Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
What specific actions of Grozny indicate mental issue? (Perhaps it is better to go to the Russian thread.)
It would be too long of a read/description of all the details/events that would depict his character, so I would choose one that particularly stuck in my memory;
"Ivan, who assumed that his every public act enjoyed divine approval, did not hesitate to work the same cruel punishment upon wayward clergymen that he imposed upon laymen. Priests were dragged from their altars to be flogged, flayed, or broken on the rack with no regard for the sanctity of their position.
During the sack of Novgorod in 1570 the city's archbishop was trussed up in a bearskin and fed to the hounds.
And yet Ivan, knowing no peace of mind after he killed his own son, followed custom in abdicating and becoming a monk a few moments before his death."
Melvin G Wren
"The Course of Russian History."
P.S. And before you'll tell that it's "just another Westerner' that writes god know what about Russian history, and Ivan the Great in particular," I assure you - it's one of the best, in-depth and fascinating books on Russian history I've ever read.
His portrait of Ivan the Terrible including, to whom he referred as "mentally unbalanced philosopher upon a throne." ( Well it's not his personal reference, but he uses it in his book.)
It would be too long of a read/description of all the details/events that would depict his character, so I would choose one that particularly stuck in my memory;
"Ivan, who assumed that his every public act enjoyed divine approval, did not hesitate to work the same cruel punishment upon wayward clergymen that he imposed upon laymen. Priests were dragged from their altars to be flogged, flayed, or broken on the rack with no regard for the sanctity of their position.
During the sack of Novgorod in 1570 the city's archbishop was trussed up in a bearskin and fed to the hounds.
And yet Ivan, knowing no peace of mind after he killed his own son, followed custom in abdicating and becoming a monk a few moments before his death."
Melvin G Wren
"The Course of Russian History."
P.S. And before you'll tell that it's "just another Westerner' that writes god know what about Russian history, and Ivan the Great in particular," I assure you - it's one of the best, in-depth and fascinating books on Russian history I've ever read.
His portrait of Ivan the Terrible including, to whom he referred as "mentally unbalanced philosopher upon a throne." ( Well it's not his personal reference, but he uses it in his book.)
Sorry I was obviously talking about Ivan the Terrible, not his grand-father ( Ivan the Great (Ivan III))
This is funny to us. But, unfortunately, most Westerners believe this. After all, this video is not made for the Russian audience, but for the Western one. After all, most of them do not understand that these are exaggerated stereotypes, they believe in what they see. And then you and I wonder why they tell us that Russia is poor and there devastation, drunks and bandits. This is called propaganda.
So YOU are not affected by propaganda but you claim to know what most Westerners believe. Interesting.
You’re wrong. Anyone here watching this Simpsons parody will immediately understand that this is not a realistic depiction of today’s Russia, just like anyone watching the Simpsons knows that it is not meant to be a realistic portrayal of America.
Anyone prone to believe these stereotypes does not need a 1-minute art film to convince themselves that Russia is dirty, ugly and heartless. Why do you care? Idiots have no nationality.
One of the few positive aspects of the virus is how it shuts down both far left and far right retards.
Left: "Look at Sweden...they're better than those eastern european gipsies" (lmao)
Right: "Look at Putin, no cases in Russia because they're white and christian" lol...
Unless someone finds a political movement which claims the best countries are Slovakia,Hungary and Japan it's pointless at this point (though I've been saying similar things for many years, who knew...).
Reindeer herder is a perfectly respectable profession.
Yes, in Mansi area, somewhere in the "boonies of Siberia")))
And that's where he was supposed to stay, that's what part of Moscovites meant by it))
Quote:
Why do some Muscovites hate him? Is he one of the Tsar's cronies?
Because part of Moscovites ( the indigenous ones ) hate what he is doing to Moscow, turning it into the "commercial project," instead of keeping the city true to its history and culture. ( Which, I think, is nearly impossible under the circumstances, since half of the country is moving there - that's how the economy is set.)
So yes, Sobyanin is definitely one of the Tzar's cronies.
But a lot of other people who moved to Moscow recently actually like him, since they like this image of shiny, faceless megalopolis that Moscow became.
