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Old 04-07-2015, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadratus View Post
One of my objections to the claim that Mohammed was a true prophet of God, is that he contradicted all the other known prophets of God. In fact, he changed the true worship of God into falsehood. The prophet Abel was made righteous before God by virtue of a sacrifice of a lamb for his sins. Mohammed says that sacrifice for sins has no place in the worship of God. The prophet Job offered sacrifices for the forgiveness of the sins of his family. Moses spoke as much of the sacrifices as he did of keeping the moral law. Isaiah was forgiven in the presence of God Himself by virtue of the sacrifice. In the 53 rd chapter of his book he explains that the sacrifices point to the coming Savior who would die for the sins of the world, so that God could forgive their sins. The Savior he was talking about was Jesus Christ.

However, if one reads Jewish scripture it appears blood sacrifice is a human invention and not one demanded by Allah(swt)

Quote:
Attitude of Prophets.

The attitude of the literary prophets toward sacrifice manifests no enthusiasm for sacrificial worship. Hosea declares in the name of Yhwh: "I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of Yhwh more than burnt offerings" (Hos. vi. 6; comp. ib. viii. 13; ix. 3, 4; xiv. 3). Amos proclaims: "I [Yhwh] hate, I despise your feast-days; . . . if you offer me burnt offerings and your bloodless offerings, I will not accept them nor will I regard the thank-offerings of your fat beasts, . . . but let justice flow like water" (Amos v. 21-24, Hebr.; comp. iv. 4, 5). He goes so far as to doubt the existence of sacrificial institutions in the desert (ib. v. 25). Isaiah is not less strenuous in rejecting a ritualistic sacrificial cult (Isa. i. 11-17). Jeremiah takes up the burden (Jer. vi. 19, 20; comp. xxxi. 31-33). He, like Amos, in expressing his scorn for the burnt offerings and other slaughtered oblations, takes occasion to deny that the fathers had been commanded concerning these things when they came forth from Egypt (ib. vii. 21 et seq.). Malachi, a century later, complains of the wrong spirit which is manifest at the sacrifices ("Mal. i. 10). Ps. l. emphasizes most beautifully the prophetic conviction that thanksgiving alone is acceptable, as does Ps. lxix. 31, 32. Deutero-Isaiah (xl. 16) suggests the utter inadequacy of sacrifices. "To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to Yhwh than sacrifice" is found in I Sam. xv. 22 (Hebr.) as a censure of Saul; and gnomic wisdom is not without similar confession (Prov. xv. 8; xxi. 3, 27; xxviii. 9; Eccl. iv. 17). Some passages assert explicitly that sacrifices are not desired (Ps. xl. 7-9, li. 17-19). Micah's rejection of sacrificial religion has become the classical definition of ethical monotheism (Mic. vi. 6-8). Other Psalms and prophetic utterances, however, deplore the cessation of sacrificial services at the Temple and look forward to their reinstitution (Ps. li. 20, 21; Joel ii. 12, 13; Jer. xxxi. 14; xxxiii. 11, 17, 18). The apocalyptic character of some of these predictions is not disputable, neither is that of Isa. xix. 21, lvi. 7, lx. 7. In Ezekiel's scheme of the restoration, also, the sacrifices receive very generous treatment (Ezek. xl.-xlviii.).
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Christianity seems to put an emphasis, upon blood sacrifices, that was never intended.
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Old 04-07-2015, 05:51 PM
 
5 posts, read 2,280 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
However, if one reads Jewish scripture it appears blood sacrifice is a human invention and not one demanded by Allah(swt)



SACRIFICE - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Christianity seems to put an emphasis, upon blood sacrifices, that was never intended.
There is a problem with a theology that is based on a sacrifice system for forgiveness, that is its adherents can get to tge place where the sacrifice is offered without the one who is offering the sacrifice being repentant.
That is what the later protestations by the prophets are about.
The sacrifice is efficatious, if the supplicant is genuinely repentant. If one is not, no sacrifice will offer forgiveness.
That does not eradicate Moses sacrificial system, that was affirmed through other prophets also.
Isaiah tells us that the light to the Gentiles he promised in Isaiah 49, which would be Gods salvation to tge ends of the earth, was based on the Servants bearing the punishment for mans sins, in chapter 53. Lest there be any confusion, God used the term sin offering, a technical term meaning a blood sacrifice.
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Old 04-07-2015, 06:45 PM
 
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Here is how the prophet Job lived:

There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil. [2] And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters. [3] His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east. [4] And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them. [5] And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.
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Old 04-08-2015, 08:00 AM
 
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Isaiah, while in the very presence of God, was forgiven on the basis of the daily sacrifice:

Isaiah 6:1-7 KJV
In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple. [2] Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly. [3] And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory. [4] And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke. [5] Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts. [6] Then flew one of the seraphims unto me, having a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with the tongs from off the altar: [7] And he laid it upon my mouth, and said, Lo, this hath touched thy lips; and thine iniquity is taken away, and thy sin purged.
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Old 04-08-2015, 11:56 AM
 
2,826 posts, read 1,871,519 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
However, if one reads Jewish scripture it appears blood sacrifice is a human invention and not one demanded by Allah(swt)



SACRIFICE - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Christianity seems to put an emphasis, upon blood sacrifices, that was never intended.
Hold up. Christianity?

Uhhhh...


Quote:
Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves. "It is written," he said to them, "'My house will be called a house of prayer,' but you are making it 'a den of robbers.'" The blind and the lame came to him at the temple, and he healed them. But when the chief priests and the teachers of the law saw the wonderful things he did and the children shouting in the temple courts, "Hosanna to the Son of David," they were indignant.
I went to an Easter service a few days after almost getting sucked into a weird cult (they were kinda Seventh Day Adventist). The Easter service, they were were talking in depth in the sermon about Jewish blood sacrifices. The care that needed to be taken to choose the right sacrifice, the expense, the ritual of bleeding the animal, the ritual of atonement. The minister paused and said, "We don't have to do that anymore!"

We don't have to do that anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hosea 6:6
For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesus
But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
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Old 04-08-2015, 12:30 PM
 
5 posts, read 2,280 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophion View Post
So what are those teachings and where can we get them?
Actually, the reason we dont have ro offer sacrifices anymore is explained by Isaiahs prophecy.

Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed? [2] For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. [3] He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. [4] Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. [5] But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. [6] All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. [7] He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. [8] He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. [9] And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. [10] Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand. [11] He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justi fy many; for he shall bear
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