The Maine Economy (Portland, Bangor, Augusta: sales, insurance, loan)

[dramamama6685]

Originally Posted by Mark S.

I agree with the ideal you're espousing very much.

The problem I see is that we in the US are facing two possible forms of totalitarianism now. The obvious one is the State. Those who tend more toward the conservative or even libertarian view want to reduce government to all but the bare essentials, which many of them don't think goes much beyond national defense and police forces.

The problem I see with this is that getting rid of Big Government does not hand the power over to the people. These days especially, it means handing the reins to Big Business, and that's hardly an improvement. Government, at least as it OUGHT to function, is still subject to the will of the people via the vote. Big Business isn't subject to much of anything but the will of its shareholders and the whims of the market. And hey, if you can buy off enough politicans to get some subsidies, you don't even have to worry so much about the whims of the market these days.

We have come to the conclusion that the obvious cure for private property being given to the few is to see that it is given to the many; not to see that it is taken away from everybody or given in trust to the dear good politicians. Then, having discovered that fact as a fact, we look back at Leo XIII and discover in his old and dated document, of which we took no notice at the time, that he was saying then exactly what we are saying now. "As many as possible of the working classes should become owners." (G.K. Chesterton)

At least if it ever came down to actually "being turned over to big business"...in a free maket we could just take our business elsewhere. I believe that I saw a report a few years back that said Federal spending had increased 300% between 1996 and 2003. Like it wouldn't be obvious that it's growing at an alarming rate, but just thought I'd throw that out there.

[mainebrokerman]

85% of all businesses is SMALL business,, folks like you and i, striving for the american dream, willing to work hard, for a just reward, and if someone works 80 hrs a week, then they should be rewarded more than someone working 30 or not working at all.
i've worked with so many ordinary folks, that want to take a risk,, they have an idea od a service or buy a small business, for many reasons,,,not to work for someone else, to open more doors, to self-sufficiency, and hopefully get rewarded, and someday build enough equity to sell and retire,
im as conservative as they come, i do believe in the incentive reward , system of capitalism, use to be called "profit motive" in college,,the word "profit" has now become a bad word.
yes, are there businesses like enron, and big oil, that operate below board,,,of course,, but that shouldnt reflect, all "business" again,,85% of all business is a small business, with a few employees,,trying to work hard and grow,,
and lets not bastardize most businesses,,,thats where most of us work, and where most of us get health insurance.
the more folks either working for the government,,or on government welfare, the more the rest of us get tax-raped....and buy less goods and services..
i hear all the time, how maine isnt business friendly, and highly over-regulated,,,not a business friendly state,,,we need businesses to come to maine,,for a higher standard of living for its residents (better jobs)
i love this state and wince, every time i hear,,we are one of the highest over-taxed states,,,or highest per capita on welfare..

[flycessna]

Originally Posted by Mark S.

I agree with the ideal you're espousing very much.

The problem I see is that we in the US are facing two possible forms of totalitarianism now. The obvious one is the State. Those who tend more toward the conservative or even libertarian view want to reduce government to all but the bare essentials, which many of them don't think goes much beyond national defense and police forces.

The problem I see with this is that getting rid of Big Government does not hand the power over to the people. These days especially, it means handing the reins to Big Business, and that's hardly an improvement. Government, at least as it OUGHT to function, is still subject to the will of the people via the vote. Big Business isn't subject to much of anything but the will of its shareholders and the whims of the market. And hey, if you can buy off enough politicans to get some subsidies, you don't even have to worry so much about the whims of the market these days.

One of my favorite writings is from thomas Jefferson.

“I am certainly not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.”

Big business is already in control. We don’t have to get rid of big government in the literal term, even though that would be nice. But we can reduce its power and bring it back to where its supposed to be, “beholden to the people”. Enact strict term limits for all elected levels of government. Get rid of the two party system which in my opinion is one party better then the communists.

Any other ideas?

[mainebrokerman]

fly, im with ya there, i believe most campaigns now, are about buying votes, and appeasing special interests. the congress is loaded with mostly lawyers, it was meant for ordinary folks, to represent us all.
i believe the congress,,(both houses) should be on a two yr term,,and if thier net worth is over 500,000 they get paid, 2k a month with no benefits after the term,,what they get now is a golden parachute for life,,sucking off the taxpayers, and most of these guys are already very wealthy,,,and what a combination for "trust" a wealthy lawyer..

[dramamama6685]

Originally Posted by mainebrokerman

fly, im with ya there, i believe most campaigns now, are about buying votes, and appeasing special interests. the congress is loaded with mostly lawyers, it was meant for ordinary folks, to represent us all.
i believe the congress,,(both houses) should be on a two yr term,,and if thier net worth is over 500,000 they get paid, 2k a month with no benefits after the term,,what they get now is a golden parachute for life,,sucking off the taxpayers, and most of these guys are already very wealthy,,,and what a combination for "trust" a wealthy lawyer..

LMAO...so true. Biggest and most profitable business...our government!

[Mark S.]

Originally Posted by flycessna

Any other ideas?

Yep. Make any corporate gift to any elected official absolutely illegal, with punishment including time in federal prison -- for both the politician and the corporate officers.

[Mark S.]

Originally Posted by dramamama6685

At least if it ever came down to actually "being turned over to big business"...in a free maket we could just take our business elsewhere.

Tell that to folks in my home town, where the ONLY place to shop now is Wal-Mart.

For that matter, tell it to those folks in Boston who threw the tea into the harbor a couple of hundred years ago.

[mainewannabe]

Boy do I feel lucky. I found a place full of people who agree with me. That does not happen very often.

I guess I should say 'a place full of people with whom I AGREE.'

Very cool to find you all.

[DavidoftheNorth]

Glad you could join us. Stay with us.

[flycessna]

Wasn't there a time when it was called public Service. Local busines owners and such would get involved albeit to help their business get exposure but to also get invloved and serve.

Now its about power and money. I'd like to see what the average net worth of the rookie congressmen is compared to the average net worth of the seasoned congressmen!