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Old 04-14-2020, 07:29 AM
 
Location: New York Area
35,125 posts, read 17,087,061 times
Reputation: 30278

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Many of these changes created by the Covid-19 pandemic are erasing our identity as human beings. We cannot send our children to school. We cannot send our preschool children to socializing nursery school. We cannot enjoy the benefits of the arts, including music and museums. The question is, what distinguishes us from primates from which we emerged?

This is not far-fetched. When our state governors have thoughtlessly closed down businesses with no plan of reopening, they erase much of what distinguishes a human being from the animals. From the point of view of appearance, how long can we all go without a haircut? We are all going to be very messy look in short order, except of course those that surreptitiously have a “home visit” from a barber or hairstylist.

Much of what has made human society distinct from the animal kingdom comes from the socializing and collective experience of enjoying music and visual art. We don’t know why painting started, but it started on the walls of the caves. Doubtless cave people got together to admire those paintings. More recently, artists have created great works of art, by Michelangelo, Picasso, and others.

Live performance music is another collectively civilizing experience. From festivals such as Woodstock to the folk coffeehouses, in other venues, music is designed to be enjoyed in groups. The presence of applause or lack of applause shape what musicians do.

Religion is another such shaper of socialization. I cannot imagine the cheerlessness of a world without weddings, Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, confirmations, Christmas Mass, the Hajj in Mecca, and other such events. In short, humans are gregarious species. We need people.

All of this is potentially lost in the mad dash towards “social distancing.” What is most alarming is it the same people who have fought hardest for social distancing fight hard against cures or ameliorative treatment They insist on lengthy testing intervals that will make the proposed treatment irrelevant.

All such people are not created equal when it comes to distancing. Does one seriously think that Bill and Melinda Gates are doing their own house cleaning in there probably large house in Kirkland, Washington? Or are they using paid labor? Would Governor Gretchen Witham (sp) of Michigan approve?

Similarly, they can afford to have you musicians and comedians come to entertain them. There is a tradition for this; the royal house of Esterhazy in Vienna had Haydn as an in house composer for much of his life, and accompanying musicians. Do we want people only with the wealth of the House of Esterhazy to be able to afford to be entertained?

I am certainly not advocating a chaotic reopening however, we must have a time frame within which religious institutions, schools come a preschool, concert halls and alike will reopen. I watched the press conference yesterday with six Northeastern governors. All I heard was a vague plan to make a vague plan. Society and the world must open for the non-wealth.

Last edited by elnina; 04-16-2020 at 12:29 AM..

 
Old 04-14-2020, 07:56 AM
 
13,285 posts, read 8,474,479 times
Reputation: 31520
Homo sapiens are in the animal kingdom.
Some evolve .
And some devolve by risking money over the larger picture of health and safety.
 
Old 04-14-2020, 08:20 AM
 
Location: New York Area
35,125 posts, read 17,087,061 times
Reputation: 30278
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nov3 View Post
Homo sapiens are in the animal kingdom.
Some evolve .
And some devolve by risking money over the larger picture of health and safety.
Do we stay in a fetal lockdown position?
 
Old 04-14-2020, 08:44 AM
 
Location: In the middle between the sun and moon
534 posts, read 490,191 times
Reputation: 2081
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Many of these changes created by the Covid-19 pandemic are erasing our identity as human beings. We cannot send our children to school. We cannot send our preschool children to socializing nursery school. We cannot enjoy the benefits of the arts, including music and museums. The question is, what that distinguishes us from primates from which we emerged?

This is not far-fetched. When our state governors have thoughtlessly closed down businesses with no plan of reopening, they erase much of what distinguishes a human being from the animals. From the point of view of appearance, how long can we all go without haircut? We are all going to be very messy look in short order, except of course those that surreptitiously have a “home visit” from a barber or hair stylist.

Much of what has made human society distinct from the animal kingdom comes from the socializing and collective experience of enjoying music and visual art. We don’t know why painting started, but it started on the walls of caves. Doubtless cave people got together to admire those paintings. More recently, artists have created great works of art, by Michelangelo, Picasso, and others.

Live performance music is another collectively civilizing experience. From festivals such as Woodstock to the folk coffeehouses, in other venues, music is designed to be enjoyed in groups. The presence of applause or lack of applause shape what musicians do.

Religion is another such shaper of socialization. I cannot imagine the cheerlessness of a world without weddings, Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, confirmations, Christmas Mass, the Hajj in Mecca, and other such events. In short, humans are a gregarious species. We need people.

All of this is potentially lost in the mad dash towards “social distancing.” What is most alarming is it the same people who have fought hardest for social distancing fight hard against cures or ameliorative treatment They insist on a lengthy testing intervals that will make the proposed treatment irrelevant.

All such people are not created equal when it comes to distancing. Does one seriously think that Bill and Melinda Gates are doing their own house cleaning in there probably large house in Kirkland, Washington? Or are they using paid labor? Would Governor Gretchen Witham (sp) of Michigan approve?

Similarly, they can afford to have you musicians and comedians come to entertain them. There is a tradition for this; the royal house of Esterhazy in Vienna had Haydn as an in house composer for much of his life, and accompanying musicians. Do we want people only with the wealth of the House of Esterhazy to be able to afford to be entertained?

I am certainly not advocating a chaotic reopening however, we must have a time frame within which religious institutions, schools come a preschool, concert halls and alike will reopen. I watched the press conference yesterday with six Northeastern governors. All I heard was a vague plan to make a vague plan. Society and the world must open for the non-wealth.
Erasing your identity as a human being? Is your sense of self really that rocky, or are you just feeing dramatic?