Yes, in Mansi area, somewhere in the "boonies of Siberia")))
And that's where he was supposed to stay, that's what part of Moscovites meant by it))
Because part of Moscovites ( the indigenous ones ) hate what he is doing to Moscow, turning it into the "commercial project," instead of keeping the city true to its history and culture. ( Which, I think, is nearly impossible under the circumstances, since half of the country is moving there - that's how the economy is set.)
So yes, Sobyanin is definitely one of the Tzar's cronies.
But a lot of other people who moved to Moscow recently actually like him, since they like this image of shiny, faceless megalopolis that Moscow became.
Thank you.
So, historic preservation isn't very strong in Moscow? Are there any citizens' groups or official organizations advocating to preserve this or that architectural monument? Still, even with many sites preserved, it would all get lost in the building boom that's been taking place over the years and decades, I imagine.
So, historic preservation isn't very strong in Moscow?
No, unfortunately so.
Quote:
Are there any citizens' groups or official organizations advocating to preserve this or that architectural monument?
Yes, and they were fighting tooth and nail to preserve some of the historic sites/ buildings.
But to no avail, when it comes to "commercial interests."
In Putin's/Sobyanin Moscow $$$ and "status quo" is all that matters.
( They are not the "native Moscovites," remember?)
Quote:
Still, even with many sites preserved, it would all get lost in the building boom that's been taking place over the years and decades, I imagine.
And it WAS lost, starting with previous mayor of Moscow Luzhkov and his wifey Baturina who owned the *construction company* in Moscow and now happily reside somewhere in the West
As, in fact, the rest of the "new Russians" generation of thugs.
So YOU are not affected by propaganda but you claim to know what most Westerners believe. Interesting.
You’re wrong. Anyone here watching this Simpsons parody will immediately understand that this is not a realistic depiction of today’s Russia, just like anyone watching the Simpsons knows that it is not meant to be a realistic portrayal of America.
Anyone prone to believe these stereotypes does not need a 1-minute art film to convince themselves that Russia is dirty, ugly and heartless. Why do you care? Idiots have no nationality.
You have not watched the film "Leviathan"? I do not advise you to watch it ,just find a description. I have read the reviews of Western viewers about this film. Many people believed that everything that is shown in the film is actually happening.
That's the whole point of the film in two frames.
I am simply saying that in the light of recent political trends, it is customary to demonize Russia. And some individuals and our and not our, either stupidly, or hoping to earn some dividends are trying organizing various attacks on Russia. And knowing from the inside how things really are, it really makes me laugh, reading and watching all this heresy.
You have not watched the film "Leviathan"? I do not advise you to watch it ,just find a description. I have read the reviews of Western viewers about this film. Many people believed that everything that is shown in the film is actually happening.
That's the whole point of the film in two frames.
I am simply saying that in the light of recent political trends, it is customary to demonize Russia. And some individuals and our and not our, either stupidly, or hoping to earn some dividends are trying in every way to curry favor with the United States in this matter by organizing various attacks on Russia. And knowing from the inside how things really are, it really makes me laugh, reading and watching all this heresy.
It has always been customary to demonize Russia. It has never NOT been customary, except possibly before 1917.
And yet Ivan, knowing no peace of mind after he killed his own son, followed custom in abdicating and becoming a monk a few moments before his death."
Ivan the Terrible's murder of his son is very, very doubtful. This is essentially a myth.
Quote:
The fact of the murder of Tsar John Vasilyevich the Terrible his son Prince John, until recently, seemed indisputable, because it is reflected even in school textbooks as one of the evidence about the alleged cruelty of the Russian autocracy. And no one wondered where was this fact in historical literature. But what misleading documents? Find the answer dedicated to the Russian publicist and historian Colonel Nicholas Samaganova.
Seeing in 1885 in St. Petersburg at the exhibition new painting of Ilya Repin "Ivan the terrible and his son Ivan November 16, 1581", which later became known as simplified name "Ivan the terrible kills his son", the Ober-Procurator of the Holy Synod and the Russian philosopher Konstantin Petrovich Pobedonostsev was extremely indignant its plot, in which the invention was given as fact, and wrote to the Emperor Alexander III: "can Not be called a historical picture, this moment... purely fantastic."
What misleading documents? In the Moscow chronicler of 7090 (1581) year written: "...died there tsarevitch John Ioannovich". Piskarevskiy chronicler points in more detail: "on the 12th hour of the night summer of 7090 November, 17 day... the repose of Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich". In the Novgorod fourth chronicle says: "the same (7090) year died there tsarevitch John Ioannovich at Matins in the village..." Morozov record States: "... became Tsarevich Ivan Ivanovich". As you can see, about the murder of a word.
