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Well you shouldn't be. After all we went thru with then Sen. Obama's Baptist church with Rev. Wright in which he was a member for 20 yrs, even got married there yet to this day there's a segment of the population who swears he's a Muslim.
Suprising how so many are tolerant of Romney's religion & nutjob Santorum who'd shove his religion down your throat if elected.
Common perceptions of Mormonism:
Cult
Since the word "cult" could easily be applied to any religion, it's one of those things that would need to be qualified. What do you consider to be a cult?
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Polygamy
Nope, though having multiple wives is a sure fire way to get excommunicated and booted out of the Mormon Church for good.
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Pedifile's
Hadn't heard that one but it's absolutely not accurate. Again, an excellent way to get excommunicated and booted out of the Mormon Church for good.
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Mormons can only marry other Mormons
No requirement there though you have to both be Mormons if you want to get married in a Mormon temple.
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The 1st 3 perceptions are enough to scare the hell outta most Americans. True or false, don't know, don't care since I won't be voting for him nor Santorum. President Obama's religion was scrutinized & still is by the far right so guess what, in the words of Rev. Wright "the chickens have come home to roost", what goes around......comes around.......your turn.
I am not an Obama supporter and I'm not voting for him, but I will gladly stick up for him against anyone calling him a secret Muslim or claiming that he was born in Kenya. Stupidity is stupidity and it should not be tolerated.
If Obama was a Muslim, I'd stick up for him for that too. Being Muslim doesn't make somebody a bad person. But it's ridiculously obvious that he isn't so ...
Location: Democratic Peoples Republic of Redneckistan
11,078 posts, read 15,086,202 times
Reputation: 3937
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Originally Posted by afoigrokerkok
Yes, it's the evangelicals who aren't. I certainly don't mean ALL evangelicals - I'm merely saying that evangelicals are less likely than Catholics to have a "live and let live" mindset.
The evangelicals who are involved in politics are the Pharisees mixed with the Zealots of our time....honor with their mouths,not their hearts.JMO
Well I'm no fan of organized religion in general and certainly agree that the Mormon Church - like most of the others - does have an anti-gay position. However, having said that, there is NO evidence that Romney will do any more to try and impliment Mormon Church policy than ANY OTHER President has done to try and impliment the policies of THEIR church. He certainly didn't do so as Governor (nor did his dad).
Ken
Last edited by CaseyB; 03-08-2012 at 10:55 AM..
Reason: response to deletion
I don't believe most LDS would say that is exactly accurate. Why does someone's religion, as long as it is not harmful to others, matter when selecting a leader of the US, which is a country of very diverse beliefs. No one can represent all faiths and really shouldn't even try. That is not what the position is there for really. Do you thing someone of Jewish faith would have the same obstacles?
Of they wouldn't say that. That's not a good thing to say, if you are trying to get people to like your religion.
But this is in the Book of Mormon and was taught by their founding elders!
What happened according to the Mormon story was this. In the pre-existence, God the Father convened a “Grand Council” in which two of his sons, Jesus and Satan, came forward and presented alternative plans for the salvation of humankind. Here is how that event is described in the LDS Church-published manual Gospel Principles:
Note these quotes from the Book of Mormon...IN CONTEXT!!
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Our Father said, "Whom shall I send?" (Abraham 3:27). Two of our brothers offered to help. Our oldest brother, Jesus Christ, who was then called Jehovah, said, "Here am I, send me" (Abraham 3:27).
Jesus was willing to come to the earth, give his life for us, and take upon himself our sins. He, like our Heavenly Father, wanted us to choose whether we would obey Heavenly Father's commandments. He knew we must be free to choose in order to prove ourselves worthy of exaltation. Jesus said, "Father, thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever" (Moses 4:2).
Satan, who was called Lucifer, also came, saying, "Behold, here am I, send me, I will be thy son, and I will redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore give me thine honor" (Moses 4:1). Satan wanted to force us all to do his will. Under his plan, we would not be allowed to choose. He would take away the freedom of choice that our Father had given us. Satan wanted to have all the honor for our salvation … After hearing both sons speak, Heavenly Father said, "I will send the first" (Abraham 3:27).
I know they don't talk about this much.
They don't talk about their founders' teachings on black people either.
Do you think evangelicals voting for Santorum are less bigoted towards gays?
Do you think Catholics like Santorum (though he is certainly not a typical Catholic) are less bigoted towards gays?
Yes. Most Catholics today reject a lot of what the church tells them and rely on their own conscience for guidance in matters of the day. Santorum is exceptional in his zeal and I suspect much of it is just show and tell to attract the big kahuna of religious bigots - evangelical Christians. It seems to be working. Getting Catholics to go along en masse is akin to herding cats. Mormons are more dogmatic and less variable. The LDS church actively opposed Prop 8 in California throwing tons of money into advertising the end of the world if it were passed. Same thing on a similar proposal in Arizona. They have fought tooth and nail against gay adoption as well. The Mormons are involved in politics and attempts to steer community morality far more than Catholics are.
I don't know what the distinction might mean in Romney's case however. He seems to be atypical of Mormons having been raised in the east, where Mormons are likely a very small fraction of the political elite, and educated at Harvard. He strikes me as more of a tolerant preppy than a firebrand Mormon - especially the "old" Mitt. His religious practices would not influence his presidency any more than it would a more mainline Christian.
Last edited by Ponderosa; 03-08-2012 at 08:43 AM..
Of they wouldn't say that. That's not a good thing to say, if you are trying to get people to like your religion.
It has nothing to do with wanting people to like our religion. We have no problem whatsoever explaining it, as I already did here.
