will duluth ever see 100,000 again? (Minneapolis, Rochester: section 8, homes, neighborhood)

[Kid Cann]

Originally Posted by marmac

Glad to see in only 2 days you have lowered your expectations.

2 days ago you were aiming for Duluth to be similar to Sioux Falls, Madison and Omaha

I mean the way that Madison, Omaha and Sioux Falls grew (and are continuing to grow). They both had pro-development, pro-job creation tacticts. Sioux Falls is the only growing metro in the USA.

By the way this is what I said:

I know Duluth is changin' and it's going to just take time, and I am pulling for the City. I am active in promoting what Duluth DOES have to offer. I think with a couple really decent employers and citizen involvment and the willingness to change, Duluth could become a 'Sioux Falls', Madison, or Omaha and not a glorified Willmar

Duluth could become like those cities if Duluth showed up what there is to offer here.

My next post was saying that Duluth shouldn't be in competition with places like Madison (230,000) or Omaha (450,000), they can learn from what they did, but should be in competition with cities like Sioux Falls (160,000) Rochester (105,000) Fargo (105,000).

Rochester had 60,000 in 1980 and now is at 105,000

Fargo had 61,000 - 1980, 75,000-1990, and 90,000 - 2000 and according to a 2008 estimate its at about 105,000.

Sioux Falls had 81,000 - 1980, 100,000-1990, 123,000 - 2000, and nearly 160,000 in a recent estimate.

Sioux Falls has recognized it's niche- That's banking industry and health industry. They have taken that and ran with it.

Fargo is an agriculture town. Food processing, ag, and that industry, They have taken it and ran with it.

Madison has grown significantly since the 1980s too, from 170,000 now to 230,000.

Omaha has grown from 310,000 in 1980 to 450,000 now. It's niche-health care.

All I'm saying is that all these cities - Omaha, Fargo, Sioux Falls, and Madison and Duluth are all isolated, mid-sized cities that must rely on a couple really significant industries to sustain and grow. All have succeeded with the exception of Duluth. While, yes, non of them took the blow Duluth did, it's time for Duluth to quit pouting. Pick up your pants and move ON!

[newcastle]

Found this table of housing developments in Duluth. People keep saying there isn't any new developments, so take a look. Given, not huge compared to growing cities. But a good start.

[SIZE=3][SIZE=3][LEFT]Approved[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Plat Name Number[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]of Lots[/LEFT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=3][SIZE=3][LEFT]2002 NORTHRIDGE ESTATES 39[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2002 THE VIEWS AT RIDGEVIEW 6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2002 WALSH ADDITION 4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2002 SUMMIT RIDGE DIVISION 4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2003 MAPLE RIDGE ARRANGEMENT 22[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2003 CRYSTAL VILLAGE C OF DULUTH 29[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2003 ANDREWS DIVISION DULUTH 13[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2003 ANDREWS DIVISION FIRST ADDITION DULUTH 11[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2004 HAWK RIDGE ESTATES C OF DULUTH 61[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2004 CEDAR RIDGE ESTATES CITY OF DULUTH 24[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2004 SACKETTE ADDITION 10[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2004 BRISTOLWOOD FIRST ADDITION 8[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2005 BLUFF RIDGE 21[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2005 ADAMZAK ACRES C OF DULUTH 4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2005 BENSON HEIGHTS 4[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2006 HAWK RIDGE ESTATES FIRST ADDITION 65[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2007 COFFEE CREEK 113[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2008 EASTRIDGE 23[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]2008 HIDDEN ESTATES 13[/LEFT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=2][SIZE=2][LEFT]Source: Duluth Planning Division[/LEFT][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=3][SIZE=3][LEFT]Since 2002 the city has approved several new plats which have resulted in the creation of 474 new[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]buildable lots. The following two tables show the number of lots added per year and the list of plats by[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]the year approved. With the housing trends indicating a softening market, it is not surprise to see a[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]decline in land development.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3][/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]



This HUD study also indicated the number of housing units increased in Duluth to over 35,000 housing units but the average household size declined to just over 2 people per household contributing to the lower census estimates for 2010. Also that 27% of people in Duluth are at retirement age and will vacate their jobs in the enxt few years causing a demand for employement and those new people moving in will need housing so demand will increase in the next several years. Any thoughts on how the economy we are in will impact baby boomers retiring?

