09-28-2012, 10:21 AM
Location: Massachusetts
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Thought I'd try and post the "stay or move" conundrum I alluded to in the solar panels thread. I've been overthinking this for the past year or so, time to get outside input!
Our household consists of me (SAHM), husband (works in Newton near 128), and two kiddoes (3 year old and 4 month old). We currently own a house in Arlington (figured you'd need to know where in order to give meaningful advice). We're totally unable to decide whether to stay here or move.
The main issue is that my husband and I want different things from a neighborhood. He wants a walkable neighborhood, preferably urban/suburban, definitely not rural, and no more than 30-40 mins from work. He likes where we live now, though it's not his ideal, and for him the hassle and cost of moving aren't worth it.
I, on the other hand, want…land. I want to live somewhere where I can't see or hear neighbors, and somewhere I can have a huge garden, fruit trees, chickens, and privacy as complete as I can get.
I've basically come to the conclusion that I can't have what I want on our budget (~500k) without moving too far away from husband's work. So I'm a bit paralyzed over whether to stay here and make the best of it, or try somewhere with somewhat larger lots (though we have a large lot by Arlington standards) and risk being just as unhappy as I am here. We want our next house to be our home till the kids are out, so I'm feeling a huge pressure to get it right. Argh!
09-28-2012, 10:37 AM
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You might want to look into Reading, MA. The lots are larger and the schools are rated pretty well. Not sure how the commute would be though.
09-28-2012, 12:02 PM
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Well, a compromise is always possible...
What are not ideal features of your current location for your husband? Is it mainly commute, or is there something else? That might help us to look for the right compromise. The idea here is, if both you and your husband see each others point, and both of you agree to give up something in order to gain something, a happy medium can be reached, and you won't feel that only one person gets what s/he wants and the other doesn't.
You are right, in order to find big lot you need to move further out. But then there is a choice of towns that would be 30 to 40 minutes away from Newton. Wayland comes to mind as first choice. You can have a very private lot, secluded by trees, and it will be close enough to Newton. They also have similar solar panels program going on, so that may be enticing for you
In this price range though the house itself will then most likely need work or be small (or both). So that's a trade off, and I know that not many people want to deal with renovations not only because of price, but more so because of the efforts and time involved.
Sudbury, South Natick, North Framingham, Sherborn are all good options, with similar downsides...
Does your husband need to drive, or can (would) he use commuter rail? If his work is around Auburndale / west Newton, this could be an option and area to compromise.
How big would you like your lot to be? What would be the smallest acceptable size? A friend of mine who lives in Natick has garden, fruit trees and chickens - all of that on a medium to small sized lot (for Natick standards). She can see her neighbors though
I'm working in MetroWest area, that's why my suggestions are for these towns. Hope someone else would chime in and offer you other options.
09-28-2012, 07:52 PM
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Good points, Anna_T. It's clear that some kind of compromise is needed here. Two of the places you mentioned came to my mind immediately: Wayland and South Natick. But then again it depends on several of the issues raised (such as the housing budget being borderline for Wayland), as well as the question of whether we're talking about a driving commute or public transit.
Noodlepop (love the name), how "urban" a place does your husband need to have? The main business district in Wayland is in the Cochituate section of town. That commercial zone centers around the intersection of routes 27 and 30. Right at the intersection there are a couple of small shopping centers, and there are various restaurants and a few small stores and such kind of strung along rt. 27 both north and south of the intersection. So there are some small local kinds of businesses in that area, but nothing that really resembles a downtown in the sense of dense construction, or buildings right against the sidewalk. Natick Center has more of the true downtown feel, but it's definitely more like the commercial center of a medium-sized to large town, not truly urban, though larger than many small commercial zones in outlying residential sections of cities.
