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Yap, they still have a voice. And considering how poor much of the Mexican population is, they certainly have many listeners. The more desperate people are, the more radical you can become with your messages. If Germany wasn't humliated after WWI, Hitler would have never been a factor. Are the Mexicans doing any better than the Germans were at the time?
YapCity....I have a couple of points for you or questions, I guess.
What about personal responsibility? From your posts, it sounds as if you think the mexicans invading this country are infantiles...simpletons without a concious thought in their heads. That they are some sort of mindless robot creation of a corrupt (mexican) government. So they automatically invade our country, w/blank staring eyes, take jobs away from US citizens, are unable to speak/learn English, because...what? Why? Their government sucks? Their government tells them not to??? Or, in your eyes...they don't have to assimilate...why? Because they come from a country that has a corrupt government???
Well, news flash for ya buddy....so do we!!!!! That's right, we are in the same boat, we live in the midst of corrupt politics...referenced by your own posts....stating how all of this is the fault of the US govt, and, to some extent, I agree. We have corrupt politicians in office, making corrupt deals w/other countries. Guess what? It has always been that way!
So, sorry, I just don't buy the "well, it's not the poor, boo, hoo, mexicans fault, they're just mindless creatures fleeing a corrupt country.Why shouldn't we accomodate their every need...." mentality.
Does not fly, no way, no how.
And as for your arguement about their "constitutional rights"....nyyyyeeett. no, wrong answer, sorry, they don't have any. Your skewed interpretation is giving them rights they don't have. What they are entitled to are 'human rights'. The right to be safely deported back to their country where they can all work together, displaying the same "mindless" mentality that they do here to fix their problems.
I really wish the illegal alien sympathizers would come on down to one of the border states and live here for awhile. Maybe then the true reality of what is happenning would be clear. When you see the illegals living enmasse in public spaces, protected areas of land, trashing it w/their filth, when you see them dragging the US flag on the ground while proudly waving the Mexican flag, yelling profanities in spanish, threatening any non-mexican; when you see the extent of abuse we the people, US citizens are enduring for the mexican gaovernments cause, maybe, just maybe the blinders will come off!
Only when the majority acknowledges that the problem can be controlled by controlling our government, reigning in our government and forcing them to address this issue and work aggressively against it, will the American people be, once again, we the people..... Right now it is we the sheeple....
YapCity....I have a couple of points for you or questions, I guess.
What about personal responsibility? From your posts, it sounds as if you think the mexicans invading this country are infantiles...simpletons without a concious thought in their heads. That they are some sort of mindless robot creation of a corrupt (mexican) government. So they automatically invade our country, w/blank staring eyes, take jobs away from US citizens, are unable to speak/learn English, because...what? Why? Their government sucks? Their government tells them not to??? Or, in your eyes...they don't have to assimilate...why? Because they come from a country that has a corrupt government???
Well, news flash for ya buddy....so do we!!!!! That's right, we are in the same boat, we live in the midst of corrupt politics...referenced by your own posts....stating how all of this is the fault of the US govt, and, to some extent, I agree. We have corrupt politicians in office, making corrupt deals w/other countries. Guess what? It has always been that way!
So, sorry, I just don't buy the "well, it's not the poor, boo, hoo, mexicans fault, they're just mindless creatures fleeing a corrupt country.Why shouldn't we accomodate their every need...." mentality.
Does not fly, no way, no how.
And as for your arguement about their "constitutional rights"....nyyyyeeett. no, wrong answer, sorry, they don't have any. Your skewed interpretation is giving them rights they don't have. What they are entitled to are 'human rights'. The right to be safely deported back to their country where they can all work together, displaying the same "mindless" mentality that they do here to fix their problems.
I really wish the illegal alien sympathizers would come on down to one of the border states and live here for awhile. Maybe then the true reality of what is happenning would be clear. When you see the illegals living enmasse in public spaces, protected areas of land, trashing it w/their filth, when you see them dragging the US flag on the ground while proudly waving the Mexican flag, yelling profanities in spanish, threatening any non-mexican; when you see the extent of abuse we the people, US citizens are enduring for the mexican gaovernments cause, maybe, just maybe the blinders will come off!
