Thinking about moving to DE (Dover, New Castle: real estate, mortgage, house prices)

[isis297]

I mostly grew up in MD and now live in upstate NY north of Albany. Property taxes and cost of living are really taking a toll on us up here. I'd like to move back closer to home but it seems like a lot has changed in MD since we've been gone that make me think it may not be the best choice anymore. A friend suggested Kent County in DE so I thought I'd come here and get the scoop.

Here are some things we are looking out for:

1) Good sized homes for the money WITH LAND
2) Great schools...if not great public schools than great private school options that aren't going to cost $10,000 a year per child
3) Good healthcare (hospitals and primary doctors)
4) Decent cost of living...I don't expect things to be "cheap" but $350/month for gas and electric and $200/week for groceries for a family of 4 who doesn't buy gourmet items is ridiculous, plus our property taxes are about $4500!

I think those are the most important things. Anything else would be bonus.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

[rossc]

Originally Posted by isis297

Here are some things we are looking out for:

1) Good sized homes for the money WITH LAND
2) Great schools...if not great public schools than great private school options that aren't going to cost $10,000 a year per child
3) Good healthcare (hospitals and primary doctors)
4) Decent cost of living...I don't expect things to be "cheap" but $350/month for gas and electric and $200/week for groceries for a family of 4 who doesn't buy gourmet items is ridiculous, plus our property taxes are about $4500!

I think those are the most important things. Anything else would be bonus.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

I think you've struck out on all four. Real estate is way too expensive based on the local economy. Might be cheap compared to where you're coming from, but if you have to get a job here, you probably will not be making anywhere near the same money.

DE is not known for their public school system. Some are better than others, so if that's important, someone else can tell you where to look for decent schools.

All I hear about health care is that DE is the worse, but again, I'm sure some parts are better than others. I think the Northern part of the state is much better, but a lot of people go to Baltimore for health care.

Electricity is high here. They recently doubled the rate per KwH. A friend pays over $500/month for a small ranch, then maybe $150/month in gas in the winter. He doesn't have AC but does have pool pump running all the time and 3 freezers. When looking at houses, I'd ask to see a copy of their electric bill from a summer month. Same with gas for a winter month. I wouldn't expect groceries to much less. You may find it a little higher.

There is good news...Taxes are dirt cheap. If you can get out of your house in NY with enough to pay cash for a place here, then you'll find it fairly cheap to live.

I would definitely look at houses and jobs before making any decisions.

[from PA]

Originally Posted by isis297

I mostly grew up in MD and now live in upstate NY north of Albany. Property taxes and cost of living are really taking a toll on us up here. I'd like to move back closer to home but it seems like a lot has changed in MD since we've been gone that make me think it may not be the best choice anymore. A friend suggested Kent County in DE so I thought I'd come here and get the scoop.

Here are some things we are looking out for:

1) Good sized homes for the money WITH LAND
2) Great schools...if not great public schools than great private school options that aren't going to cost $10,000 a year per child
3) Good healthcare (hospitals and primary doctors)
4) Decent cost of living...I don't expect things to be "cheap" but $350/month for gas and electric and $200/week for groceries for a family of 4 who doesn't buy gourmet items is ridiculous, plus our property taxes are about $4500!

I think those are the most important things. Anything else would be bonus.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

I think you have a lot to choose from in Kent County.
1) Lots of pre existing homes and new developments in our area. We live in Magnolia. 3000 sq ft with 1/3 acre will run in the mid to upper $300's. You can get more land a bit further out.
2) Caesar Rodney Schools are one of the best in the State.
3) Kent County and Christiana Hospitals have good reputations and Dover has it's share of family practicioners nearby.
4) Depending on your profession, I would check on the job market and salaries but other than water, the utilities are reasonable here. Our taxes run approx. $1600 per year. Our total monthly payments have been practically
cut in half since we moved here from PA.

Most of all, we love the rural nature of the surroundings and the convenience
of nearby shopping and the beaches 1/2 hour away. Of course, there is shore traffic on the weekends in the summer, but when you're this close you can take a short drive off season or during the week.

[isis297]

That is the thing I have to say is most confusing. I know people are going to have different oppinions but how I can read one person telling me I am completely striking out and another telling me the opposite, it is quite baffling. LOL

Does anybody know where I can go to look at statistics or something concrete online so I can decide if it is someplace we should go visit as it's been a while since I've been there?

[JulieF]

Isis,

Maybe I can give you an outsider-with-some-insider's info point of view. I spend much of the time, especially in the summer, with my sister and brother-in-law in Kent County. My husband is holding down the fort in NJ, where we rent. We are trying to decide if Delaware will work out for us and children. The pool here definitely works for us!

Most of the following comes directly from my brother-in-law:

He says that Ross is right about jobs that pay well being scarce, but that you can get a lot of house and land for your money, and that property taxes are low.