In the case of either Natick Center or Cochituate, another question would be whether your husband is up for a bit of a walk, or for driving a short distance to a center with small businesses, or does he feel he really needs to step out the door and walk a block or two and be in the nearest commercial district? There are a few properties with somewhat larger lots in Wayland that might be within a fairly short distance to the Cochituate commercial zone, and possibly a few decent-sized lots in South Natick that would be sort of a short walk to Natick Ctr., but the options for large-lot properties a really quick walk from either Natick Ctr. or the business center of Cochituate are fairly limited. There are significantly more options if one is okay with a quick drive, then parking and being able to walk around the business district.
One other town that comes to mind as at least a possibility is Needham. I'm not really very familiar with Needham, but I do know they appear to have a decent downtown area, though again not truly urban in character. What I'm not sure about is whether there are properties with large lots in Needham anywhere near the town center. Might be worth checking into.
09-28-2012, 09:43 PM
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I think people have nailed it. If you like Arlington but are looking for a town with a better chance at a sizable lot, Natick is a great option (especially considering your husband's commute). Like Arlington, it has good enough schools unless your bar is incredibly high AND it's relatively affordable. The main downside is its greater distance to Boston and Cambridge. The one thing I think separates Natick from Arlington now, IMHO, is that it's underrated/undervalued. As you well know, Arlington is boosted by people spilling over from Cambridge who would never consider Natick.
09-28-2012, 09:44 PM
Location: North of Boston
3,689 posts, read
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Reputation: 3668
Welcome to city-data.com!
I don't really see how any advice from here is going to be helpful; you and your husband are looking for completely different things. I think you need to iron that out first.
I will say this, however, your kids won't want this as they get older: "...somewhere where I can't see or hear neighbors, and somewhere I can have a huge garden, fruit trees, chickens, and privacy as complete as I can get." Kids want to be near other kids, in a neighborhood, where they can play in each others yards or (gasp!) in the street.
09-29-2012, 06:20 AM
Location: Beverly, Mass
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I agree with gf2020. I kind of wanted what you want, but in that case be prepared to be their chauffeur until they can get their own car to drive them around to playdates. Unless they are introverts, by age 6 kids become very social and will ask you every day for playdates. My son comes home, puts his backpack down and goes outside to play with other kids until he gets hungry. It turned out he found a best friend next door. We have a dead end street, where kids ride their bikes and play basketball all day. All of these kids are like a family. Older kids come to my house and ask to take my youngest out to watch him. My oldest can ride his bike with older kids to get ice-cream around the corner. They will be able to walk to middle school and high school with their friends. That makes me glad we didn't buy that house with fruit trees I so wanted. You can't have that and the other. It's something to think about, when you gain something, you give something else up. I have a feeling that's what your husband likes about your house.
May be you should sit down and make a list of why you want what you want. There always can be some kind of compromise. It doesn't cost anything to drive around and look at towns and houses. May be if you show him what you could have had, he can meet you in the middle.
09-29-2012, 11:28 AM
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It depends on what your husband considers rural - IMO there are no rural areas in MA, but my frame of reference is the middle of the country.
But he has a good point about walkability and there is definitely a difference from town to town on this. I wish more towns in MA would think about putting in sidewalks and maintaining the one they do have. I suppose these things, like most things, get all backed up in town politics though.
09-29-2012, 01:31 PM
Location: Massachusetts
9 posts, read
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Reputation: 14
Thanks for all your thoughtful replies! I'm still reading, haven't found time yet to sit down and think through answers. Will reply as soon as I'm able.
09-29-2012, 03:01 PM
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These are all things we are going through as well. As people who have lived in Arlington/Cambridge/Somerville/Waltham we are desperate to not see our neighbors. DH wants chickens and woods while I would just love privacy. However, we have a child who is an "only"- so I am insisting (much to DH's chagrin but I know he'll come around) that we locate in a neighborhood with activity,sidewalks, families with a more suburban-type of elbow room. Sure DH will never get his acreage and I'll never be more than a maple tree away from my neighbor's bathroom, but I think this will be the best for the kid.
