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There are some people who have a lot more money than I do. How did they get so rich? Because they are more ethical than I am? No. Because they know how to use technicalities to their own advantage. The technicality they use most often to line their pockets is the non-negotiable unilateral business contract that they write, to serve their own purposes. I can't change it, but I can technically comply with it to level the playing field.
There are many cases of unethical rich people, obviously, but perhaps many of them get rich by being more intelligent than you are and being willing to take on more risk. The proverbial example is Bill Gates or the Google guys, who happened to be smart enough to pioneer something truly new and eminently useful, and who had the balls to invest in it and drive it from a start-up to a successful company. Or, in a different setting, perhaps a neurosurgeon or a lawyer with deep expertise in international trade; they both invested a lot to learn the skills that enable them to command a significant premium in the marketplace. In other words, perhaps many of the rich people deserve to be richer than you.
Also, I don't know how often the contracts that enrich people are truly are "unilateral"; generally, businesses contracts exist because opportunities exist for two parties to transact in a way that leaves both of them better off per their prioritized desires. At any rate, you do usually have a choice about it: just don't consume the good or service that comes with the unilateral contract. Then you are not bound by it. But I digress...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88
There is absolutely nothing unethical about A using technicalities in a contract that B wrote and unilaterally imposed, un-negotiated. Do you see that that makes NO difference?
You are basically arguing that because the company's policy enables it, it's ethical. It's not. It's not illegal, but it is absolutely ethically questionable to take advantage of the circumstances to cheat the seller out of payment for goods that you consume. Maybe the company should investigate ways to amend its policy to prevent people from taking inappropriate advantage of it, but that's a different unrelated issue.
It's similar to a situation where someone come across a wallet that someone accidentally left behind. If you're alone, there's nothing to stop you from removing the cash, putting it in your pocket, and walking away. No one will ever find out. And you can rationalize that the stiff should have taken better care of his belongings and that you technically didn't steal it; you're just person A, taking advantage of a technicality that person B unilaterally imposed upon you, un-negotiated. Person B "enabled" you.
It's still stealing. And it's still classless. And it's still dishonorable and unethical. Even if person B is a clueless moron, it still doesn't make it ethically right for you to take advantage of the situation.
The ethical maxim is that when you choose to enter into a sale transaction with a seller in order to consume a good or service, then you should pay that seller the price that both of you agreed upon. You deserve to then consume the good or service, and the seller deserves to keep the payment (assuming that you had no valid quality issues or anything else warranting a return). You do not happily consume the good or service and then scheme for ways to get all your money back. If you don't want to part with your money, then don't consume the good or service and leave it for someone else who is willing to pay the seller for it. That is the ethical bottom line. Would you like to be exploited into giving away the product of your labor for free?
Do you see that it does, in fact, make a difference, no matter how much you try to cynically rationalize it away? I'm guessing you don't, which I think is a shame.
Thats thievery Homeslice. If you were frugal you would suck it up and wait 2-3 wks for books@ the library. Small acts like yours are what make prices of consumer goods go up.
You are basically arguing that because the company's policy enables it, it's ethical. It's not. It's not illegal, but it is absolutely ethically questionable to take advantage of the circumstances to cheat the seller out of payment for goods that you consume. Maybe the company should investigate ways to amend its policy to prevent people from taking inappropriate advantage of it, but that's a different unrelated issue.
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If A makes all the rules, it is never unethical for B to play by those rules. If A doesnt like its own rules, it can change them, unilaterally, non-negotiably, without notice, covertly, even retroactively, and nobody questions the ethicality of that.
If somebody else makes non-negotiable rules unilaterally, it is not theft to conform with their rules. The store has an opportunity to examine the merchandise, and if they determine that it is in salable condition as new, and accepts it on that basis, in conformity with their own return policy, nothing has been done that is wrong.
I read "The Road", "Thirteen Moons", "Kite Runners" and several other books sitting in the easy chairs at Borders for an hour a day.
Where you honest and told them you read the book before returning it. Buying and returning the used book is using is plain old theft.You stole from the author as well who sells hius product to those who want to read it. Why not just go to the libary and be honest for a change.
If I need a screwdriver, why not go to Home Depot or Lowe's, buy one, use it--then return it to the store for full credit after I've finished using it? I got the benefit of using the tool, and didn't pay anything for it. Does that work? Is it ethical?
What if I buy a gallon of paint, and only need half of it--can I get some sort of credit for the half I did NOT use? Answer: no.
Originally Posted by jtur88 If somebody else makes non-negotiable rules unilaterally, it is not theft to conform with their rules. The store has an opportunity to examine the merchandise, and if they determine that it is in salable condition as new, and accepts it on that basis, in conformity with their own return policy, nothing has been done that is wrong.
Oh, come now, we're not really that dim. Governments make rules, private businesses make rules, heck, even private citizens make rules "unilaterally" about what is acceptable behavior on their own property (and a bookstore is a private business and completely entitled to make its own rules - there is no "contract" with a book store, there is simply the granted right, which can be revoked for cause, to do business there.
Try to twist it as you might, the return policy is there to accommodate those with legitimate problems with the merchandise (from a page is missing to it was a gift and I already have one), not "But I want to use your merchandise and not pay for it!" If the returnee is honest regarding the reason for returning it and discloses the above, I seriously doubt that that would fall under the criteria established under the return policy.
Returning Items Bought in Barnes & Noble Bookstores
Barnes & Noble Bookstores make it easy to return an item when you are not satisfied.
Simply bring the item and your cash register receipt to your local Barnes & Noble Bookstore for a refund to your original form of payment or, if you have a gift receipt, for a refund as a gift card. Please call your local Barnes & Noble Bookstore for more information.
That is the return policy as stated on Barnes and Noble's website (Help Desk: Refund and Return Policy - Barnes*&*Noble). I bolded the key part. It would take some huge amounts of stretching to define what the OP does as falling under this policy.
So if my friend buys me a book at B&N and I already have that book, does that constitute "not satisfied". NO. So, not returnable.
Keep stretching that way to try to make unethical seem ethical and you're going to break into two pieces!
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