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This is a good question because there are going to be a significant number of healthy people who won't get the vaccine right away, if ever.
I think there are workarounds to stay safe. One or both could wear a mask, stay six feet apart, turn heads away from each other when hugging, visit outside, take temperatures. These are all good practices that have kept most people safe and healthy over the past year, no reason why they shouldn't work even better now, especially when some are vaccinated.
The only problem is that most people who won't take the vaccine are the same ones that won't wear masks or take other precautions.Moderator cut: removed politics
Last edited by in_newengland; 05-02-2021 at 06:44 PM..
Isn't the whole point of getting the vaccine because they say it works?
The problem with this statement is that it is an "absolute statement". The vaccine "works" and the vaccine works well compared to other vaccines.
This is not the same thing as saying that it works all the time or that every single person who takes it will never become sick with covid. The data we have on both the Pfizer and Moderna vaccine tells us that the vaccine has efficacy of greater than 90%. This is a way of saying that if you take a group of people who have been vaccinated and you compare them to group that have not been vaccinated that there will be over 90% fewer cases of covid among the vaccinated group. Cases of covid will still pop up occasionally--rarely--in the vaccinated group. A very few will end up in the hospital.
In other words, the decision of the OP's mother to vaccinate makes her much less likely to get sick with covid. It does not make it impossible. Now, if the unvaccinated daughter were to change her mind and get vaccinated it would change the equation considerably. The chance of mom becoming sick from her daughter would become remote indeed.
There is another issue too. Its simply that the daughter should respect her mother enough to swallow hard and get a vaccination if she wants to see her. The vaccine is safe and over 200 million shots have been given in the USA. If there was a major problem we would know it by now. The fact that the daughter clings to an irrational anti-vax belief despite all this is sad. It tells me that seeing her mother in person is not a priority for her.
The carrier part of virus transmission doesn't care if you're vaccinated or not.
Your vaccinated relatives could give your daughter COVID. /shrug/
I agree. The vaccine doesn't mean those people & those around them are all a-okay. Vacciness just lower the chance of death. You still have to wear masks, social distance, etc.
I wouldn't feel any safer being around people who are all vaccinated & I'm not nor vice versa.
That is just not true. Most of transmission occurs when people are asymptomatic. Sick people aren't going around seeing other people because they're sick and don't feel well. A substantial number of people never get sick and so they go out.
The other problem when someone says they don't want to get vaccinated is that they also are saying they don't want to wear mask and don't social distance. They usually say that they trust people because they know them and since they don't feel sick then they are OK to be around like normal. I can't think of a higher risk group than those who don't want to get vaccinated because it leads to infection and transmission.
The 95% is a citation that comes from the studies but the studies were not completely representative of the population at large with regards to minority groups and the elderly. There is no doubt that the numbers for the elderly would be expected to be lower unfortunately. Older people have higher vaccine failure rates because their immune system is not the same as someone younger it it were there wouldn't be more cancer in that age group.
Studies have shown that there is little evidence of a asymptomatic spread.
I know that this is a scary virus but if you are vaccinated and visiting outside with a well person the chances of any virus transmission happening is slim to none.
Fear and anxiety over an extremely remote possibility should not prevent family members from seeing each other. This is her mom, too. If Mom wants to see her daughter on Mother's Day, she should do so.
FWIW, last year we celebrated Mother's Day with my similarly aged mom, sitting outside in camp chairs. I picked up some take out soup and sandwiches and enjoyed a pretty spring day together. This was all well before a vaccine became available. And we handled subsequent visits with the same sort of care. It meant a lot to Mom that we could see her.
I hope Op can relax her rules a bit. There are safe ways to see each other.
Studies have shown that there is little evidence of a asymptomatic spread.
I know that this is a scary virus but if you are vaccinated and visiting outside with a well person the chances of any virus transmission happening is slim to none.
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But the most infectious period is PRE symptomatic. Which is just as bad, as they are not showing symptoms......... YET.
Abstract We determined secondary attack rates (SAR) among close contacts of 59 asymptomatic and symptomatic coronavirus disease case-patients by presymptomatic and symptomatic exposure. We observed no transmission from asymptomatic case-patients and highest SAR through presymptomatic exposure. Rapid quarantine of close contacts with or without symptoms is needed to prevent presymptomatic transmission.
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The only problem is that most people who won't take the vaccine are the same ones that won't wear masks or take other precautions. You wouldn't want someone to mistake you for a liberal while you're wearing a mask to keep from potentially killing a loved one.
Why would a heartless jerk insist upon seeing their elderly mom? Maybe it's because they actually miss their mom?
Not getting the vaccine is not the same thing as showing up with a fever for a visit w/o a mask on and then coughing all over the vulnerable individuals.
The Op has done a good job of protecting her mom and keeping her safe during a very difficult year. She no doubt has a hard time relaxing some of her rigid protocols because this is the way she's been doing things for a year and those protocols have been working. But now that they have been vaccinated, it really is time to start living life like they have been vaccinated. It'll do them all good to see each other again.
But the most infectious period is PRE symptomatic. Which is just as bad, as they are not showing symptoms......... YET.
Abstract We determined secondary attack rates (SAR) among close contacts of 59 asymptomatic and symptomatic coronavirus disease case-patients by presymptomatic and symptomatic exposure. We observed no transmission from asymptomatic case-patients and highest SAR through presymptomatic exposure. Rapid quarantine of close contacts with or without symptoms is needed to prevent presymptomatic transmission.
I guess they would need to define what constitutes "presymptomatic". Is that a person who is not visibly sick to others but might be starting to feel a headache coming on and maybe experiencing an elevated temperature?
Obviously, if you aren't feeling right you reschedule for another time.
The vaccine either made you immune or it did not. It's not 95% effective in an individual; it's that out of 100 vaccinated people, 5 will not have developed immunity.
If your mom is part of the 5% that are not immune, she shouldn't gather with groups of anybody, vaccinated or not, because 5% of THEM won't have immunity either.
I presume that seniors are being vaccinated so that THEY can enjoy the years they have left. Telling them; "You can't enjoy your years after EVERYONE has been vaccinated" is a pretty lame move.
Five % of the vaccinated people she gathers with may not be immune; the deal-breaker is whether or not SHE is.
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