Only when the majority acknowledges that the problem can be controlled by controlling our government, reigning in our government and forcing them to address this issue and work aggressively against it, will the American people be, once again, we the people..... Right now it is we the sheeple....
lol, no I don't think they're "mindless drones". I think they are a product of their environment.
...and if they ARE in the same boat as us, deputize them. Don't chase them out, let them join the ranks and FIGHT WITH US. Don't you see, the "us vs them" thing is EXACTLY what the powers that be COUNT ON.
...and you didn't read all my posts I guess, so you completely missed the point.
The point is, they ARE entitled to certain rights. Any sane illegal immigrant would simply DENY that they are illegal. That would put the burden of proof on those trying to deport/prosecute them. If you multiply this times the amount of illegal immigrants in this country, it would LITERALLY bring our legal system TO IT'S KNEES. What are we going to do? Change the laws? So we're going to become a police state like Germany was "your papers please!". Are we going to change the laws and set a new precedent where your teenager can get locked up for forgetting their ID card?
THINK about it. That's something you people, along with most of the voting public in America miserably FAIL to do. Consider the repercussions of your wishes.
I hear what you're saying, but your views although passionate are COMPLETELY UNREALISTIC.
When you have lemons, you make lemonade. You don't toss them out and die of thirst.
My good friends...............this debate is all about politics., and votes. This has happened before with the Cubans, they now have full immigrant entry status, and have for quite a few years. The Haitians , they do not....cause they don't vote in big numbers, and ........, they are Black ? Just a few examples.
The folks from South of the border , well some of them , ( I think most) , feel that this Country owes them the right to come , whatever the reason.Many feel they are just getting whats due...because of the War Against Mexico, in 1846-1849.....may be some truth in the way it was, and how We did in Mexico . Does that give the dependents today the right to " Take Back The Southwest" ? Look at the Indians, how they suffered, what have we given them ,?............and they were here before our white forefathers were , by a long time !!
What ever the case , we need to stop putting our head in the sand, wishing it all will go away.........it WON'T ! We already have laws on the books to handle the problem............lets see ,..DEMAND....that its enforced !!
We would be MUCH better served financially by assimilating them into society and COLLECTING tax dollars, not spending them.
My feeling is, think with your head, not their skin color.
Key word; assimilating! There is limited assimilation taking place where I am right now. What our local school governing board is doing right now is called catering! We feed their children 2 meals a day at school, we provide them with bilingual tutors, we send them on special field trips to local colleges, we hold special rallies at school for them, and we offer free parent education. In return I have things stolen from my classroom, my desks, chairs, and books "tagged", and administrators asking why these "poor little immigrant children" are failing when they do almost nothing productive. I am only 1 teacher in one school in one district. Now do the math. I think even if they were to pay taxes on their $7/hr job it still wouldn't pay for all the hand outs they are receiving.
lol, no I don't think they're "mindless drones". I think they are a product of their environment.
...and if they ARE in the same boat as us, deputize them. Don't chase them out, let them join the ranks and FIGHT WITH US. Don't you see, the "us vs them" thing is EXACTLY what the powers that be COUNT ON.
From this and previous posts you seem to be advocating that American citizens should simply throw up our hands and accept any and all individuals who ignore our laws and illegally enter our country because it would be 'too hard' to do anything about it. Sorry, I don't see things that way and I suspect there are many others how share my beliefs. The fact that our govt was NOT willing to make a stand and do the right thing in 1986 is a large part of the reason we are in the godawful situation we are in today. NOBODY was willing to stand their ground in 1986 and say that the US immigration laws on the books must be enforced and deport the 4 million illegal aliens that were here then. The 1986 amnesty served to reinforced the notion among the illegals that the laws do not apply to them and if they wait around long enough another serial amnesty will come along and they will magically be granted all the benefits of US citizenship simply by virtue of being here. What a deal!
Furthermore, rather than attempting to drive a wedge between US citizens and illegals, I see the govt and MSM as actively seeking to blur the differences between the two, presumably so that when they attempt to ram amnesty through, the Americans will not protest as much. Why else are illegal aliens continually referred by some euphemism- 'undocumented workers', etc? Why are illegal immigrants invariably lumped in with legal immigrants, as if there were no difference between the two? "See? They are really just like you!", says our traitorous govt. No, they are not.
