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I have never heard of anyone coming up with an explanation on how people can know stuff that occurred after they were "dead". You can explain away feelings, visions of light, etc. that people get in their experiences if you want, and there may be some validity in those explanations. I remember one story I heard of, in particular, that can't be easily explained away, though. It was of a man whose heart stopped while he was in his house, yet he witnessed the ambulance pulling up to his house outside and saw his friend outside of the house having a conversation on the phone (or something like that, don't really remember). He was able to describe this in detail when he came back around, and it was stuff that he had no possibility of knowing. You can't just dismiss those situations as hallucinations of a dying mind.
Are you suggesting or trying to prove that "the soul" had left the body and saw it all, then came back into the body? Or, was this a case of the man being conscious all the time, even with his heart stopped?
To repeat the question I posed above, what makes a soul stay in the body or get out of it?
Oh good grief people... There are perfectly logical and factual scientific reasons why some people report feelings or things they experience when they almost die. There's nothing afterlife or supernatural or religious about it.
Seeing into the future, seems a little hard for logic and science to explain for right now...
Oh good grief people... There are perfectly logical and factual scientific reasons why some people report feelings or things they experience when they almost die. There's nothing afterlife or supernatural or religious about it.
I agree, there very may well be. I think the "supernatural" can probably be explained with science that's more advanced than we have now. In fact, I get the feeling we're on the brink with theories like M-Theory.
I don't know of any current scientific explanation for out-of-body experiences, especially in the case of say, congenitally blind people, who can see during their out-of-body experience. I posted an earlier link of a woman who was totally blind from birth and could see during her near-death experience, and I personally could see 20/20 during my OBE's as a child despite being legally blind. Do you have any explanations in mind? (I'm genuinely curious, not trying to bate you.)
After reading more of the posts on this thread it dawned on me that we really are lacking in understanding the human potential, our overall capability to "see" or 'feel" things that aren't apparent may be limited but there are so many cases of these unexplainable sensations that it makes me wonder just how much we don't know about the cognitive process. Organized religion has been for the most part a barrier to the open and inquisitive mind, the high Priest's want to ascribe their own interpretation to our unexplainable experiences, complete with the usual admonishments regarding those who might dare to question them.
Those feelings of having some kind of extrasensory ability may very well be explained some day by further investigation, at present I'm satisfied to think that there is certainly more to the human mind than we have been led to believe. The evolution of our physical attributes may be slowing while the biggest changes are occurring in the mind, it wasn't that long ago that the questions and comments on this thread would have been cause for our being tortured by those fun loving Christians of the inquisition period. Science has been the thing that religions have feared for ages, after all it's nice to have a monopoly on all of life's questions and answers. I'll be OK in the meantime with the big mystery concept.
Yes, as a Christian, I believe we have souls, but I do think it's a faith premise, if you will. I don't believe it's something that can likely be "proven" scientifically (though there may be "evidence" of it.)
Are you suggesting or trying to prove that "the soul" had left the body and saw it all, then came back into the body? Or, was this a case of the man being conscious all the time, even with his heart stopped?
To repeat the question I posed above, what makes a soul stay in the body or get out of it?
I'm not questioning or trying to prove anything. As a religious person, I do believe that we have souls, but I understand that isn't something that can't be proven or rejected. As to the case I stated, I don't think it could have had anything to do with him being conscious even while his heart stopped because the things that he witnessed and described took place in a completely different location from where he was located. The only way that would have worked out is if people where talking in detail about what they were doing during the whole situation while he was out, and maybe that's the case of what happened here. All I was trying to get across with the story is that the situations can't all be easily explained away by scientific data. There are plenty of NDE that fall into the category of the unexplainable. Whether someone wants to sum it up as the evidence of a soul or they want to take the stance that it is something that we will eventually have a scientific explanation for someday, it's up to them. Either way, as of now, those experiences cannot just be dismissed. As to what makes a soul stay in the body or get out of it, I have no idea. In the case of these people, it could be the fact that when you are close to death your soul leaves the body and then is drawn back to it as you are revived. That doesn't explain people that have out of body experiences while they are perfectly alive, though.
I think there are a lot of factors we are consciously aware of, scientifically based, but I think the answer to your question is absolutely yes. Just because we can not prove something is there does not mean it is not there.
Although I am in no way religious, I "believe" I have pre-birth memories. I have been laughed at over the years when I relate them but I have memories of my "soul" for lack of a better word, being somewhere else, aware that I was about to be born and not looking forward to it but knowing it was to be. I related memories from as early as I can remember (like age 3 -4) of experiences during and after birth. No one has ever taken me seriously and I'm not sure that I blame them. But, I've always wondered if there are other people who experienced what they believe to be pre-birth and birth memories. I'm not some crazy new ager, I have just had those memories for as long as I can recall.
I'm not questioning or trying to prove anything. As a religious person, I do believe that we have souls, but I understand that isn't something that can't be proven or rejected. As to the case I stated, I don't think it could have had anything to do with him being conscious even while his heart stopped because the things that he witnessed and described took place in a completely different location from where he was located. The only way that would have worked out is if people where talking in detail about what they were doing during the whole situation while he was out, and maybe that's the case of what happened here. All I was trying to get across with the story is that the situations can't all be easily explained away by scientific data. There are plenty of NDE that fall into the category of the unexplainable. Whether someone wants to sum it up as the evidence of a soul or they want to take the stance that it is something that we will eventually have a scientific explanation for someday, it's up to them. Either way, as of now, those experiences cannot just be dismissed. As to what makes a soul stay in the body or get out of it, I have no idea. In the case of these people, it could be the fact that when you are close to death your soul leaves the body and then is drawn back to it as you are revived. That doesn't explain people that have out of body experiences while they are perfectly alive, though.
Then you're operating solely on a belief system, nothing that you can prove. As for science, it can't prove something that doesn't exist.
Science can, however, make people see things with simple experiments, as well as change their perceptions.
Yes, as a Christian, I believe we have souls, but I do think it's a faith premise, if you will. I don't believe it's something that can likely be "proven" scientifically (though there may be "evidence" of it.)
If there is evidence, science can go for it. The fact is... there is none.
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