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I can see if a home has a natural gas range, clothes dryer, water heater and central heat that the 240v. circuits to those appliances could be omitted, but it is not practical to have central AC without a 240v. circuit. I can't imagine a new home being built anywhere in California without central AC unless it's some sort of hippiedippie experimental thing. Well, maybe someplace like Crescent City on the north coast could do without central AC. A 120v.-only installation would be more common in an apartment than a house. I have two 240v. receptacles in my garage, one for my air compressor and one for my arc welder. The compressor motor starts quicker and runs cooler on 240v. and it would be impossible to use the welder on 120v.
Santa Barbara and North unless you get to the Central Valley, many new homes don't have AC.
Most homes in San Francisco (and surrounding), no AC
Many homes in the East Bay, no AC
Many homes anywhere along the coast an inland to about 30 miles (accounts for a large percentage of the population in CA - no AC.
It just doesn't get that hot for that long.
Go inland and that changes but that isn't where the majority of the population lives.
About half the State doesn't have central AC even in new construction. Open the windows, have a ceiling fan running or better yet, go outside.
Not everyone has or needs a welder. Lots of compressors run on 110 and not everyone has those either.
So, it does make sense to install the gas line which is harder to retrofit to encourage the use of the currently more cost effective fuel? The best thing for the home owner is options. Who knows which fuel will be better in the long run? I know for me, I paid to have a gas line run to my property but still have not hooked up after 10 yrs because of the conversion cost from fuel oil / electric. I heat 95% with wood from the property so converting does not make sense until I am too old to make my own heat.
I think a provision for solar integration would be what smart thinking buyers would be looking for in most parts of the country. I currently use a solar exchange panel to heat the hot tub and we are in an area with marginal solar gain. As to major appliances, most true cooks prefer gas And i have commercial laundry equipment and would only consider gas dryers.
Link? All homes are built with 240 (or 208) standard in the United States. It's how the circuit breaker panel is built. This sounds like pure bs to me.
Exactly. And there's no reference given for this claim, and no way to verify it, so I'd just ignore it as internet noise until and unless some proof is offered.
A very thorough study has been done, by experts showing the difference in cost over the lifetime of the equipment. Using the average number of loads done by all but a very few people, they have found that the heat/pump dryer will not be cost effective, and including cost of equipment, electricity use, repair over the lifetime of the machines, the heat pump dryer will kind of eat your lunch.
Mack - Does the referring link and its veracity depend on where the link leads you?
A peer reviewed scientific study that has been reviewed/accepted by the scientific community, surely can be used to justify ones opinion and post. Yes, even the best minds in the world CAN be wrong at times. But at some point, we all have to take the word of someone's whose life has been to study a certain thing, we can't all be experts at everything.
Yes, linking to Wikipedia generally is weak. However, Wiki does do cited sources, so the veracity of the article can be good or bad depending on the other sources. And I agree that linking to other articles serves a duplicitous reason at times. But that is not always the case.
One has to look at energy cost in Europe to make a decision. frankly Heat pump can work in colder climate but when it gets cold needs a backup; plain and simple.
Mack - Does the referring link and its veracity depend on where the link leads you?
A peer reviewed scientific study that has been reviewed/accepted by the scientific community, surely can be used to justify ones opinion and post. Yes, even the best minds in the world CAN be wrong at times. But at some point, we all have to take the word of someone's whose life has been to study a certain thing, we can't all be experts at everything.
Yes, linking to Wikipedia generally is weak. However, Wiki does do cited sources, so the veracity of the article can be good or bad depending on the other sources. And I agree that linking to other articles serves a duplicitous reason at times. But that is not always the case.
Agreed, I was commenting on the persistent request for links to anything and everything by those who see themselves as hall monitors and need to always ask for a link as if that is the only source of information on the planet that has validity.
I do see quite a bit of hiding behind links used as a tactic.
As for being experts, few here are, we are all practitioners unless one is willing to post their credentials and bonafides.
To the heat pump topic, anyone who has used one knows that once the temperature drops to a certain point, they simply stop working. Often you will find electric heat pumps backed up via gas with a dual mode operation for colder temps and then switching completely to gas as soon as the temps drop more than a few degrees lower than the temperature they need to achieve.
Heat pumps are every efficient for casual heating but for something like bringing a house up to temp when it is much colder outside, the differential between the outside air and the inside air causes the switch to gas.
Exactly. Why is there a lint filter? Because the clothing is shedding, which it doesn't seem to do if it's line dried. It probably ruins clothing in other ways too.
But dryers sure come in handy when it's damp or rainy or in a winter snowstorm.
When you line dry clothes do you funnel all of the outgoing air through a 10x10" screen to verify there's no lint coming off?
Lint comes from the washing machine, the dryer just catches it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by in_newengland
I didn't mean Seattle--you don't even get cold winters. When I said North I meant THE North--places like Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, Upper NY State, New England--places that get really cold. If there are any heat pumps in New England they are very rare. When it's 20 below zero will a heat pump work? I wish it would. Does anyone know if heat pumps will become available in places like New England anytime soon? It would be great.
Seattle is north of all the rest of the continental US, so I could say "they work fine up North, it's you southerners that have an issue"
Agreed, I was commenting on the persistent request for links to anything and everything by those who see themselves as hall monitors and need to always ask for a link as if that is the only source of information on the planet that has validity.
I do see quite a bit of hiding behind links used as a tactic.
As for being experts, few here are, we are all practitioners unless one is willing to post their credentials and bonafides.
To the heat pump topic, anyone who has used one knows that once the temperature drops to a certain point, they simply stop working. Often you will find electric heat pumps backed up via gas with a dual mode operation for colder temps and then switching completely to gas as soon as the temps drop more than a few degrees lower than the temperature they need to achieve.
Heat pumps are every efficient for casual heating but for something like bringing a house up to temp when it is much colder outside, the differential between the outside air and the inside air causes the switch to gas.
No link, experience, in Europe as well as the US.
I hate ventless dryers - so no argument there. Used one in my Timeshare in Williamsburg and it wasn't really cold out either. FIrst, it was small and more importantly it took FOREVER to dry clothes. Luckily we had three rooms. Between the three of them we were almost able to keep up with the laundry. (And some stuff we ended up hanging up in the bathrooms) The building was historic and they had no way to vent the units.
So unless in the past several years they have made great strides, which it doesn't sound like they have - I'll stick with electric or gas dryers. I still want my LARGE, NORMAL sized dual unit. So I can do two full size loads of laundry at the same time from wash to dry without having to switch machines. It would take 2 washers and 2 dryers to have the same capacity. Sorry, but we are a medium sized family and each of us wears at least two sets of clothes a day. Work/Home or School Formal / P.E / After School Sports. Luckily, I have that choice.
I destroy clothes before they get washer/dryer worn out and my kids outgrow them... Not worried about that part of it. Other stuff has to be dry cleaned anyways. I agree, just because you don't see the lint on the line leaving the clothes, doesn't mean it doesn't.
Seattle is north of all the rest of the continental US, so I could say "they work fine up North, it's you southerners that have an issue"
..and I would say "It's no where near as a cold as many states which is the only variable that matters."
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