As for the evidence of the death of Prince John from poisoning, they are quite reasonable. V. Manegin in the book "the Leader of the Church militant" (2003) writes: "about the disease we can say definitely – it was mercuric chloride poisoning. Death, resulting, painful, and the dose causing such an outcome does not exceed 0.18 gram". Who set it? "
In 1963, in the Archangel Cathedral of the Moscow Kremlin, writes Managin, was opened four tombs: Ivan the terrible, Tsarevich Ivan, Tsar Feodor Ivanovich and commander of Skopin-Shuisky. In the study of the remains was tested version of the poisoning of Ivan the terrible. Scientists found that the arsenic content is approximately the same in all four skeletons and does not exceed the norm. But in the bones of king John and Prince John had discovered the presence of mercury, far exceeding the acceptable norm. Some historians tried to argue that it was not a poisoning, a consequence of the treatment of syphilis with mercury ointment. However, studies have shown that syphilitic changes in the remains of the Tsar and the Tsarevich was not detected. Not been discovered in the remains of the Tsarevich and the damage he could get from his father's blow with his staff. After 1990-ies conducted a study of the graves of the Moscow Grand duchesses and Queens, was revealed the fact of poisoning with corrosive sublimate of the same mother of Ivan Vasilyevich Elena Vasilyevna Glinskaya (died 1538) and his first wife Anastasia Romanova (died in 1560)".
The Royal family for several decades, was a victim of poisoners. Among deliberately killed the Prince John. The contents of the poison in his remains many times higher than the acceptable norm. ↑ "History of Russia was written by her enemies" Who is the author of the slander on Ivan the terrible? The names this writer and his followers are known. Their inventions – only links in the chain of lies about our great past. Metropolitan John believed that "a decisive influence on the formation resonancelike beliefs "historical science" had evidence of foreigners".
The same was discussed and a prominent researcher of ancient Sergey Paramonov in the book "Where are you from, Russia?", which he published under the pseudonym Sergei Forest: "Our history was written by Germans, who did not know or poorly know Russian language." Example of lying Norman theory, the myth of the vocation of the Vikings and other myths. That the authors of works on Russian history were foreigners, was stressed by Soviet academician B. A. Rybakov. He, in particular, wrote: "During the time of Biron, when to defend Russian start in whatever it was very hard in St. Petersburg, in the environment invited from the German principalities of scientists, the idea of borrowing statehood Slavs from Northern German tribes. The Slavs IX-X centuries were considered "living zverinsky way" (an expression Normanists), and builders and creators of the state was declared North of the predatory troops of the Vikings, the Normans hired on by different rulers and to keep at Bay the Northern Europe.
So, by the pen of Siegfried Bayer, Gerard Miller and August Schlozer was born the idea of normannizm it, which is often called Norman theory, although the entire amount normanelizisab statements in two centuries does not give the right to the name of normannizm it is not just a theory, but even a hypothesis because there is no analysis of sources or overview of all the known facts."
It would seem that we are talking about the era that are not related to our topic. But if you do not understand the desire of the West to distort the truth about our great past, it is difficult to believe in what is written about Ivan the terrible foreigners – the usual lies. "With a light hand Karamzin became a sign of good taste liberally smear this era of black paint, wrote Metropolitan John. – Even the most conservative historians-Marxists considered it their duty to pay tribute to Russophobic rhetoric, speaking of "savagery", "ferocity", "ignorance", "terror" as a self-evident features of the era." Moreover, the evidence of the alleged horrors of the era Moscow Russia for historians was not eyewitness accounts, not historical data, not testimony to the court, recorded and preserved by the archives, and calumnies of Western envoys.
The myth of Cenobite and other false myths have not only been essential in order to put the king in the eyes of the descendants of the bloodthirsty tyrant, but also to prove to the Western world, by the time the "famous" horrors of the Inquisition that in Muscovy orders not better. "Starting with Karamzin – wrote Metropolitan John, – Russian historians reproduced in his writings all the filth and dirt, which poured over Russia, foreign guests, and creative "heritage" such as Staden and Possevin for a long time was seen as evidence of the life and customs of the Russian people."
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
