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Dangerous and dirty often go together. Slaughterhouses and meatpacking are mostly located in the Midwest. Their use of illegal help is notorious. Mining? You're probably going to an economically depressed area (West Virginia). Lumber? A comparatively dead industry. Ask the god-forsaken former regions ranging from Western NY to Maine.
Hard. Now, there's a great deal of that. NYC has plenty of jobs requiring a bachelor's and experience for receptionist level work at $35,000 per year. Shame that isn't a liveable salary.
Well, now that we've rehashed the investment advice one could find in any prole paper...
Dangerous and dirty often go together. Slaughterhouses and meatpacking are mostly located in the Midwest. Their use of illegal help is notorious. Mining? You're probably going to an economically depressed area (West Virginia). Lumber? A comparatively dead industry. Ask the god-forsaken former regions ranging from Western NY to Maine.
Hard. Now, there's a great deal of that. NYC has plenty of jobs requiring a bachelor's and experience for receptionist level work at $35,000 per year. Shame that isn't a liveable salary.
$35,000 a year in NYC? You would need a roomate to split the rent to get by.
Tell that to the people who got out the market in 1929, Or.....
(They got out... and then had ALL THAT CAPITAL preserved.) Fortunes were made buying land etc.
The only difference now is population/demographics.
(And debt details, but lets ignore that for the moment)
Not at all.
But your missing the point. I only noted that I 'Was in' so it would be clear I wasn't one of those people who cried 'the sky is falling' and had all my money in Gold or something.
It's even irrelevant that (According to the 'good statistics') I'm investing enough to have a couple million bux at 59.5
And it's irrelevant that if it goes to zero... it won't break me ether...
THE POINT (Which you are ignoring) Is that it's simply a matter of time until (in a system which is dependent on more and more money coming in)
There are fewer and fewer $'s coming in... Along with MASSIVE amounts of money going OUT!
I hear that. What I also hear is that you are playing a game....America doesn't need any more gamblers throwing money around, IMO. Congrats if you made millions off of less fortunate investors though.
I hear that. What I also hear is that you are playing a game....America doesn't need any more gamblers throwing money around, IMO. Congrats if you made millions off of less fortunate investors though.
Are you EVEN READING what I wrote????
I said "IF the "12% per Year BS" works out... it'll be a couple Mil.
I'm not betting the farm on it however...
Game, sure, it's called the game of life, and one thing's sure, no one gets out alive.
I plan on:
1. Having fun along the way
2. Not eating Alpo when I'm old.
$35,000 a year in NYC? You would need a roomate to split the rent to get by.
There's a thread on these 30/35k positions demanding a degree + experience in the NYC forum. 35k will get you two room-mates, ramen, and borderline anaemia.
Some background on myself. I'm 25, make 40k, and live in NYC (Brooklyn) with the parents. I'm not a consumption type; I don't have a car nor a motorcycle although I would like one and technically can afford it. I don't have a smartphone with a $100 data plan nor do I go out to eat often (maybe once a month). Would I like to have those things? Sure. Can I technically afford it? Yes. I reality I can't (more on that later). I don't buy many discretionary items and I'd prob be known as an "extreme" save . I have no debt as well. . As "rent" I voluntarily cover the bills at my parents house which amount to about 1k/month.
As you can see I prob don't fit the mold of OP's Gen Y'er. Although he would classify me as a "whiner" as a result of my beliefs about the current system.
Quote:
WTF is wrong with you people? I worked my way up in my job field from 11 dollars an hour to 24 now, put myself through college without taking out a loan, own a house that is worth more than 200K, have 2 cars (one paid for) 3 kids, no debt besides the mortage and car loan, a bunch of toys and my wife is even a stay at home mom. It wasn't hard.
Maybe I'm crazy but making about 50k/year and having 3 kids doesn't sound all that great to me. Unless you have at least 40k in savings you're a layoff and an average unemployment span (now 10 months) away from hard times.
Maybe you live in an area where 50k provides you with a great standard of living... if you were single. Throw in the kids and I know it doesn't. No matter where you live. You're not starving but 50k and 5 mouths to feed ain't much.
To me, 33 and making 50k is kind of average to below average when you throw in 3 kids and a wife. Not to put you down because I don't make **** either. I'm just being realistic here.
The fact is that the job market is becoming increasingly elitist (aka "third" world) in a sense. You either have very well paying jobs or subsistence wage jobs. The middle is being eradicated. Inherently, the labor market is of a pyramidal nature. You'll have much more ****ty paying jobs than great paying jobs in a structure like this.
What do you get? You get employers asking employees to give 100% when the employer is only giving you 50%. In my world that's called being ****ed over.