The general opinion seems to be that Caesar Rodney is the best school system in this area. As far as he knows, the best private schools are in New Castle county and expensive.

He says that he wishes the doctors and hospitals were better. He didn't want to elaborate on this. (My sister feels pretty strongly about it.) I'm very curious, myself, to know what they're like in the beach areas. Beebe Hospital is there, I think, but it's hardly ever mentioned.

He says he thinks utilities are on the high side (or have moved in that direction, I guess), but that it does depend a lot on your usage.

Sounds kind of high for groceries but, again, depends on what you buy. Our family likes lots of fresh fruit, for instance, and we give that to the children instead of typical snacks, and it can add up.

We've been exploring other states (my husband has, mostly), and we end up confused. Lots of contrasting opinions out there.

Julie

[isis297]

Oh Julie, I am SO with you! We have been talking about moving back to MD but I don't think that works for us anymore. Between utilities and house prices and the schools seem to be out of control with what they expect from children. I have friends there who are teachers and while I want my children to get a great education, I want them to be able to be children too, not expected to create and write a story by the end of October in kindergarten and doing math problems.

So far we've talked about the Panhandle of WV, southern PA, and just recently, DE. I am so confused though because I hear how great the house values and taxes are in WV but the healthcare is bad. Southern PA seems to have good schools, good healthcare, but it depends on where you move what you can get housewise for the price plus they seem to get you on taxes.

I know there isn't going to be a "perfect" place but it just seems like in every area what you do have to give up is a pretty important thing in itself. We'd stay here in NY if it weren't for the cost of living, taxes, and the fact that they will charge you surcharges on everything they can get their hands on.

[peeweeaz]

Isis297,

I can only offer a couple of suggestions. The most important is to spend some time on this forum. There's a wealth of info that many good people - residents and non-residents alike have been willing to share. Much of the info has been gleaned from their hard efforts to take the time to research the web and post the info on this forum. Residents are giving their personal experiences, probably the most important.

A recent (2007) CNN "Money" magazine survey wrote the following info pertaining to state tax bites as a measure of costs per capita income.
Delaware ranked 48 out of 50 states (least taxes). New York and the District of Columbia tied for second (second highest). However, like you said, you're going to have to give up something because unless you're filthy rich, you're not going to obtain the best house, health care, schools etc. So, you need to prioritize what is most important and research like hell.

I grew up in Maryland - Baltimore City and eastern Baltimore County. I've lived in Glen Burnie, Laurel and Severna Park. One of world's best hospitals is Johns Hopkins in Baltimore on Monument Street. But, the neighborhood is a cesspool. So, to get the health care offered by Hopkins you'd probably travel there from somewhere else. Just my two cents.

[elizamary]

Like Peeweeaz said, DE does have the least amount of taxes and we know this too be true.
We moved to Magnolia DE and there are parts that are not the best but for the most part it is a nice neighborhood and conveniently located with every store and restaurant around.

I have heard pro's and con's on health care. We are newbies to the area but have found doctors we are satisfied with so far. Of course, we have only been here 6 months.

As far as schools, my kids are grown and we dont' have any need for them as of now.
The do have great colleges in the Dover area though.

Peeweeaz gave you good advice about prioritize as to what is important to you.
Most likely, you will not have everything you want in an area. So weigh it out, ask questions and find out as much as you can.

[from PA]

Elizamary and myself are on the same page. We live here in Kent County and we love it here.
I'm not sure but I think that Rossc is actually from Sussex county near the beaches where jobs are for the most part seasonal and the cost of homes is high for sure there.
I also feel that there is a lot of information already posted on this site. Check my postings and also Nicknet. Loads of useful info there. The biggest unknown would be the employment possibilities. Hope I don't have you spinning but this little town is really worth a look. Good luck to you.

[rossc]

Originally Posted by from PA

I'm not sure but I think that Rossc is actually from Sussex county

Yes, I am, but I think that real estate state wide is overpriced for this states economy. I think Northern DE is better as far as housing costs, but worse as far as quality of living.

It depends a lot on where you're coming from. People from NJ come here and think they won the lottery. I came from NH and looked at my real estate agent and said "Are you f%^#ing nuts?". It's getting to where average folks can't afford to own a house. If the retirees would stop paying the inflated prices, maybe the market would correct itself.

If you want cheap taxes, decent schools, a more stable economy and a nice house for 25% of what you'd pay here, look in TN. Try 1800 SF on 5 rolling acres with 2 car attached garage, 2 car detached garage and a pond for $139,000. That house would be $400-$500k here. That was 40 minutes north of Nashville, close to major shopping and close to one of the best medical facilities in the state. The only reason I'm not there is because I'm addicted to kitesurfing, which means being near the ocean.

The above house was one that I looked at just before making the decision to move here instead. I don't regret the decision, but my circumstances are not average. I have zero debt so it is very cheap for me to live here. If I had to work a regular job with a mortgage and car payments, I don't think I could do it.