I think that Natick is a good recommendation, although from what I have seen lately it is no longer undervalued as it once was. The schools are decent, there is town sewer/water/curbside trash pickup (many things you don't get in the country) and sidewalks in many places. Additionally since Natick has been developed in stages there are actual neighborhoods which is something that you don't really see once you get further out live Dover/Sherborn or even Wayland, etc. In many places in the metrowest the only roads are busy roads and you'll be dodging SUVs to talk to your neighbors if you are lucky enough to have sidewalks on the double yellow road.
Natick also offers a back-roads commute to Newton so he could avoid the pike/128 intersection. Also look into Wayland which will give you a perspective on Natick's value.
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Median household income ($) - Black or African American
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Hospitalized patients (Apr 18, 2022)
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COVID Vaccine doses distributed (per 100k population) (Sep 19, 2023)
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Commute - mean travel time to work (minutes)
Travel time to work - Less than 5 minutes (%)
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Occupied housing units (%)
Vacant housing units (%)
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Vacancy status - For sale only (%)
Vacancy status - Rented or sold, not occupied (%)
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Residents with income below the poverty level (%)
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Poverty status for native-born residents (%)
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Poverty among high school graduates not in families (%)
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Residents with income below the poverty level (%) - White
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Air pollution - Air Quality Index (AQI)
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1996 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Democratic Party (Clinton)
1996 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Republican Party (Dole)
1996 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Other
2000 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Democratic Party (Gore)
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2004 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Democratic Party (Kerry)
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2012 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Other
2016 Presidential Elections Results (%) - Democratic Party (Clinton)
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Ancestries Reported - Arab (%)
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Educational Attainment - No schooling completed (%)
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Urban houses (%)
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Mortgage status - with mortgage (%)
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Geographical mobility - Same house 1 year ago (%)
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Housing units in structures - 1, detached (%)
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Housing units in structures - 50 or more (%)
Housing units in structures - Mobile home (%)
Housing units in structures - Boat, RV, van, etc. (%)
House/condo owner moved in on average (years ago)
Renter moved in on average (years ago)
Year householder moved into unit - Moved in 1999 to March 2000 (%)
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Means of transportation to work - Drove car alone (%)
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Working at home (%)
Industry diversity
Most Common Industries - Agriculture, forestry, fishing and hunting, and mining (%)
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Occupation diversity
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Most Common Occupations - Farming, fishing, and forestry occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Construction and extraction occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Installation, maintenance, and repair occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Production, transportation, and material moving occupations (%)
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Most Common Occupations - Transportation occupations (%)
Most Common Occupations - Material moving occupations (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutionalized population (%)
People in Group quarters - Correctional institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Federal prisons and detention centers (%)
People in Group quarters - Halfway houses (%)
People in Group quarters - Local jails and other confinement facilities (including police lockups) (%)
People in Group quarters - Military disciplinary barracks (%)
People in Group quarters - State prisons (%)
People in Group quarters - Other types of correctional institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Nursing homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals/wards, hospices, and schools for the handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals/wards and hospices for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospices or homes for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Military hospitals or wards for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Other hospitals or wards for chronically ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Hospitals or wards for drug/alcohol abuse (%)
People in Group quarters - Mental (Psychiatric) hospitals or wards (%)
People in Group quarters - Schools, hospitals, or wards for the mentally retarded (%)
People in Group quarters - Schools, hospitals, or wards for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutions for the deaf (%)
