Anyone around in Dallas when this happened? (Houston, Plano: apartments, home)

[justsomeguy]

This:

After losing out on a headquarters bid over a decade ago, Dallas created a thriving downtown to woo corporations | WBFO

Is Dallas way different than it was 16 years ago? How has it changed in your mind

[TurtleCreek80]

Losing the Boeing HQ relo is the absolute best thing that happened to Dallas in the last quarter century. 16 years ago, Uptown was in its infancy- more SMU kids than young professionals and pretty much just Post apartments...much of State Thomas was just land. Nightlife was mostly on Lower Greenville. Downtown was dead- no 4510, no One Arts Plaza, no Perot, no Joule, hardly any restaurants. No one knew what Bishop Arts District was - I have no clue what was in most of the commercial & residential spaces down there back then, guessing more "little Mexico" type spots?? Deep Ellum was going through a rough patch after its heydays in the 1990's...several high profile murders/ violent assaults pretty much ground it to a halt. No Southside - Bill's Records was still up on Spring Valley. Eddie Dean's was the only venue on that side of downtown. Knox-Henderson (Knox Street side) was just beginning to turn into a home furnishings destination. Pottery Barn probably opened around that time or a little before. I don't think much was happening on the Henderson side - that really exploded around 2005.

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

Losing the Boeing HQ relo is the absolute best thing that happened to Dallas in the last quarter century. 16 years ago, Uptown was in its infancy- more SMU kids than young professionals and pretty much just Post apartments...much of State Thomas was just land. Nightlife was mostly on Lower Greenville. Downtown was dead- no 4510, no One Arts Plaza, no Perot, no Joule, hardly any restaurants. No one knew what Bishop Arts District was - I have no clue what was in most of the commercial & residential spaces down there back then, guessing more "little Mexico" type spots?? Deep Ellum was going through a rough patch after its heydays in the 1990's...several high profile murders/ violent assaults pretty much ground it to a halt. No Southside - Bill's Records was still up on Spring Valley. Eddie Dean's was the only venue on that side of downtown. Knox-Henderson (Knox Street side) was just beginning to turn into a home furnishings destination. Pottery Barn probably opened around that time or a little before. I don't think much was happening on the Henderson side - that really exploded around 2005.

Bishop Arts had restaurants that catered to non-Hispanic customers. It simply wasn't a "destination" within DFW like it is now. Frankly, other than the addition of Boulevardier, I'd gladly have it back the way it was. I do love Lucia, but it's not a place I go more than once a year so I'd be willing to travel for it. Tillman's was already there at that point, as were stores like the Bishop Street Market and a few others. I get that things change and I've found other places in Oak Cliff I like better now so not a complaint, just saying that there was plenty going on in many of these places, the gentrification simply hadn't gone into hyperdrive like it has in the last 8-10 years or so.

I think that's fundamentally different from downtown and uptown, where there were a very small number of housing units and that number has exploded massively.

[DTXman34]

Hopefully Amazon rejects Dallas so it can hurry up and tear down I-345, revitalize Fair Park, add more bike lanes, improve DART, and build something useful in the Trinity. Keep the corporate rejections coming!

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by numbersguy100

Bishop Arts had restaurants that catered to non-Hispanic customers. It simply wasn't a "destination" within DFW like it is now. Frankly, other than the addition of Boulevardier, I'd gladly have it back the way it was. I do love Lucia, but it's not a place I go more than once a year so I'd be willing to travel for it. Tillman's was already there at that point, as were stores like the Bishop Street Market and a few others. I get that things change and I've found other places in Oak Cliff I like better now so not a complaint, just saying that there was plenty going on in many of these places, the gentrification simply hadn't gone into hyperdrive like it has in the last 8-10 years or so.

I think that's fundamentally different from downtown and uptown, where there were a very small number of housing units and that number has exploded massively.

I didn't realize Tillman's had been around that long. I discovered Bishop Arts around 2005-6ish.

[turf3]

Originally Posted by DTXman34

Hopefully Amazon rejects Dallas so it can hurry up and tear down I-345,

You have no idea what you are talking about. I was here before the Elevated Central Expressway was built. In those days it took half an hour to travel a mile through downtown where it now takes 5 minutes. Nowadays it would probably take an hour.


The idea that all of us who live in the inner parts of Dallas should have to go all the way out to LBJ and circle clear round the outskirts of the city just to go from, say, Mockingbird and Greenville to, say, Seagoville, is nuts.

[octo]

Yeah, I was around and it feels like it was just last year not 16. Uh, I'm really getting old!

[pharpe]

Originally Posted by DTXman34

tear down I-345, revitalize Fair Park, add more bike lanes, improve DART, and build something useful in the Trinity.

Nailed it

[TheOverdog]

The idea that all of us who live in the inner parts of Dallas should have to go all the way out to LBJ and circle clear round the outskirts of the city just to go from, say, Mockingbird and Greenville to, say, Seagoville, is nuts.

No, the idea that prioritizing commutes to Seagoville (or Houston, or Plano) from downtown is what is nuts. Look, all the jobs and people moved up there so building a freeway just wasted a bunch of money.

[DTXman34]

Originally Posted by turf3

You have no idea what you are talking about. I was here before the Elevated Central Expressway was built. In those days it took half an hour to travel a mile through downtown where it now takes 5 minutes. Nowadays it would probably take an hour.


The idea that all of us who live in the inner parts of Dallas should have to go all the way out to LBJ and circle clear round the outskirts of the city just to go from, say, Mockingbird and Greenville to, say, Seagoville, is nuts.

A couple of points:

1. Back then, Downtown was bustling! That's sort of the point though -- congestion is actually a good thing for the economic health of downtown. There's not a single successful downtown where you can zip out of it in 5 minutes. Interstates were only intended to connect regions, not shoved through urban cores. The result of doing that was one major factor in Downtown's decline. Downtown's economic health trumps someone's desire to bypass it. When City Council votes on it, I highly doubt they will take in consideration the people looking to bypass downtown. They're more concerned about people working, living, and playing in Downtown.

2. The idea that someone would have to go all the way out to LBJ is ridiculous. There are several underutilized city streets. Traffic would spread out throughout the city grid and also help some declined areas rebound with the increase of traffic. Having everyone on the interstate doesn't help businesses in the city, especially if they're on underutilized streets.

3. Dallas can no longer compete against its suburbs as a car dependent city. Companies looking to build suburban office campuses will always choose places like Plano or Frisco over Dallas. Dallas can no longer act like a suburb when places like Plano, Frisco, McKinney, etc. are much more desirable places with "better" public schools. So Dallas has to capitalize on one of the few strengths it has over the suburbs which is urbanism. Plano & Frisco lacks the urbanism, so DT Dallas is one of the few areas where a company such as Amazon would want to relocate. Problem is -- DT Dallas has to compete against other urban centers with far superior public transit and walkability. Removal of I-345 is one step closer to making the urban core more vibrant.