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Like Christians anciently, Mormons believe that all human beings are the offspring of God and that He is the Father of our spirits. (See Acts 17:29 and Hebrews 12:9 if you doubt these doctrines to be biblical.) Unlike traditional Christians, we believe that all of us lived in God's presence prior to being born. We were spirit beings at that time, without bodies of flesh and bones. As the spirit sons and daughters of God, we were all brothers and sisters to each other.
Unique among all the sons of God was the one we know as Jesus Christ. Unlike the rest of us, He was with His Father in the beginning. Unlike us, He was perfect in every conceivable way and had all of the divine attributes and qualities His Father had. The shared a unity of will and purpose to such an extent that together, they were known (along with the Holy Ghost) both individually and collectively, as God. Finally, even though we were all the spirit offspring of our Father in Heaven, Jesus Christ was also His Father's "Only Begotten" Son. Under His Father's direction, Jesus Christ created our universe. He was chosen prior to His birth in Bethlehem to be the lamb who would be slain for our sins.
Another of the spirit sons of God was one named Lucifer. He was a proud and rebellious son who sought to exalt himself above his Father and who was cast out of Heaven for attempting to do so. When Lucifer was cast out of Heaven, he was disowned by his Father, and lost his right to ever again be known as a son of God (or a brother to the greatest of God's sons, Jesus Christ). If Jesus and Satan were sons of the same Father, they were spirit brothers, a fact which in no way reflects positively on Satan or negatively on the Savior of the world.
Mormons, incidentally, did not invent this doctrine. Not by a long shot. In the third century, the Christian writer, Lactantius, wrote:
“Before creating the world, God produced a spirit like himself, replete with the virtues of the Father. Later He made another, in whom the mark of divine origin was erased, because this one was besmirched by the poison of jealousy and turned therefore from good to evil. He was jealous of his older brother who, remaining united with the Father, insured his affection unto himself. This being who from good became bad is called devil by the Greeks.
I don't think most Mormons actually care one way or the other whether other Christians accept this doctrine or not. They would just like people to stop trying to make it look like something its not -- like Mormons somehow see Jesus Christ and Lucifer as equals, when nothing could possibly be further from the truth.
Thank you, I was hoping you would be along to straighten this out. I am not an expert on the religion and so I don't want to post something that is not correct making the situation worse.
Huh? What makes you think I do not know any conservatives? Sure I live in Maryland, but look at the gallup tracking poll - Conservatives outnumber liberals in Maryland, just as they do in nearly every state I believe. I've also spent a lot of time living in a county in Maryland that votes roughly 70% GOP. Better question - do you know any conservatives? because I rarely meet any that hate Romney with such a passion that they would bitterly sit home and let Obama win. Actually I've only met one that says that, but he's focused on the senate race here big time (which, IMO will never be competitive, but whatever), so I know he's going to vote.
Do you know what vast majority means? It means nearly all. Which is pretty typical, in every election you have some people that will just be bitter because their guy lost. Plenty of evidence supporting my claim has been posted.
Was that a difficult or confusing question? You framed this based on conservatives you know.
What a strange question... Do I "know any conservatives because you rarely meet any that hate Romney with such a passion that they would bitterly sit home and let Obama win".
lol...well yeah.
I know a ton of conservatives, in the Midwest and the South. Based on what you've stated here, conservatives sat home and let the President win in 2008...
While that made some sense as I've tried to understand the religion and sort through what's been said, this simply got right to the point a whole lot quicker.
Something to consider Walidm: Many Christian religions are absolutely bizarre to anyone encountering them for the first time.
Catholicism believes in transubstantiation: That the bread and wine of the Eucharist literally transform into the flesh and blood of Jesus Christ. Then they eat it. So one way of wording that to sound scandalous: "Catholics believe in ritual cannibalism -- drinking human blood and eating human flesh." If Catholicism was as unfamiliar as Mormonism, then the vast majority of people would accept this statement as 100% valid, but any Catholic would find this extremely offensive and rightfully so.
It is very easy to make any religion sound crazy or ridiculous. But the Christian thing to do is to understand as well as you can and leave the business of judging other people's beliefs to God.
Was that a difficult or confusing question? You framed this based on conservatives you know.
What a strange question... Do I "know any conservatives because you rarely meet any that hate Romney with such a passion that they would bitterly sit home and let Obama win".
lol...well yeah.
I know a ton of conservatives, in the Midwest and the South.
