Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Interesting discussion. Both Louisville and Nashville are on the rise, but Nashville is more of a boom town at the moment, and it's playing a bit of catch up in terms of multifamily and hotel development in relation to its larger Southeast peers. A while back, I was talking to a multifamily broker from Nashville and he mentioned that, prior to the current wave of new construction, large apt. projects weren't allowed in some districts in Nashville... which was a bit of a surprise to me.
In any case, boom towns have their drawbacks -- particularly traffic gridlock and rising cost of living. I'm starting to hear some complaints about both regarding Nashville.
From what I understand, development in Louisville is more organic. There are a lot of loft apartment rehab projects, and that type of development appeals to me more than the shiny blue towers, which are somewhat generic. Louisville is less touristy than Nashville, a good thing in my book. I like cities that have a lot to offer yet aren't overrun by tourists.
I'm hoping to work in a visit to both cities in the near future.
Moderator cut: see below Noticed you linked dupes of Yelp and misdirected links to compare Jefferson to Davidson (balance), but the whole idea of using Yelp to support your point is ludicrous. I mean, if you're looking for budget burgers and bar food, then check in with Yelp. Meanwhile, Nashville is on the radar of every culinary celebrity and "plain old" Hollywood celebrity alike. Just the other day I heard of a big star who flew into Nashville JUST TO EAT! And I can't even remember who it was because it happens all the time. But if you want to use Yelp as your guide, it shows that Nashville has 3657 to Louisville's 2527 restaurants. Really!? And while there are more neighborhoods listed for Louisville, there are vastly more cities listed for Nashville. Once again, Yelp shows that Nashville is far more important to a more populous region. And if you want to use towns in Indiana to claim "walkable" neighborhoods, then you'll have to concede Franklin, Murfreesboro, Springfield, Gallatin and Dickson and their "walkable" neighborhoods to Nashville. You will not find a more traditional main street downtown with scads of neighborhoods than in Franklin and Murfreesboro. In fact, both were listed with Nashville by Bankrate as Top 10 cities in which to retire. That's on top of (as you noted) the city's business friendliness (Ranked #2), as Nashville's GDP is $107B and Louisville's is a comparatively paltry $67B. And yet, you mention that as if it's just marginally important. At the same time, you seem to be under the delusion that a heavily unionized city with a predominantly blue collar population would somehow have a great business climate if it seceded from Kentucky! Really?! Just take a look at Detroit. I mean, this little contest you've conceived between Nashville and Louisville is absurd, and you need to force yourself to be realistic. Moderator cut: - But more importantly, if you are truly happy in Louisville, then you should not give two whiffs about what others think of it. I have had lots of fun on many trips to Louisville over the years and my impressions have been very favorable. Moderator cut: -
So perhaps it's a good thing that the OP has seen our replies. As such, s/he may be able to better judge the objectivity of the posters here.
No, it is a stastical FACT that Louisville is a LARGER CITY/CORE COUNTY. No one is using "balances" I am comparing Apples to Apples...Jefferson County KY had 741k people in 2010. Davidson County TN had 626k people in 2010.
The difference in 2010 was a substantial 115k. I don't trust census estimates either. So we will see what Census 2020 shows. You can't just use computers for everything...the paper mailers help...for example it shows I still live in FL (and IL) but I live in KY now.
Now, I am sure Nashville is closing the gap. But PLEASE spare us that Nashville is a "big city" compared to Louisville. Both are successful, nice, growing cities. Louisville is a larger, more urban city with better neighborhoods and history. Yes, Nasvhille is a bigger METRO due to much larger edge counties and a decentralized MSA anchored by such sprawlburbs as Franklin or Mufreesboro. For me personally, what good do those towns do for me other than give me traffic? I suppose they could be part of the reason Nashville has pro sports and more big business (pumps up the MSA $$), but what does that do for MY quality of life? As many have said, Louisville is a much more organic, livable city, and through its smart growth in the last 10 years, it is regaining its rightful place as an important center in the upper south and lower midwest.
Nashville is a newer, shinier city with a flashier, more advanced tourist friendly and compact , active dt.
And Louisville is most certainly booming, just in a different way than Nashville. As others noted, it will likely never grow like Nashville unless the "bluebloods" in KY state government give more tax money back to the city and lower or abolish state income tax to attract big business.
There is no contest between Louisville and Nashville. And I am glad you think as highly of NAshville as I do of Louisville. But don't come in here acting like Louisville is this rusting Detroit city because you know very well, even if only based on my posts of factual development, that it is not.