Quote:
...and you didn't read all my posts I guess, so you completely missed the point.
The point is, they ARE entitled to certain rights. Any sane illegal immigrant would simply DENY that they are illegal. That would put the burden of proof on those trying to deport/prosecute them. If you multiply this times the amount of illegal immigrants in this country, it would LITERALLY bring our legal system TO IT'S KNEES. What are we going to do? Change the laws? So we're going to become a police state like Germany was "your papers please!". Are we going to change the laws and set a new precedent where your teenager can get locked up for forgetting their ID card?
Something about this doesn't ring true. We do deport illegals so it is not the Sisyphean task that it is portrayed as. I hope someone with a legal backgound can clarify.
Quote:
THINK about it. That's something you people, along with most of the voting public in America miserably FAIL to do. Consider the repercussions of your wishes.
I hear what you're saying, but your views although passionate are COMPLETELY UNREALISTIC.
When you have lemons, you make lemonade. You don't toss them out and die of thirst.
~T
The citizens of the United States have the right, indeed the obligation when confronted with any 'deal' such as this to ask, "What's in it for me? How does this benefit me and other Americans?" So YP, I would ask for you to present the ways that you believe granting amnesty to 12+ million illegal aliens, the majority of whom have not completed HS and have no particular job skill, is going to benefit the average American citizen?
From this and previous posts you seem to be advocating that American citizens should simply throw up our hands and accept any and all individuals who ignore our laws and illegally enter our country because it would be 'too hard' to do anything about it. Sorry, I don't see things that way and I suspect there are many others how share my beliefs. The fact that our govt was NOT willing to make a stand and do the right thing in 1986 is a large part of the reason we are in the godawful situation we are in today. NOBODY was willing to stand their ground in 1986 and say that the US immigration laws on the books must be enforced and deport the 4 million illegal aliens that were here then. The 1986 amnesty served to reinforced the notion among the illegals that the laws do not apply to them and if they wait around long enough another serial amnesty will come along and they will magically be granted all the benefits of US citizenship simply by virtue of being here. What a deal!
Furthermore, rather than attempting to drive a wedge between US citizens and illegals, I see the govt and MSM as actively seeking to blur the differences between the two, presumably so that when they attempt to ram amnesty through, the Americans will not protest as much. Why else are illegal aliens continually referred by some euphemism- 'undocumented workers', etc? Why are illegal immigrants invariably lumped in with legal immigrants, as if there were no difference between the two? "See? They are really just like you!", says our traitorous govt. No, they are not.
Something about this doesn't ring true. We do deport illegals so it is not the Sisyphean task that it is portrayed as. I hope someone with a legal backgound can clarify.
The citizens of the United States have the right, indeed the obligation when confronted with any 'deal' such as this to ask, "What's in it for me? How does this benefit me and other Americans?" So YP, I would ask for you to present the ways that you believe granting amnesty to 12+ million illegal aliens, the majority of whom have not completed HS and have no particular job skill, is going to benefit the average American citizen?
AB
Frankly, lol, I'm tired of re-hashing this already.
The bigoted, and anti-hispanic rhetoric in this section is appalling. Since the creation of this section I have been VERY SURPRISED at the management of City-Data, and the fact that they let this stuff continue.
Regarding their education, BELIEVE ME, I have met far more lazy, uneducated whites in my travels than I have Mexicans. These people are not stupid, but you're right, they don't have "high school diplomas". Well there's a big "DUH". You would need to go to school in AMERICA to have a diploma. However, that is nowhere near a measure of one's intelligence, ESPECIALLY since we have Americans, born and raised, graduating high school TODAY that are unable to READ.
What I am talking about is not simply "giving up". I am offering PRACTICAL ideas for dealing with the situation. Honestly, when considering the political make-up of the United States, do you SERIOUSLY believe these people will ever be deported? You people sound like ranting children, stomping their feet in the middle of Wal-Mart because mommy refuses to buy you the blue power-ranger.
You people need to get real. Mass deportation will NEVER happen in the United States any more than Bush will suddenly start firing synapses. You have far too many left-wing groups to contend with, as well as others who only have the best interests of their employers at heart. So rather than scream and yell about something that is IMPOSSIBLE to execute, the intelligent thing to do is offer practical solutions that cannot be refuted, and are relatively painless to implement.