And you asked me if I know any conservatives. you seem to also be framing this on conservatives you know. I don't understand your point. Both of these have been posted in this thread, among other polls in similar threads. Romney GOP Slightly Ahead in Voting Enthusiasm
I was giving my anecdotal evidence because most of you don't believe the actual evidence is true. The people who aren't voting for Romney in the primaries are poised to throw their full support behind him in the general. This happens every four years, and every four years the party coalesces around the eventual nominee. The length of the nominating process doesn't seem to affect that.
Something to consider Walidm: Many Christian religions are absolutely bizarre to anyone encountering them for the first time.
Catholicism believes in transubstantiation: That the bread and wine of the Eucharist literally transform into the flesh and blood of Jesus Christ. Then they eat it. So one way of wording that to sound scandalous: "Catholics believe in ritual cannibalism -- drinking human blood and eating human flesh." If Catholicism was as unfamiliar as Mormonism, then the vast majority of people would accept this statement as 100% valid, but any Catholic would find this extremely offensive and rightfully so.
It is very easy to make any religion sound crazy or ridiculous. But the Christian thing to do is to understand as well as you can and leave the business of judging other people's beliefs to God.
Thank you; however, I understand the Christian thing to do a lot better than I can explain to you in this forum, from a perspective I could only explain outside of this forum, were I inclined to do so.
Since the GOP has determined (for years) all candidates running for the presidency's religious beliefs should be examined, I am trying to learn and understand the faith and convictions of a candidate I'm asked to consider for the Office of President of the United States and Commander in Chief.
Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
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Originally Posted by RPON
No. That would be his flip flopping on every issue whenever it fit his needs for political gain.
That and the facts that he has never did anything the least worthwhile(breaking up companies and destroying jobs for his profit is NOT a good thing) and that he is totally out of touch with your average Americans are things that hurt him,not his religion that most evangelicals and christians see as a cult.
Thank you; however, I understand the Christian thing to do a lot better than I can explain to you in this forum, from a perspective I could only explain outside of this forum, were I inclined to do so.
Since the GOP has determined (for years) all candidates running for the presidency's religious beliefs should be examined, I am trying to learn and understand the faith and convictions of a candidate I'm asked to consider for the Office of President of the United States and Commander in Chief.
I'd honestly say the big thing that makes Mormonism so "weird" is it's specificity. There's not much mystery in Mormonism, they tend to explain everything in great detail. So they have answers to, very specifically, who Satan is, who Jesus Christ is, etc, etc. So when you get that detailed with your theology, some stuff will inevitably sound pretty bizarre to an outside, especially to one raised in a non-LDS Christian society
No. I didn't. I don't care who you know. I'm interested in factual information properly sourced.
You said "Enthusiasm against a certain candidate is just as good as enthusiasm for one" and then followed that up with a statement about most conservatives you know.
My question was how big is the pool of conservatives you know? I disregarded your enthusiasm statement since polling has shown Gingrich's voters trend towards Santorum should he drop out, and Google has reams of articles and data supporting the theory of a less than enthusiastic GOP base, and steady public distrust in Republicans.
No. I didn't. I don't care who you know. I'm interested in factual information properly sourced.
You said "Enthusiasm against a certain candidate is just as good as enthusiasm for one" and then followed that up with a statement about most conservatives you know.
My question was how big is the pool of conservatives you know? I disregarded your enthusiasm statement since polling has shown Gingrich's voters trend towards Santorum should he drop out, and Google has reams of articles and data supporting the theory of a less than enthusiastic GOP base, and steady public distrust in Republicans.
You literally asked me "do you even know any conservatives?"
There's just as much evidence to the contrary too. There are some polls that show Gingrich's supporters would go Santorum, others that show they would go Romney. I've posted polls, and other polls have been posted, showing GOP enthusiasm is up. There are other threads discussing how GOP turnout is now up. I don't doubt what you're saying, but know that there is evidence to the contrary as well.
I'd honestly say the big thing that makes Mormonism so "weird" is it's specificity. There's not much mystery in Mormonism, they tend to explain everything in great detail. So they have answers to, very specifically, who Satan is, who Jesus Christ is, etc, etc. So when you get that detailed with your theology, some stuff will inevitably sound pretty bizarre to an outside, especially to one raised in a non-LDS Christian society
I don't find religion weird, as much as I find it interesting. It's specificity is still open to interpretation since there appears to be some level of ambiguity in the response, and the type of response to certain questions. Time will tell.
The direct approach tends to make all religions in some manner's, bizarre.
The public isn't good with nuance...lol
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) and that he is totally out of touch with your average Americans are things that hurt him,not his religion that most evangelicals and christians see as a cult.