People in Group quarters - Institutions for the blind (%)
People in Group quarters - Orthopedic wards and institutions for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Wards in general hospitals for patients who have no usual home elsewhere (%)
People in Group quarters - Wards in military hospitals for patients who have no usual home elsewhere (%)
People in Group quarters - Juvenile institutions (%)
People in Group quarters - Long-term care (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for abused, dependent, and neglected children (%)
People in Group quarters - Residential treatment centers for emotionally disturbed children (%)
People in Group quarters - Training schools for juvenile delinquents (%)
People in Group quarters - Short-term care, detention or diagnostic centers for delinquent children (%)
People in Group quarters - Type of juvenile institution unknown (%)
People in Group quarters - Noninstitutionalized population (%)
People in Group quarters - College dormitories (includes college quarters off campus) (%)
People in Group quarters - Military quarters (%)
People in Group quarters - On base (%)
People in Group quarters - Barracks, unaccompanied personnel housing (UPH), (Enlisted/Officer), ;and similar group living quarters for military personnel (%)
People in Group quarters - Transient quarters for temporary residents (%)
People in Group quarters - Military ships (%)
People in Group quarters - Group homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes or halfway houses for drug/alcohol abuse (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the mentally ill (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the mentally retarded (%)
People in Group quarters - Homes for the physically handicapped (%)
People in Group quarters - Other group homes (%)
People in Group quarters - Religious group quarters (%)
People in Group quarters - Dormitories (%)
People in Group quarters - Agriculture workers' dormitories on farms (%)
People in Group quarters - Job Corps and vocational training facilities (%)
People in Group quarters - Other workers' dormitories (%)
People in Group quarters - Crews of maritime vessels (%)
People in Group quarters - Other nonhousehold living situations (%)
People in Group quarters - Other noninstitutional group quarters (%)
Residents speaking English at home (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking English at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking Spanish at home - Foreign born (%)
Residents speaking other language at home (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Born in the United States (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Native, born elsewhere (%)
Residents speaking other language at home - Foreign born (%)
Class of Workers - Employee of private company (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed in own incorporated business (%)
Class of Workers - Private not-for-profit wage and salary workers (%)
Class of Workers - Local government workers (%)
Class of Workers - State government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Federal government workers (%)
Class of Workers - Self-employed workers in own not incorporated business and Unpaid family workers (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in houses and condos - No fuel used (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Utility gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Bottled, tank, or LP gas (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Electricity (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Fuel oil, kerosene, etc. (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Coal or coke (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Wood (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Solar energy (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - Other fuel (%)
House heating fuel used in apartments - No fuel used (%)
Armed forces status - In Armed Forces (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Veteran (%)
Armed forces status - Civilian - Nonveteran (%)
Fatal accidents locations in years 2005-2021
Fatal accidents locations in 2005
Fatal accidents locations in 2006
Fatal accidents locations in 2007
Fatal accidents locations in 2008
Fatal accidents locations in 2009
Fatal accidents locations in 2010
Fatal accidents locations in 2011
Fatal accidents locations in 2012
Fatal accidents locations in 2013
Fatal accidents locations in 2014
Fatal accidents locations in 2015
Fatal accidents locations in 2016
Fatal accidents locations in 2017
Fatal accidents locations in 2018
Fatal accidents locations in 2019
Fatal accidents locations in 2020
Fatal accidents locations in 2021
Alcohol use - People drinking some alcohol every month (%)
Alcohol use - People not drinking at all (%)
Alcohol use - Average days/month drinking alcohol
Alcohol use - Average drinks/week
Alcohol use - Average days/year people drink much
Audiometry - Average condition of hearing (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear a whisper from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - People that can hear normal voice from across a quiet room (%)
Audiometry - Ears ringing, roaring, buzzing (%)
Audiometry - Had a job exposure to loud noise (%)
Audiometry - Had off-work exposure to loud noise (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high blood pressure (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Checking blood pressure at home (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Frequently checking blood cholesterol (%)
Blood Pressure & Cholesterol - Has high cholesterol level (%)
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at supermarket/grocery store
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on food at other stores
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on eating out
Consumer Behavior - Money monthly spent on carryout/delivered foods
