In Maryland, Higher Taxes Chase Out Rich: Study (incomes, quality of life)

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by cry_havoc

No, physical size does not matter, but population does.

In fact a big portion of VAs population lives in NOVA, which actually skews median income up for all of VA. So before you say there is less counties in the Appalachians you need to take into account the actual % of the state and how it affects the state.

People assume MD is DC and Baltimore, but it is so much more, and most of the poor DC suburbs are in MD. Despite this the great wealth in MD makes up for it.

Meanwhile VA is full of poverty, but NOVA brings the state up.

MD is just a much wealthier state, overall.

When I say size matters, I mean there is simply more space for rural populations to live in bigger states. Maryland's small size, and the fact that most of the center of the state is well-off contrasts with VA which has a wealthy region of about the same size as Maryland's, but much more geographic area, and higher population totals in rural, poorer areas. There are about 100,000 people in Western Maryland. My guess is that Appalachian VA has at least 3X this total. For what it is worth, if you take the inner city urban areas of Richmond and the Hampton Rds area, I bet VA's inner city poor are roughly the same as Maryland's too.

I don't feel like adding up the NOVA population and determining its percent of the state total, nor do I wish to do the same for Maryland's central wealthy suburbs, and the smaller population in rural areas. I think we both know enough about the two states to know there is MUCH more rural Virginia where poverty is endemic than Maryland.

We can also use basic logic and conclude that if NOVA is wealthier than the Maryland 'burbs, but the state's overall median income is lower, it is because there is a larger number of lower income earners in VA and that they they DON'T live in NOVA (if they did, those counties' median income would be lower.)

If you won't concede that, there isn't much use to keep talking...unless I feel like number crunching tomorrow.

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

When I say size matters, I mean there is simply more space for rural populations to live in bigger states. Maryland's small size, and the fact that most of the center of the state is well-off contrasts with VA which has a wealthy region of about the same size as Maryland's, but much more geographic area, and higher population totals in rural, poorer areas. There are about 100,000 people in Western Maryland. My guess is that Appalachian VA has at least 3X this total. For what it is worth, if you take the inner city urban areas of Richmond and the Hampton Rds area, I bet VA's inner city poor are roughly the same as Maryland's too.

I don't feel like adding up the NOVA population and determining its percent of the state total, nor do I wish to do the same for Maryland's central wealthy suburbs, and the smaller population in rural areas. I think we both know enough about the two states to know there is MUCH more rural Virginia where poverty is endemic than Maryland.

We can also use basic logic and conclude that if NOVA is wealthier than the Maryland 'burbs, but the state's overall median income is lower, it is because there is a larger number of lower income earners in VA and that they they DON'T live in NOVA (if they did, those counties' median income would be lower.)

If you won't concede that, there isn't much use to keep talking...unless I feel like number crunching tomorrow.

Like I said, a poor person in MD lowers the median wealth MUCH MUCH more than a poor person in VA.

Your argument is basically based off assumptions now. I cant speak for individual burbs, but VA does have some richer counties, but these are counties as a whole. An individual town/city/municipality can vary even within counties.

What we can conclude that there is no great risk of a big migration of wealthy people from MD to VA. In fact wealthy people are constantly moving here.

[westsideboy]

Originally Posted by cry_havoc

Like I said, a poor person in MD lowers the median wealth MUCH MUCH more than a poor person in VA.
Your argument is basically based off assumptions now. I cant speak for individual burbs, but VA does have some richer counties, but these are counties as a whole. An individual town/city/municipality can vary even within counties.

What we can conclude that there is no great risk of a big migration of wealthy people from MD to VA. In fact wealthy people are constantly moving here.

Median just means "mid point" for all earners The more poor you have, the lower the median. So again, the fact that Maryland has less lower income people because the wealthy part of our state is a higher % of the total population than VA is the reason our median income is higher, even though NOVA is richer than suburban Maryland. Here is an example.

Maryland

1, 3, 5, 10, 30

Median is 5

VA

1, 3, 3, 3, 25, 45, 60

Median is 3

VA has more "higher earners" (the 25, 45, and 60) but the median is lower because that big bunch of low earners (the 1 and the 3s) change the midpoint.

How to Calculate the Median Value

As to your larger point, yeah suburban Maryland is wealthy, but not as wealthy as NOVA. Those counties aren't getting poorer in absolute terms, just when compared to NOVA counties.