Interesting discussion. Both Louisville and Nashville are on the rise, but Nashville is more of a boom town at the moment, and it's playing a bit of catch up in terms of multifamily and hotel development in relation to its larger Southeast peers. A while back, I was talking to a multifamily broker from Nashville and he mentioned that, prior to the current wave of new construction, large apt. projects weren't allowed in some districts in Nashville... which was a bit of a surprise to me.
In any case, boom towns have their drawbacks -- particularly traffic gridlock and rising cost of living. I'm starting to hear some complaints about both regarding Nashville.
From what I understand, development in Louisville is more organic. There are a lot of loft apartment rehab projects, and that type of development appeals to me more than the shiny blue towers, which are somewhat generic. Louisville is less touristy than Nashville, a good thing in my book. I like cities that have a lot to offer yet aren't overrun by tourists.
I'm hoping to work in a visit to both cities in the near future.
This has also changed in Louisville as they have devised new zoning to accommodate many of these new buildings. Louisville is still getting many new buildings, including several mid and highrises, both proposed and U/C currently.
But you are correct Louisville is seeing more rehabs than anything. As an example, 3 historic downtown highrise apartment buildings are undergoing complete renovations such as KY towers, the 800, and Barrington (the vue). The midrise Crescent Centre also got a total rehab.
There are too many hotel projects to list but two of them are totally rehabbing historic 1920's era midrises, the Starks and Republic buildings.
Excellent, well informed post. Let me know when you visit Louisville and I will guide you on where to go.
This has also changed in Louisville as they have devised new zoning to accommodate many of these new buildings. Louisville is still getting many new buildings, including several mid and highrises, both proposed and U/C currently.
But you are correct Louisville is seeing more rehabs than anything. As an example, 3 historic downtown highrise apartment buildings are undergoing complete renovations such as KY towers, the 800, and Barrington (the vue). The midrise Crescent Centre also got a total rehab.
There are too many hotel projects to list but two of them are totally rehabbing historic 1920's era midrises, the Starks and Republic buildings.
Excellent, well informed post. Let me know when you visit Louisville and I will guide you on where to go.
Those sound like good projects. It's nice that Louisville has a mix of new projects and historic rehabs.
And thanks, I'm hoping to head up in late August. Of course, I'll be checking out downtown, and I want to explore the Highlands. But those are the only ideas on my radar right now so I might call on your expertise when I get closer to my visit.
I don't want to seem like a shill for Louisville, but I'm not a big fan of cities like Nashville whose "boom" seems to be made up of a series of extremely generic looking contemporary apartment buildings that just look awful. Maybe they just look odd because they are shiny and new, but I doubt it. Unfortunately we're getting a bunch of that "style" like the new on on Frankfort avenue, the Axis on Lexington, the new one in Butchertown, the Cambria hotel, the new hotel on Market, etc. The new development at Mercy and Baxter look great compared to what seems to be the norm in contemporary multifamily architecture.
Those sound like good projects. It's nice that Louisville has a mix of new projects and historic rehabs.
And thanks, I'm hoping to head up in late August. Of course, I'll be checking out downtown, and I want to explore the Highlands. But those are the only ideas on my radar right now so I might call on your expertise when I get closer to my visit.
I live here currently in st Mathews (adjacent to the highlands).
But after this contract expires, moving to Charleston, sc.
Highlands parking is atrocious, our new bridges are tolls, traffic continues to get worse.
On the flip side, tons of restaurants and night life if that's your thing.
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
11,974 posts, read 25,466,576 times
Reputation: 12187
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948
Nashville is a newer, shinier city with a flashier, more advanced tourist friendly and compact , active dt.
And Louisville is most certainly booming, just in a different way than Nashville. As others noted, it will likely never grow like Nashville unless the "bluebloods" in KY state government give more tax money back to the city and lower or abolish state income tax to attract big business.
Louisville deals with problems with govt efficiency that Nashville or Indy don't. Tennessee was able to build a 77 mile southern loop around Nashville without a penny of federal funding at a cost of $750 million. By the time you count lawsuits and the bogus tunnel that's about how much Louisville will spend on the East End bridge and 5 miles of extra freeway needed to connect each end of I-265. That will add many years of tolling to pay off which means less disposable income at the local level. Also remember when Hyundai was able to sign to build a plant in Etown and Gov Paul Patton blew it and the factory was built in Alabama?
When you drive in Tennessee the rural interstates are two lanes and then the cities have magnificent urban freeways. In Kentucky the rural interstates are updated and often 3 lanes while Louisville is stuck with outdated cover leaf interchanges that back up in rush hour. If Tennessee controlled Louisville's roads there would be 5 clover leafs updated to quad stacks. States like TN and also Indiana understand the value of cities, Kentucky does not. All rural areas get more back in taxes than they put in but in Kentucky it's on steroids. And I say that as someone with wonderful childhood memories in rural KY.