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But this is in the Book of Mormon and was taught by their founding elders!
What happened according to the Mormon story was this. In the pre-existence, God the Father convened a “Grand Council” in which two of his sons, Jesus and Satan, came forward and presented alternative plans for the salvation of humankind. Here is how that event is described in the LDS Church-published manual Gospel Principles:
Note these quotes from the Book of Mormon...IN CONTEXT!!
Uh... I hate to burst your bubble, but those quotes are not from the Book of Mormon at all.
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I know they don't talk about this much.
There isn't much need to. It's certainly not as if they're hiding it or are embarrassed by it.
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They don't talk about their founders' teachings on black people either.
I'm sure you could elaborate on that, too... probably about as accurately as you did on the quotes you just provided "from the Book of Mormon...IN CONTEXT!!" For your information, Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism, was about as color-blind a man as ever lived. The restriction against Black men holding the priesthood came long after he died. One of the main reasons the Mormons were driven out of Missouri was that they were so staunchly abolitionist.
Of they wouldn't say that. That's not a good thing to say, if you are trying to get people to like your religion.
But this is in the Book of Mormon and was taught by their founding elders!
What happened according to the Mormon story was this. In the pre-existence, God the Father convened a “Grand Council” in which two of his sons, Jesus and Satan, came forward and presented alternative plans for the salvation of humankind. Here is how that event is described in the LDS Church-published manual Gospel Principles:
Note these quotes from the Book of Mormon...IN CONTEXT!!
The problem with your explanation of the matter is that you are utterly failing to provide the proper context for the Mormon point of view. I already explained this once but I don't mind doing it again.
Traditional Christianity and Mormonism are in complete agreement on the Biblical account that Satan is Lucifer, a fallen angel -- and apparently a a very high ranking angel.
The difference is, Mormonism has a vastly different idea of what an angel is. To Catholics and most Protestants, angels are some nonhuman species of heavenly messengers that work for God. Mormonism views them as humans who either haven't been born yet or have lived and died as a righteous person.
Most Christians believe that our spirit comes into existence at conception or sometime shortly thereafter. From the Mormon point of view, our spirits existed long before we were born and long before the creation of the world and our spirits are literally the children and offspring of God the Father. But the raw essence of each of us actually has no beginning. The firstborn child offspring of God the Father ("born" an eternity ago apparently?) was Jesus Christ and His role as the Savior of mankind was always His and His alone. He was Omnipotent and Omniscient just as the Father is and was. Another of God's spiritual offspring -- Lucifer -- petitioned to usurp Jesus' destined role as Savior of mankind. Lucifer wanted to be made God's equal apparently and that was his true motive. Apparently he proposed take away our freedom of choice so that everyone could be forced to live righteously and so that none of God's children would be lost. The Father refused, the alternate plan was rejected, Lucifer and his followers rebelled and they were all cast out of Heaven, becoming the Devil and his angels.
In context of Mormon theology, the idea that Lucifer was a younger brother (an eternity younger apparently) of Jesus is just logical because they believe angels are just non-mortal human beings and that all of humankind are literally children of God the Father. That is the proper context. Mormonism just sees a lot of things very differently than other Christian faiths.
Well, I've heard that before. The way the word has come to be used, it basically means, "the church down the street from mine that I don't like."
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Polygamy
Yup, at one time in the Church's history, roughly 5% of all Mormon men had more than one wife at a time. The practice was discontinued well over 100 years ago and is today an excommunicable offense.
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Pedifile's
The word is actually "pedophiles" and in all honesty, this is the first time I've ever heard Mormons described as being pedophiles.
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Mormons can only marry other Mormons.
Really? Tell that to my Mormon son and daughter and their non-Mormon spouses.
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The 1st 3 perceptions are enough to scare the hell outta most Americans. True or false, don't know, don't care since I won't be voting for him nor Santorum.
Yeah, what's scary is that people actually believe everything they hear or read.
(P.S. I'm a Mormon who will probably be voting for Obama.)
Satan, who was called Lucifer, also came, saying, "Behold, here am I, send me, I will be thy son, and I will redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore give me thine honor" (Moses 4:1). Satan wanted to force us all to do his will. Under his plan, we would not be allowed to choose. He would take away the freedom of choice that our Father had given us. Satan wanted to have all the honor for our salvation … After hearing both sons speak, Heavenly Father said, "I will send the first" (Abraham 3:27).
Satan, who was called Lucifer, also came, saying, "Behold, here am I, send me, I will be thy son, and I will redeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore give me thine honor" (Moses 4:1). Satan wanted to force us all to do his will. Under his plan, we would not be allowed to choose. He would take away the freedom of choice that our Father had given us. Satan wanted to have all the honor for our salvation … After hearing both sons speak, Heavenly Father said, "I will send the first" (Abraham 3:27).
Hmmm. Sounds like Santorum and the Republicans.
LOL, interesting and unexpected parallel. IMHO, the golden standard of government's right to mess with our freedom to choose = Your right to swing your fist around ends when it hits me in the nose. We should have the right to do as we choose as long as we are not hurting anyone else in the process. The United States government has long failed to live up to this ideal, but I think it we can get there.
I do think that the government doing too much for the people can be just as bad. Anyone who can milk the system and do nothing for years and years is being denied their right to grow stronger as a person. Welfare has its place but it really needs to be done differently.
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For your information, Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism, was about as color-blind a man as ever lived. The restriction against Black men holding the priesthood came long after he died. One of the main reasons the Mormons were driven out of Missouri was that they were so staunchly abolitionist.