[marmac]

In many places, people are not retiring when they reach retirement eligibility age. ( despite a couple years ago stating they were planning on it )

I personally know 3 teachers in our small school district who changed their retirement plans due to the economy and uncertainty of the future.

A double edged sword--------unemployed looking for work and older people working past retirement eligibility age.

[newcastle]

Originally Posted by marmac

In many places, people are not retiring when they reach retirement eligibility age. ( despite a couple years ago stating they were planning on it )

I personally know 3 teachers in our small school district who changed their retirement plans due to the economy and uncertainty of the future.

A double edged sword--------unemployed looking for work and older people working past retirement eligibility age.

I totally agree. My dad is at retirment age and pushed his plans back three years due to the loss of income in his 401k and the need for health insurance benefits.

I bet the census numbers will be just wild around the country. Places like Arizona, Nevada, Florida, and New Mexico could see their numbers plumet with kids moving home ot be with mom and dad and retirees unable to afford their retirement homes due to loss of income from investments. Scary.

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by Kid Cann

Sioux Falls is the only growing metro in the USA.

Who told you that?

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by newcastle

I totally agree. My dad is at retirment age and pushed his plans back three years due to the loss of income in his 401k and the need for health insurance benefits.

I bet the census numbers will be just wild around the country. Places like Arizona, Nevada, Florida, and New Mexico could see their numbers plumet with kids moving home ot be with mom and dad and retirees unable to afford their retirement homes due to loss of income from investments. Scary.

Nobody's numbers are plummeting, but you are right. The bubble has burst on the Sun Belt, and the growth has steadied in most of the major metros down there.

[lymelyte]

Duluth's a unique place, kind of like an old European city. A lot Americans can't relate to that, they prefer places like Atlanta or Dallas or some other burgeoning steel-glass Sun Belt city with jobs. And the climate in Duluth is hard on everything, humans included, at least a lot of them. Not to mention the cloudy skies get people down too. Throw in a struggling economy and, well, there you have it.

Me, I like Duluth for what it is. Seems different than the rest of America, and that's a good thing in my book. The lake, all the trees and parks, easily accessible, it's pretty incredible when you think about it, so much to do and as one other poster said, you can't just get views like that cheap anymore. There are a lot of cities, most actually, where that kind of nature is a long drive away. And three colleges no less - wealthy retirees love college towns.

If Duluth would play to its strengths it might get somewhere. Eventually, the old guard will retire and fade out and hopefully some far-sighted leadership will prevail. You need tax base, but it has to be smart, and green, because energy cost is a big drain in the Rust Belt winters. But there are plenty of people who would love to live in Duluth if it was made attractive to do so. If so, I could definitely see the population topping 100k again.

[aluminumpork]

Originally Posted by lymelyte

Duluth's a unique place, kind of like an old European city. A lot Americans can't relate to that...

...Me, I like Duluth for what it is. Seems different than the rest of America, and that's a good thing in my book. The lake, all the trees and parks, easily accessible, it's pretty incredible when you think about it...

You and I are both on the same page.

[Kid Cann]

Originally Posted by srsmn

Who told you that?

My friend who is from there that did a 9 month internship with the City of Sioux Falls City Planning Department. He holds a Master's in Urban Planning... It was along the lines of either the only or one of the few areas that are growing in terms of new home construction permits, home values, new residents, job creation...

[srsmn]

Originally Posted by Kid Cann

My friend who is from there that did a 9 month internship with the City of Sioux Falls City Planning Department. He holds a Master's in Urban Planning... It was along the lines of either the only or one of the few areas that are growing in terms of new home construction permits, home values, new residents, job creation...

It's not true. Maybe your friend said "fastest growing"?

The vast majority of US metro areas are still growing. Cleveland is shrinking, and I think Detroit is probably officially shrinking this census, too. And Flint, if that's not Detroit MSA in the 2010 census. But those are in the vast, vast, vast minority...