Has the Covid19 changes taken your self-awareness and your sense of agency? The fact that you can even express an abstract thought like "All my things are gone and I'm maybe becoming like a primate!" distinguishes you from animals. If your identity as a human being rests on the presence of the things you use or do, well, you might want to examine that one a little deeper.

Your human identity is not dependent on things, it's your own sense of existence, independent of outside objects, it's internal to you.

Maybe just try not to fling poop at the walls and you'll probably come out of this with your humanity intact.

Last edited by elnina; 04-16-2020 at 12:30 AM..
 
Old 04-14-2020, 09:24 AM
 
3,354 posts, read 1,187,211 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Do we stay in a fetal lockdown position?
People are being productive and enjoying life. People are finding other ways to spend time. Humans have the ability to adapt and make the best of our circumstances.
 
Old 04-14-2020, 12:51 PM
 
Location: New York Area
35,125 posts, read 17,087,061 times
Reputation: 30278
Quote:
Originally Posted by aileesic View Post
People are being productive and enjoying life. People are finding other ways to spend time. Humans have the ability to adapt and make the best of our circumstances.
To any extent yes. But not forever.
 
Old 04-14-2020, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,943,484 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
To any extent yes. But not forever.
Actually, there are people who lived shut-in before the outbreak. They are wondering what all the fuss is about. Others are enjoying the freedom to do most of what they want to do without other people around. They are the ones calling the non-emergency police numbers to report people not following the 'shelter-in-place' laws. They themselves are not following the 'shelter-in-place' laws. If you are a control freak administration that only wants your people in their homes this is a good start. Of course they aren't very productive that way. What to do? "Easing" open the country means allowing select workers to to what is "essential" or ... "worthy". Some forms of self-expression may never come back. I wouldn't say we are becoming animals but we definitely have become less human.
 
Old 04-14-2020, 02:45 PM
 
13,285 posts, read 8,474,479 times
Reputation: 31520
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Do we stay in a fetal lockdown position?
Not sure what culture you proclaim to convey adults are in fetal lockdown positions.
Most homosapiens maintain an upright position in stature. The fact we are proactive in maintaining social distancing and perhaps limiting exposure is an anedote til a new more permanent vaccine can be generated.
 
Old 04-14-2020, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Chicago
2,236 posts, read 2,410,077 times
Reputation: 5894
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Many of these changes created by the Covid-19 pandemic are erasing our identity as human beings. We cannot send our children to school. We cannot send our preschool children to socializing nursery school. We cannot enjoy the benefits of the arts, including music and museums. The question is, what that distinguishes us from primates from which we emerged?

This is not far-fetched. When our state governors have thoughtlessly closed down businesses with no plan of reopening, they erase much of what distinguishes human being from the animals. From the point of view of appearance, how long can we all go without a haircut? We are all going to be very messy look in short order, except of course those that surreptitiously have a “home visit” from a barber or hair stylist.

Much of what has made human society distinct from the animal kingdom comes from the socializing and collective experience of enjoying music and visual art. We don’t know why painting started, but it started on the walls of caves. Doubtless cave people got together to admire those paintings. More recently, artists have created great works of art, by Michelangelo, Picasso, and others.

Live performance music is another collectively civilizing experience. From festivals such as Woodstock to the folk coffeehouses, in other venues, music is designed to be enjoyed in groups. The presence of applause or lack of applause shape what musicians do.

Religion is another such shaper of socialization. I cannot imagine the cheerlessness of a world without weddings, Bar or Bat Mitzvahs, confirmations, Christmas Mass, the Hajj in Mecca, and other such events. In short, humans are gregarious species. We need people.

All of this is potentially lost in the mad dash towards “social distancing.” What is most alarming is it the same people who have fought hardest for social distancing fight hard against cures or ameliorative treatment They insist on lengthy testing intervals that will make the proposed treatment irrelevant.

All such people are not created equal when it comes to distancing. Does one seriously think that Bill and Melinda Gates are doing their own house cleaning in there probably large house in Kirkland, Washington? Or are they using paid labor? Would Governor Gretchen Witham (sp) of Michigan approve?

Similarly, they can afford to have you musicians and comedians come to entertain them. There is a tradition for this; the royal house of Esterhazy in Vienna had Haydn as an in house composer for much of his life, and accompanying musicians. Do we want people only with the wealth of the House of Esterhazy to be able to afford to be entertained?

I am certainly not advocating a chaotic reopening however, we must have a time frame within which religious institutions, schools come a preschool, concert halls and alike will reopen. I watched the press conference yesterday with six Northeastern governors. All I heard was a vague plan to make a vague plan. Society and the world must open for the non-wealth.
That's why I don't take anything politicians or the wealthy elite say about this pandemic seriously. They won't suffer economically like most of Americans will from this crisis, so it's easy for them to tell others to stay at home until a vaccine comes out. They don't live in the real world. And I don't think all of these social distancing rules apply to them either.. Just the other week, the mayor of Chicago got a haircut... she caught a lot of heat for that.

Last edited by elnina; 04-16-2020 at 12:31 AM..
 
Old 04-14-2020, 04:28 PM
 
18,549 posts, read 15,610,748 times
Reputation: 16240
On the contrary, humans are the only animal that can collaborate and do projects with others on the opposite side of the world. Even in the non-pandemic times, this is useful to at least those of us who have such eccentric hobbies that there is no local group or club!
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