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Unions have tremendous bargaining power because they are organized. That's why they get these contracts.
Organize your industry/trade and you will be able to demand more for you labor. Clinton and NAFTA did all they could to dismantle manufacturing unions in the US. Now, each labor industry is being targeted. Union trucking and longshoremen are next. The lynchpin to accomplishing this is opening the southern border to Mexican trucks. Once that is done, longshoremen in California will be destroyed as ports in western Mexico are used to import goods from the East.
Even if you don't directly benefit from a union in your trade, you do benefit indirectly. Your union counterparts set the bar for earnings and benefits.
Problem for this movement is that you can't export teachers - and don't believe people don't want to try. That's what distance-learning and virtual learning "environments" are all about. Anyway, this systematic and step-wise effort to undermine the working and middle classes necessitates the reduction of teacher incomes.
Anyone who advocates it is an enemy of the working class. You will save a few dollars today, but it WILL screw us all in the end.
Unions are very well organized in Greece. How's that working out for them? Manufacturing is gone in America, not because of a lack of organized labor...it's gone because we are global now and we can't compete with labor costs being lower in other countries. It is economically inevitable that this was going to happen. No way around it. America's only choice now is to develop new technologies and services and base its economy off that.
1. Even IF average salary for teachers in Nassau was 75k (and I have my doubts), that is still only a few thousand less than the MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD income for entire Nassau FAMILIES.
2. Those numbers do not reflect a full work year and they do not reflect the ability to get extra pay through summer school, coaching, etc.
3. Someone on here thought 20 step increases is a bad thing compared to 3 or 5 step increases. I recommend this person go back to Math Class. Incremental increases over time will always yield more than higher jumps over longer periods of time. (Same concept as compound interest.) The teachers are making a killing with these step increases (in addition to regular increases).
CRV is well within his/her right to speak out. Hopefully CRV will complain to the people who can make a difference as loudly as he complains (on this board) to people who like him can do nothing about it.
The above is a fact.
Also the statistics presented about E Williston contracts are facts.
The salaries presented by See Through NY are fairly accurate, though not exact.
CRV's opinions are that EVERY TEACHER in E Williston only works 160 days a year.
And Anyone calling a teacher a part time worker is merely stating OPINION
I do taxes for a teacher. When I saw those See Through Ny results for her income, I called her & asked what that was all about. The numbers reported were about 50% off of the numbers shown on the W-2!
Anyone calling a teacher a part time worker is not stating an opinion based on facts - that person is just uninformed & unfamiliar with what a teacher does. And, after being informed time & time again of the correct facts, that person is UNWILLING to accept the correct facts, that person is just being closed-minded. And IN MY OPINION disrespectful to a very important and hard-working profession.
1. Even IF average salary for teachers in Nassau was 75k (and I have my doubts), that is still only a few thousand less than the MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD income for entire Nassau FAMILIES.
2. Those numbers do not reflect a full work year and they do not reflect the ability to get extra pay through summer school, coaching, etc.
3. Someone on here thought 20 step increases is a bad thing compared to 3 or 5 step increases. I recommend this person go back to Math Class. Incremental increases over time will always yield more than higher jumps over longer periods of time. (Same concept as compound interest.) The teachers are making a killing with these step increases (in addition to regular increases).
But another factor that must be considered, but is not in your analysis, is that these teachers have graduate degrees. Their salaries cannot be fairly compared to an "average" salary of ALL workers, but rather should be analyzed in view of what other graduate degreed people make.
I'd like to see a breakdown like that - I believe it would show a teacher makes, at best, half of what people with Graduate degrees earn on Long Island.
23 pages and going strong. Apparently, nothing upsets some people with a nickel more than a neighbor with a dime.
Here is a Karnac joke for you:
And the answer is, "Soap, ballot, jury and ammo".
Q: Name four boxes and the order in which they should be used.