Now, about the hard work. The truth is, provide the correct incentives and the vast majority of workers will response in kind. True story; for a 3 week stretch leading into the holiday season (I work for a midsize e-retailer) I worked 16 hour days (9am-1am) 6 days a week because for 8 of those hours I was being paid at an overtime rate (about 30/hour). I volunteered for those hours ( I work in the office but this was in the warehouse) because the incentive was there. I was the top producer for that 3 week stretch because I owed that to my employer since I was the highest paid employee on that 8 hour night shift amongst the warehouse workers. Since I was being paid the most, it was only fair that I produce the most and I did.
This is how the system should work. You have to have carrots and sticks. However, in todays private employer culture, you only have sticks. They pay folks 10/hour and expect them to produce at a 20/hour clip. Or they pay them 20/hour and expect them to produce at a 35/hour pace.
You don't see anything wrong with that?
This is where I respectfully ask that all public employees please shut the **** up because you have very little if any idea what it's like in the private sector.
I feel like Jim Cramer whenever ( YouTube - ‪MARKET MELTDOWN‬‏) I talk to public sector employees. It's two completely different worlds. They just have no ****ing clue what it's like in the private sector.
I have no health benefits. I have no pension plan. I have 2 sick days and a week's vacation a year. This is becoming/has become the norm for the vast majority of private sector employees. There are great corps with great work environments out there ( a few of my friends work for such firms) but I'd peg the ratio at about 1-1.5:10.
Add the above to the fact that there is virtually no job stability and what do you have? You have an exploitative and broken system.
This is what my generation has come to realize. The system is broken beyond repair. Problems such as we have now do not get fixed. They get managed until things fall apart. That's just a historical fact. The system has been breaking down since about the early 80's and there is more than ample data to substantiate this fact.
If you take away 1 thing from my post it should be this: History has shown things will not get better. At best we'll be stuck in a Japanese style zombie economy that meanders forward for a decade plus.
This is what my generation realizes. This is why I save like a madmen. I know that things can only get worse and there's little stability in our future as Americans. The standard of living for the vast majority of Americans will decrease. Do you still ask why we're "whining"?
btw, I would love to go in depth on the various points of the screwed up system and how it got there but it'd literally be book size. If anyone want to go point by point (question/asnwer format), that'd prob be the best way to go about it.
Last edited by wawaweewa; 06-21-2011 at 09:47 PM..
First off, I'm 33 years old, at the very tail-end of Gen X or the beginning of Y, depending on who's classification system you're using. I am getting sick of reading thread after thread of my generation and younger whining and complaining about how it is impossible for them to get ahead (or even going) in today's word.
They whine about how it's impossible to go to school without becoming a debt-slave, impossible to buy a house, impossible to raise a family, impossible to even get a job, ect, ect...
WTF is wrong with you people? I worked my way up in my job field from 11 dollars an hour to 24 now, put myself through college without taking out a loan, own a house that is worth more than 200K, have 2 cars (one paid for) 3 kids, no debt besides the mortage and car loan, a bunch of toys and my wife is even a stay at home mom. It wasn't hard.
Here's how: I did a good work and progressed in my job. I bought a fixer-upper house and restored it myself. I kept good credit so I get the best rates on loans. I lived within my means and didn't overextend myself early, so I would have more later. I budget.
Why is this "impossible" for so many people? Did your mommies not teach you how to be an adult? Are you unable to plan more than a week ahead? Stop whining! It's always been challenging to get a life started no matter what generation a person finds themselves in. If chango can do it, you are a sure bet!!!! Get out there and get to work!!!!!
Could you describe us anymore? We are 3 years older, but, same, hubby totally put himself through college w/ hard work & dedication, & got an entry level job & has been w/ the same company since '96 & w/ WORK has advanced. HE has made himself a valueable employee. I am a SAHM of our 2 kiddos, & we own a home & also have 2 cars, one paid off (we just had to get another due to the old one dying lol, before that both paid off) .
& I am the saving queen. I coupon, have lists of sales & I stretch just about everything as far as I can, so we can have a nice life. I also buy 2nd hand, & thrift shop alot.
I understand bad things happen to good people, & I'm very compassionate. I just know some aren't trying as hard as they could. Not all, some.
If the current rate of food inflation continues, you wouldn't be able to afford Alpo anyway....so no worries mate.
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It's always been challenging to get a life started no matter what generation a person finds themselves in. If chango can do it, you are a sure bet!!!! Get out there and get to work!!!!! 
We are 3 years older, but, same, hubby totally put himself through college w/ hard work & dedication, & got an entry level job & has been w/ the same company since '96 & w/ WORK has advanced. HE has made himself a valueable employee. I am a SAHM of our 2 kiddos, & we own a home & also have 2 cars, one paid off (we just had to get another due to the old one dying lol, before that both paid off) .
