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Old 03-09-2016, 12:48 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,668 posts, read 6,598,326 times
Reputation: 4817

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Which does not include the government taking your money to give to someone else.
You didn't obtain that money in a vacuum. It was extracted from the system in some way.

Since the inception of the industrial revolution it was recognized that capitalism would be dysfunctional and self destruct unless there was a massive redistribution of wealth. That's why all functional countries have many avenues to make this happen. Public benefits, wage boosting and supports, unions, high income taxes, etc.

If you wish to rail against reality then go ahead and move to that taxless, governmentless, utopian fantasy and let us know how it goes.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,519,997 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
I could agree with strengthening economic requirements for immigration but even with no immigrants you have to have some redistribution of income, otherwise you'll just have home-brew deep poverty.
We are already redistributing income. Less than 1/2 of working Americans pay federal income tax. The other half don't pay or get it back in refunds.

And welfare programs are financed by tax dollars.


People making $50-60K a year can barely afford their own families never mind give away their money so non working can also have money.

A nation of poor people, which is what we are turning into, cannot pay for basic income.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:51 PM
 
17,401 posts, read 11,982,916 times
Reputation: 16155
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Your money is benefitting you. If the government did not take some of it, crime would soar. You would not be safe, even in your own home.

Extreme poverty makes people desperate, and desperate people resort to desperate measures. It's only natural.
Oh, so now you're justifying crime? That it's OK to steal from folks that have worked hard for their property, when they have not? No, that's not "natural", in any universe. Even Liberal Land.

Let's be clear, that money is representative of the work put in to earning that money. We are protected from anyone that wishes to take it away from us, including the government.

There's a huge difference between paying taxes to pay for police protection, and paying taxes to give to someone else that is too lazy to earn that money themselves, so that they don't commit a crime.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,519,997 times
Reputation: 27720
Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
You didn't obtain that money in a vacuum. It was extracted from the system in some way.

Since the inception of the industrial revolution it was recognized that capitalism would be dysfunctional and self destruct unless there was a massive redistribution of wealth. That's why all functional countries have many avenues to make this happen. Public benefits, wage boosting and supports, unions, high income taxes, etc.

If you wish to rail against reality then go ahead and move to that taxless, governmentless, utopian fantasy and let us know how it goes.
Rather than debate go to the extreme and try to use that to dismiss me.
Means you got NOTHING/

Your "reality" of a basic income stems from Ivory tower professors. Their ideas always work out on paper though don't they ?
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:51 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,668 posts, read 6,598,326 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
"Freedom" and "strong government enforcement" are polar opposites.
Show me one instance of a place where freedom exists and strong government does not.

We have countless examples of the most free and happy societies all having strong governments.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:52 PM
 
17,401 posts, read 11,982,916 times
Reputation: 16155
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
I could agree with strengthening economic requirements for immigration but even with no immigrants you have to have some redistribution of income, otherwise you'll just have home-brew deep poverty.
We already do - it's called welfare. And it's not working. Otherwise, there would be no poverty. So more of something that already doesn't work will not make it better.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:59 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,519,997 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rruff View Post
Show me one instance of a place where freedom exists and strong government does not.

We have countless examples of the most free and happy societies all having strong governments.

The nordic countries do not have strong government regulations over business.
In fact they embrace capitalism rather than try to regulate it to death.

And the profit of that capitalism funds their socialism.

We here in the US regulate to death where only the huge multi nationals can absorb the costs.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:18 PM
 
Location: Ruidoso, NM
5,668 posts, read 6,598,326 times
Reputation: 4817
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
The nordic countries do not have strong government regulations over business.
They have very strict environmental and business regulations, but they are also geared more towards maintaining a competitive playing field. That is the key difference. US regulation is too much about the opposite... big businesses gaming the system to preserve their market share.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:18 PM
 
3,350 posts, read 1,239,187 times
Reputation: 3914
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Try telling that to the people in subsaharan Africa subsisting on $1 a day and walking 5 miles to fetch water. "You're just not trying hard enough".
That's the thing. Almost nobody in this country actually wants to help people born into hell like that in another country. It's a bunch of people living indoors, with indoor plumbing, electricity, often cable and internet, with enough food and water to survive who want people richer than them to give them more stuff.
People who live here basically won the lottery of life but if they struggle act like they've been dealt some terrible hand. If they actually cared about society, instead of begging for even more free stuff from the taxpayers, they would be asking for rich people to help out those people living in 3rd world slums who have limited access to food and water and who are dying of easily curable diseases. Then they wanna play the 1 vs 99 card, ignoring the fact that they still live better than 95% of people walking the planet today, and better than 99 pct of people who have ever walked the planet.

Life isn't fair. Boo hoo my dad wasn't rich. If you were born in this country (not that it doesn't have problems) ,don't have some awful disease, don't have mental problems you have it better than most of the world. Stop crying about the few who have it better than you and be glad you didn't really get dealt a bad hand at life.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:22 PM
 
2,762 posts, read 3,187,466 times
Reputation: 5407
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
We do? Where do you get that figure? From this The Class of 2015: Despite an Improving Economy, Young Grads Still Face an Uphill Climb | Economic Policy Institute

For young college graduates, the unemployment rate is currently 7.2 percent (compared with 5.5 percent in 2007), and the underemployment rate is 14.9 percent (compared with 9.6 percent in 2007).

7.2% is a lot higher than all unemployment, but it is a mile away from 50%.
http://thehiringsite.careerbuilder.c...igh-school-ed/


Just the first thing that popped up but lots of articles out there.
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