"With regard to using vacation and off time to "hone there skills" well welcome to the professional world! How many conferences, seminars, meetings, and tests have I gone to over the last 7 years of my professional life. The difference is that I don't get up on a podium exalting myself and the sacrifices I make."
Please, if your job was being attacked incessantly, the way teachers have been attacked the last several years, wouldn't you be here defending what you do too? People are generally proud of the work they do, and when constantly baraged with misinformation and lies, they defend themselves! No teacher asked to have to stand on some "podium" as you say, but for you to expect them to just lie down and take it is ludicrous beyond belief!
Ohh, so my health care job hasn't been attacked at all? I remember sitting on a corner protesting the government trying to make me get a shot because of hype, which any idiot looking at the stats would tell you is just that (hey, turned out we were right.. again). People are peeved at teachers because their taxes are skyrocketing because their payscale and benefits are out of range with the average. And yes, they are supposed to listen to the people who pay them. Thats part of the gig. Which part is misinformation (that I at least have posted)? That teachers work 3/4ths a normal F/T employee? That they make too much? That their benefits are high? That their crying about "working from home" menas they haven't even taken 5 minutes to take a quick look at most every other professional job?
Your a teacher, right? Tell you what, we'll trade. I'll teach science classes that theres a glut in (I'd be qualified for AP Bio, Math, Chem or regular physics), you take my job. I'll have my weekends, nights, summers, and holidays off. You deal with dying patients, distraught families, and a work schedule that is more realistic (and I don't work as much as my private industry friends either). Ohh you'll probably be paid on average 10K less too. Good luck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachgns
So in your view then, if one is not actually working IN the place of employment, they are not Working? You cannot conceive of a person working from Home? Hmmmm. Yet you go to seminars, etc. That's not considered a part of your job? You're not WORKING then? You go to these for Fun, not part of your job? Does your employer know that? Does your employer pay for these seminars, conferences, meetings, etc.? Unless you are self employed, the answer is probably YES. Do you attend these seminars, meetings, etc on YOUR vacation time, or on your employer's time? Again, unless self-employed, answer is probably your employer's.
No, when people are doing things from home to fullfill professional obligations they don't have a right to ***** and moan about it. its part of the job. The only difference is that you don't see the average white collar person complaining they need more of the publics money because htey work so hard working 75% of normal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachgns
I do taxes for a teacher. When I saw those See Through Ny results for her income, I called her & asked what that was all about. The numbers reported were about 50% off of the numbers shown on the W-2!
Anyone calling a teacher a part time worker is not stating an opinion based on facts - that person is just uninformed & unfamiliar with what a teacher does. And, after being informed time & time again of the correct facts, that person is UNWILLING to accept the correct facts, that person is just being closed-minded. And IN MY OPINION disrespectful to a very important and hard-working profession.
Which part isn't fact specifically? It IS part time. 185 days vs. 240ish.
Ok, I guess answering a post within the quote doesn't count as a reply so you have to write outside the quote as well?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverBulletZ06
Ohh, so my health care job hasn't been attacked at all? I remember sitting on a corner protesting the government trying to make me get a shot because of hype, which any idiot looking at the stats would tell you is just that (hey, turned out we were right.. again). I may be new here, but I doubt that your profession, of which I wasn't aware, has had as many pages devoted to it as teacher's salaries have in this or any other forum! My daughter is in healthcare so I support your cause in this respect. People are peeved at teachers because their taxes are skyrocketing because their payscale and benefits are out of range with the average. Average what? Other people with graduate degrees as was mentioned here? Or average LI worker? I've already stated that I agree that teacher and admin salary increases need to be slowed down considerably. For some district benefits need to be paid for at a higher rate by these people. And yes, they are supposed to listen to the people who pay them. Thats part of the gig. This one is news to me. I always thought that it was the school board's responsibility to deal with the public and their needs. If people don't talk to their boards then they have little to complain about. Which part is misinformation (that I at least have posted)? That teachers work 3/4ths a normal F/T employee? Yes. That they make too much? In many instances, yes you are misinformed on this topic. That their benefits are high? Perhaps. In some districts they pay a good portion for these benefits, in others they don't. That their crying about "working from home" menas they haven't even taken 5 minutes to take a quick look at most every other professional job? No, as I stated, working from home wouldn't be an issue for teachers if people like yourself didn't constantly tell them that they are lying about having hours a week of work at home. Has nothing to do with other professions doing the same. It's the constant babble about teachers only working 3 1/2 hours a day!!!
