'll be my fault for forgetting my resuable bags (or not bringing enough of them).

Luckily my new car has a compartment underneath the trunk mat where you can store stuff; it's actually really cool and pretty large! Right now I'm only storing my jumper cables in there, but it's perfect for stashing reusable bags. I'm going to put a bunch in there today so I'll always have them just in case. I have TONS of the things. Whenever there's swag to be had, I grab as many reusable bags as they'll allow me to take.

[pharpe]

Originally Posted by HockDad

I guess your response would work anytime that people worry about the government infringing on businesses. Basically the government is saying that we are banning a product for your good because you don't know how to police yourself and use the product like a responsible citizen. Well, thousands of people every day use the product in a responsible manner, but a relatively small percentage, litter, thus we are going to punish the whole group.

This has nothing to do with infringing on business. Its a consumer issue. If anything it helps the stores because they don't have to buy as many plastic bags and will make more revenue on the sale of the reusable ones. The 5 cent fee is pass through and has no financial impact to them.

As far as the government "banning" something damaging to the populous we do this all the time. It's the same reason you can't dump motor oil in your back yard, throw trash on the highway, put DTD on crops, etc. If something causes more harm then benefit to community, then civilized society says lets prevent that for the good of the people. In our system its done through our elected officials. Have you ever been to a 3rd world country that does not do this? Lots of "freedom" to do whatever you want along with trash pilled up on city streets, contaminated drinking water, and general unhealthiness and filth. I guarantee you wouldn't want to live there.

They are not even "banning" the bags anyway. There is just a 0.05 charge, so if you're really that gung ho about using plastic bags its still an option. It's just a genital way to influence consumer behavior for the benefit of the city as a whole.

If there is a legitimate argument for why we should be promoting the use of disposable plastic bags I'd love to hear it because I still have not heard that yet.