In other words, STOP WASTING TIME. You are never going to accomplish anything by ranting about this, and to be honest, you look like fools. Marlon Brando once said in a movie, "Make'em an offer he can't refuse". There is a lot of truth to that. If you want the US government to do something about this, there needs to be a practical solution with a high degree of voter support. As it stands now, everybody is all over the place because half this country has this ridiculous notion that somehow if they scream loud enough we'll start deporting them. You're wrong, it's not going to happen.
Yes it sucks that some of them will be on welfare. Yes, it sucks that some of them live off "the system". I don't dwell on that because you're going to get that with ALL groups.
.....anyway......
The answer is not to spend money on getting them out. The answer is to assimilate them, and start collecting tax revenue from them. You will accomplish the latter MUCH faster than the former.
As for the border, well, that needs to be secured yesterday. We need to stop them from coming in before we can deal with the ones already here.
I also think imposing HUGE taxes on wire transfers OUT of this country may not be an entirely bad idea either. That will also help the issue by collecting tax revenue from those that only come over here to send money "back home".
There ARE things we can do that make sense. Physically rounding up millions of illegals is ludicrous.
it is quite simple really, cut off the supply, supply of jobs and services that is. We make it far to easy to get what they want here. Cut them off. Deportation is not a reality, wont work. Just cut them off.
Frankly, lol, I'm tired of re-hashing this already.
The bigoted, and anti-hispanic rhetoric in this section is appalling. Since the creation of this section I have been VERY SURPRISED at the management of City-Data, and the fact that they let this stuff continue.
Regarding their education, BELIEVE ME, I have met far more lazy, uneducated whites in my travels than I have Mexicans. These people are not stupid, but you're right, they don't have "high school diplomas". Well there's a big "DUH". You would need to go to school in AMERICA to have a diploma. However, that is nowhere near a measure of one's intelligence, ESPECIALLY since we have Americans, born and raised, graduating high school TODAY that are unable to READ.
What I am talking about is not simply "giving up". I am offering PRACTICAL ideas for dealing with the situation. Honestly, when considering the political make-up of the United States, do you SERIOUSLY believe these people will ever be deported? You people sound like ranting children, stomping their feet in the middle of Wal-Mart because mommy refuses to buy you the blue power-ranger.
You people need to get real. Mass deportation will NEVER happen in the United States any more than Bush will suddenly start firing synapses. You have far too many left-wing groups to contend with, as well as others who only have the best interests of their employers at heart. So rather than scream and yell about something that is IMPOSSIBLE to execute, the intelligent thing to do is offer practical solutions that cannot be refuted, and are relatively painless to implement.
In other words, STOP WASTING TIME. You are never going to accomplish anything by ranting about this, and to be honest, you look like fools. Marlon Brando once said in a movie, "Make'em an offer he can't refuse". There is a lot of truth to that. If you want the US government to do something about this, there needs to be a practical solution with a high degree of voter support. As it stands now, everybody is all over the place because half this country has this ridiculous notion that somehow if they scream loud enough we'll start deporting them. You're wrong, it's not going to happen.
Yes it sucks that some of them will be on welfare. Yes, it sucks that some of them live off "the system". I don't dwell on that because you're going to get that with ALL groups.
.....anyway......
The answer is not to spend money on getting them out. The answer is to assimilate them, and start collecting tax revenue from them. You will accomplish the latter MUCH faster than the former.
As for the border, well, that needs to be secured yesterday. We need to stop them from coming in before we can deal with the ones already here.
I also think imposing HUGE taxes on wire transfers OUT of this country may not be an entirely bad idea either. That will also help the issue by collecting tax revenue from those that only come over here to send money "back home".
There ARE things we can do that make sense. Physically rounding up millions of illegals is ludicrous.
~T
You failed to list one way that allowing them to stay here benefits American citizens.
it is quite simple really, cut off the supply, supply of jobs and services that is. We make it far to easy to get what they want here. Cut them off. Deportation is not a reality, wont work. Just cut them off.
Yeah but we'd just end up with MORE crime because of it.
Better than deportation, but still not entirely practical.
~T
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