Your a teacher, right? No. Tell you what, we'll trade. I'll teach science classes that theres a glut in What glut? It's hard to find qualified science teachers. Like Math and Foreign Languages, there aren't as many colleges graduating qualified teachers in these subjects. (I'd be qualified for AP Bio, Math, Chem or regular physics), you take my job. I'll have my weekends, nights, summers, and holidays off. You deal with dying patients, distraught families, and a work schedule that is more realistic (and I don't work as much as my private industry friends either). Ohh you'll probably be paid on average 10K less too. Good luck. See, you are making this personal. No need to do that. No one is denying that you work hard, are qualified in what you do and have things to deal with that aren't pleasant. Teachers just want the same respect.
No, when people are doing things from home to fullfill professional obligations they don't have a right to ***** and moan about it. its part of the job. The only difference is that you don't see the average white collar person complaining they need more of the publics money because htey work so hard working 75% of normal. Seems though that the average white collar person loves to complain about the teacher's cushy jobs! Why can't everyone be happy that there are people willing to deal with all sorts of unpleasantries in their respective jobs, and go on to the next argument?
Which part isn't fact specifically? It IS part time. 185 days vs. 240ish. And as has been stated here, 180 to 185 or so is considered full time for teachers in NYS. Until the state demands more days for the minimum required, this is fact.
RE:And as has been stated here, 180 to 185 or so is considered full time for teachers in NYS. Until the state demands more days for the minimum required, this is fact.
Considered full time? Not in my book...and it's not 180 to 185 in the East Williston School District...it's more like 160 days!
The next thing you'll be telling us is "its all about the children"
RE:And as has been stated here, 180 to 185 or so is considered full time for teachers in NYS. Until the state demands more days for the minimum required, this is fact.
Considered full time? Not in my book...and it's not 180 to 185 in the East Williston School District...it's more like 160 days!
The next thing you'll be telling us is "its all about the children"
See, now you stated a fact. Full time for teachers in NYS is 180 - 185 days. Right there is a fact.
"Not in my book" Your book is all opinions. As is mine, and anyone elses.
Also does EVERY (or most) teacher in EWSD take those 25 days off?
Ok, I guess answering a post within the quote doesn't count as a reply so you have to write outside the quote as well?
Writing outside the quotes is good forum etiquitte. Makes it easier to response to your points.
1) Doesn't matter if youe a brain surgeon or a maitre'd. Free country to discuss ideas and thoughts. This is especially true When that is a PUBLIC job. May salary is on See-Thru-NY too.
2) We deal with averages not anecdotal cases. Average salary is the easiest way to do things. Most of the people I know have degrees or special extra schooling and licensing. None have had their salary go up as if they were a teacher.
3) Your a public employee. Your paid, and answer to, the public.
4) You answered yes to working 3/4ths a F/T employee, then state after that indeed you do only work the 185 days or roughly 3/4ths the amount of a F/T 240 day employee. Pick which one you want to have.
5) I never said you only worked 3:40/day. I do however laugh at the notion that teachers regularly put in hours and hours after school.
6) Oops, wrong verbage. My bad. I'll work in a in need subject.
7) You don't get a free pass for unpleasentries. Hospital workers would win hands down. Teachers wouldn't even be in my top 100.
8) Real world full time means 240 days of work. Teaching is a part time gig unless they are doing summer schools etc.
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Rebuttal