[nurider2002]

Well, I'm by no means rich but I know my amount of expendable income would be much higher in plenty of other states. Although I grew up in Maryland, I'm not that big a fan so, I will be relocating within the next
2 - 3 years. Taxation in Maryland is simply out of control.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by cry_havoc

PG county is a county and not a suburb. It has some rich areas, but it is mainly poorer suburbs and many of them are just as bad as SE DC.

But me and you are having a conversation about different jurisdictions in this area. If PG County was so poor, then how in the world does it rank amongst the top 100 wealthiest counties in the entire country? The most populous city in PG is Bowie, and has a median income of $99k. Have you been to PG? Like really been to PG? If you believe it is a mainly poorer suburb then maybe we should not continue this conversation. Being poor is relative in this conversation. PG County is poorer than other parts of this area, but when you compare it to the rest of country, it is wealthy. Cost of living plays a huge role in that.

Originally Posted by cry_havoc

MD is just a wealthy state, but largely middle class. So even poor crime ridden counties like PG are wealthy compared to the rest of the country. It just backs up everything I have been saying.

As for Moco it is increasing, and not the fastest. It is in the middle, but some counties like Loudon are actually decreasing. There is a lot of factors at play.

Finally, all of MD is getting richer, not just the DC area.

Has nothing to do with MD's wealth, it's the wealth of government jobs that benefit PG. 25% of the feds workforce in the DC area, come from PG. PG relies heavily on being next to DC. The same can be said for places most places in MD which is what the article that you posted stated was the issue with MoCo gaining wealth.

Yes Loudoun County isn't growing as much, but over the course of a few years, it was growing in wealth at a much higher rate than just about any county/jurisdiction in this nation.

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by pgtitans

But me and you are having a conversation about different jurisdictions in this area. If PG County was so poor, then how in the world does it rank amongst the top 100 wealthiest counties in the entire country? The most populous city in PG is Bowie, and has a median income of $99k. Have you been to PG? Like really been to PG? If you believe it is a mainly poorer suburb then maybe we should not continue this conversation. Being poor is relative in this conversation. PG County is poorer than other parts of this area, but when you compare it to the rest of country, it is wealthy. Cost of living plays a huge role in that.



Has nothing to do with MD's wealth, it's the wealth of government jobs that benefit PG. 25% of the feds workforce in the DC area, come from PG. PG relies heavily on being next to DC. The same can be said for places most places in MD which is what the article that you posted stated was the issue with MoCo gaining wealth.

Yes Loudoun County isn't growing as much, but over the course of a few years, it was growing in wealth at a much higher rate than just about any county/jurisdiction in this nation.

Because MD is a wealthy state. It has so many rich people it brings the median income up. So obviously them fleeing to escape Taxes is not a problem.

[french paris]

It is better to get $70 000 in MD or $57000 in CA ....Or $41000 in TN ? It is just an example

[molukai]

41K in Tennessee is a better quality of life than the other two places with the specified incomes that you arbitrarily came up with, french. But continuing with what you were getting at: PG County may have a higher income in terms of dollar amounts compared to most of the rest of the country, but it is meaningless if the cost of living puts them really on par with those making half that amount in a place like Tennessee. And unlike those that have low income dollar amounts from low cost of living areas, people in MD can't rely on qualifying for any government assistance programs.

[french paris]

Thanks Molukai

[cry_havoc]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

Median just means "mid point" for all earners The more poor you have, the lower the median. So again, the fact that Maryland has less lower income people because the wealthy part of our state is a higher % of the total population than VA is the reason our median income is higher, even though NOVA is richer than suburban Maryland. Here is an example.

Maryland

1, 3, 5, 10, 30

Median is 5

VA

1, 3, 3, 3, 25, 45, 60

Median is 3

VA has more "higher earners" (the 25, 45, and 60) but the median is lower because that big bunch of low earners (the 1 and the 3s) change the midpoint.

How to Calculate the Median Value

As to your larger point, yeah suburban Maryland is wealthy, but not as wealthy as NOVA. Those counties aren't getting poorer in absolute terms, just when compared to NOVA counties.

I know how to calculate mean income and median income.

However, your claims are BS until you prove them. MD could be wealthier, or it could not be. The fact we KNOW is MD has a higher income. You have given NO statistics to back up anything you said.

We dont need 3rd grade math lessons, we all understand what mean and median is, I hope. What we do need is facts.