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I know exactly how it works. That's the main reason so many H1b holders are employed by contracting companies and not the main client. The client pays the firm a going if not higher rate and the contracting company pays the h1b holder about a third of that. Please don't try to sell me the myth that these contracting companies do more than the minimum (and sometimes fraudulent ) attempt to find an American or US resident.
The numbers don't lie. If we are to have a real discussion we should at least be honest. You are not being honest when you say that the contractor gets the same rate as an American/resident hire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mirjaja
I don't think you are very familiar with how H1B's work at all.
Firstly, they do not act to replace American workers, but rather fill voids in positions that can not be filled with American workers.
When an employer determines that they can not fill a vacancy, they have to file a form that registers their company with Immigration (cost $2000-$2500). Then they have to advertise in both local and National trade magazines for the position they want to fill (this can cost anywhere from $600 -to $3000+ depending on the trade). They have to collect resumes and interview a specific percentage of them (internal costs to employer). If they still have not found a qualified American for the position, then they can apply for a H1B visa for the foreign national (average cost 8000-10000$). They have to pay the foreign national the going rate for the profession (and this is cross-checked into a program the government has which collects data on which profession earns in each American state & county.) H1B's will not be granted to an employer who is not paying the national average. It can take many months to go through this complicated and costly process - so most employers have to be fairly motivated to do so. Also, the employers may not discriminate against H1B employees and must provide them with any and all benefits that are offered to the companies other employees. For most employers, this all works out to more trouble than it is worth.
I know exactly how it works. That's the main reason so many H1b holders are employed by contracting companies and not the main client. The client pays the firm a going if not higher rate and the contracting company pays the h1b holder about a third of that. Please don't try to sell me the myth that these contracting companies do more than the minimum (and sometimes fraudulent ) attempt to find an American or US resident.
The numbers don't lie. If we are to have a real discussion we should at least be honest. You are not being honest when you say that the contractor gets the same rate as an American/resident hire.
Exactly.
It is not as if there is no fraud in the H1-B system. There is plenty of it!
there is this type of fraud and more. I know too many folks in the valley that are still frequently contacted by "Consulting" firms that are really in business only to contact unqualified folks for existing tech jobs. Then they say they tried to fill the position with a citizen/resident but none were qualified. Enter the h1b candidate.
These are super high tech positions. We're not talking nuclear fusion. We can look sys admins, dbas, db devs. Come on. There is a lack of SQLServer DBAs? Sybase? Oracle? Please
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDGeek
Exactly.
It is not as if there is no fraud in the H1-B system. There is plenty of it!
Last week's Newsweek had a feature un H1-B fraud. Some terrible stories. A guy who was contacted in London, brought to the US only to be told there was "no project yet" and they wouldn't pay him while there was no project. That is clearly illegal. The guy ended up working ilegally in a gas station. He later plead guilty and filed charges against the company.
Another story was about 6 Indian workers that were forced to share a 2 bedroom apartment. The company was registered in some little town in Iowa (where the prevailing wage is lower), but they were being sent to San Diego. If they had to be "benched" for some weeks, they wouldn't get paid for those weeks.
Others were being sent to find work by their own. Which only means become a salesman without commission. Since the employer holds the visa, any employment they found had to be through that employer, that only gave them a portion of the money.
Awful stuff. The worst part is that all the companies involved are still active (some with a different name) and they sell professional services to HUGE corporations who -obviously- "declined to comment on the story." I remember Qualcomm and Chase from the article and you can be sure they aren't the only ones.
If you are going to get into IT, look for a niche: business intelligence, smart cards... or work on something more scientific... statistics is hot right now.
Niche industries don't stay immune from outsourcing for long anymore. Without the right connections, it doesn't matter much what niche skills you develop, you won't be getting the job. Niche employment is 80% connections. Niche industries also demand less resources. But even in some exclusive fields like 'high-flying' finance and trading there influx of foreign workers have already started and well under way. Wherever there are still high salaries being paid to someone doing real work, the 'bosses' up top are already thinking of ways to put a hamper to that.
I agree that some frauds have been done in the past by some Indian sweatshops setup on purpose, but believe me, next time you see BMW on the street, imagine a tons of H1B who help to setup it's production here. H1B for IT is very marginal and percentage-wise is way, waay below 1% of IT workforce.
Have you been to any IT offices lately? How do you explain that fact that sometimes 70% of workers in these offices are of Indian decent? You attribute this to the few Indian sweatshops you are mentioning?
How come a certain ethnic group that is a small minority of the overall US population has such over-representation in this particular industry? This doesn't coincide with the marginal 1% in IT workforce you are referring to.
Somehow the numbers you presented just don't add up.
At UC Berkeley, Asian students predominate the CS dept from 1st year through graduation. Asian population in America has been less than 5% for the past 15 years and yet Asian student population at MIT, Stanford, UC Berkeley, etc has stood between 20% to over 50%. Why?
Stanford and Berkeley are in Bay Area that has a much larger Asian population (waay higher than 5%) than the rest of the country.
Firstly, they do not act to replace American workers, but rather fill voids in positions that can not be filled with American workers.
False. See this thread's previous posts. As has been stated, there is no need for scabs who replace American workers.
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