Louisville seems to have an Old Money population that does not want growth. The East End bridge fiasco or near riots when plans are made to improve dangerous 2 lane country roads being examples. Even cutting down trees that make small airplane runways dangerous at Bowman Field is a hassle. Louisville is in some ways progress, in other ways it's just a bigger version of Pikeville. It's another way Louisville is familiar with New Orleans, which is also a great city with bad state and local govt. I'm not real familiar with that aspect of Nashville but from the outside it seems like the people with power want growth.
I live here currently in st Mathews (adjacent to the highlands).
But after this contract expires, moving to Charleston, sc.
Highlands parking is atrocious, our new bridges are tolls, traffic continues to get worse.
On the flip side, tons of restaurants and night life if that's your thing.
Charleston is a cute town. Just too small. Still, one of the best shopping downtowns in the SE (King st is totally impressive) and a wonderful resort town. I cannot stand the blistering heat either. I personally think its a huge downgrade from Louisville, but I hear you on the problems. I also cannot stand the croakie, moppy hair, and dockers "southern fratboy" look, and while there is some of that in Louisville, it is less prevalent than in the deep south.
Louisville's traffic, especially in the NE suburbs, has gotten almost Nashville-esque. Part of this is rapid growth, but census is correct much of it is due to outdated, rural style infrastructure serving a top 40 CSA.
Charleston is a cute town. Just too small. Still, one of the best shopping downtowns in the SE (King st is totally impressive) and a wonderful resort town. I cannot stand the blistering heat either. I personally think its a huge downgrade from Louisville, but I hear you on the problems. I also cannot stand the croakie, moppy hair, and dockers "southern fratboy" look, and while there is some of that in Louisville, it is less prevalent than in the deep south.
Louisville's traffic, especially in the NE suburbs, has gotten almost Nashville-esque. Part of this is rapid growth, but census is correct much of it is due to outdated, rural style infrastructure serving a top 40 CSA.
No doubt on that. After my air guard service was up (thanks governor for not fighting for the 4 planes we lost), I moved to Vegas. Loved the desert, hated the traffic. Moved back here in 01 and literally didn't recognize it. Every time my parents come through, they just don't get the constant build/build/build.
64 will soon be sprawled all the way to shelbyville. It's already passed simpsonville. On the 71 corridor, soon that will all be sprawl with another Walmart super center and mega Krogers going in off exit 18.
I loved prospect but I can't imagine living out there again. It was bad enough when the harrods creek bridge went down. With the east end bridge, it's a nightmare.
I don't have any antipathy towards here. It's just grown to fast without the necessary infrastructure upgrades... And those upgrades that have come are too ripe with grift resulting in delays, delays, delays.
The one area we do shine over everyplace I have lived is our park system, whether it be the metros or the private Floyd fork. Absolutely first class.
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
11,974 posts, read 25,466,576 times
Reputation: 12187
Getting back to Louisville vs boom towns... we pretty much agree that Louisville's strength is a better pre WW1 urban core with a great Olmstead designed park system. What Louisville lacks is national hype and a good local / state govt.
My thoughts are...
1. Boom towns can grow from Top Down, through mega projects. Louisville will get a few big projects (like Omni) but the focus should be on Bottom Up growth. My big complaint with the current local govt is the focus on mega projects while doing so few small projects. The focus should be on rebuilding the outdated infrastructure - sidewalks, street lights, traffic lights, repaving, converting one way streets back to two way streets. Fill in parking lots downtown with 3 store multi-use buildings that are home to small businesses. Louisville had a thriving downtown pre 1960 and there wasn't one high rise condo. The only downtown street that has been redone since I moved to Louisville in 2002 was 2nd St. Every street downtown needs a makeover as does the entire Baxter Ave / Bardstown Rd corridor. That would do much more for Louisville than spending $300 million on a single high rise condo.
2. Louisville needs an objective local media that keeps govt in line. The only large local newspaper has been against every single project that made (or would have made) Louisville better. They were against airport expansion, the East End bridge, getting an NBA team, building the Yum Center, etc. Local media is simply a bullhorn for the Old Money anti growth East Enders. Local media should instead be a counter weight to the power that big money people have. Did you notice that the local media didn't do one critical story on the $300 million dollar Tunnel Under Trees? That should have been front page news for months, but only a couple alt news webpages reported on it. We will be paying tolls for an extra decade because the local media didn't do it's job.
More recently read some of the stories about cutting down the trees that are encroaching on the Bowman Field runway. The local media always takes the side of the Old Money No Growth Club. Why no stories on how much extra those selfish people are costing tax payers? Rather than spending $50k to take out a few trees it will cost $1 million by the time we have a bunch of hearings and law suits.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