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at supermarket/grocery store (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on food at other stores (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on eating out (%)
Consumer Behavior - Income spent on carryout/delivered foods (%)
Current Health Status - General health condition (%)
Current Health Status - Blood donors (%)
Current Health Status - Has blood ever tested for HIV virus (%)
Current Health Status - Left-handed people (%)
Dermatology - People using sunscreen (%)
Diabetes - Diabetics (%)
Diabetes - Had a blood test for high blood sugar (%)
Diabetes - People taking insulin (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Diet health (%)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Milk product consumption (# of products/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals not home prepared (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Meals from fast food or pizza place (#/week)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Ready-to-eat foods (#/month)
Diet Behavior & Nutrition - Frozen meals/pizza (#/month)
Drug Use - People that ever used marijuana or hashish (%)
Drug Use - Ever used hard drugs (%)
Drug Use - Ever used any form of cocaine (%)
Drug Use - Ever used heroin (%)
Drug Use - Ever used methamphetamine (%)
Health Insurance - People covered by health insurance (%)
Kidney Conditions-Urology - Avg. # of times urinating at night
Medical Conditions - People with asthma (%)
Medical Conditions - People with anemia (%)
Medical Conditions - People with psoriasis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with overweight (%)
Medical Conditions - Elderly people having difficulties in thinking or remembering (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever received blood transfusion (%)
Medical Conditions - People having trouble seeing even with glass/contacts (%)
Medical Conditions - People with arthritis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with gout (%)
Medical Conditions - People with congestive heart failure (%)
Medical Conditions - People with coronary heart disease (%)
Medical Conditions - People with angina pectoris (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had heart attack (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had stroke (%)
Medical Conditions - People with emphysema (%)
Medical Conditions - People with thyroid problem (%)
Medical Conditions - People with chronic bronchitis (%)
Medical Conditions - People with any liver condition (%)
Medical Conditions - People who ever had cancer or malignancy (%)
Mental Health - People who have little interest in doing things (%)
Mental Health - People feeling down, depressed, or hopeless (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble sleeping or sleeping too much (%)
Mental Health - People feeling tired or having little energy (%)
Mental Health - People with poor appetite or overeating (%)
Mental Health - People feeling bad about themself (%)
Mental Health - People who have trouble concentrating on things (%)
Mental Health - People moving or speaking slowly or too fast (%)
Mental Health - People having thoughts they would be better off dead (%)
Oral Health - Average years since last visit a dentist
Oral Health - People embarrassed because of mouth (%)
Oral Health - People with gum disease (%)
Oral Health - General health of teeth and gums (%)
Oral Health - Average days a week using dental floss/device
Oral Health - Average days a week using mouthwash for dental problem
Oral Health - Average number of teeth
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to control insects (%)
Pesticide Use - Households using pesticides to kill weeds (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity work activities (%)
Physical Activity - People walking or bicycling (%)
Physical Activity - People doing vigorous-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - People doing moderate-intensity recreational activities (%)
Physical Activity - Average hours a day doing sedentary activities
Physical Activity - Average hours a day watching TV or videos
Physical Activity - Average hours a day using computer
Physical Functioning - People having limitations keeping them from working (%)
Physical Functioning - People limited in amount of work they can do (%)
Physical Functioning - People that need special equipment to walk (%)
Physical Functioning - People experiencing confusion/memory problems (%)
Physical Functioning - People requiring special healthcare equipment (%)
Prescription Medications - Average number of prescription medicines taking
Preventive Aspirin Use - Adults 40+ taking low-dose aspirin (%)
Reproductive Health - Vaginal deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Cesarean deliveries (%)
Reproductive Health - Deliveries resulted in a live birth (%)
Reproductive Health - Pregnancies resulted in a delivery (%)
Reproductive Health - Women breastfeeding newborns (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had a hysterectomy (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that had both ovaries removed (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever taken birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women taking birth control pills (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used Depo-Provera or injectables (%)
Reproductive Health - Women that have ever used female hormones (%)
Sexual Behavior - People 18+ that ever had sex (vaginal, anal, or oral) (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had anal sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Males 18+ that ever had any sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had vaginal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever performed oral sex on a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had anal sex with a man (%)
Sexual Behavior - Females 18+ that ever had any kind of sex with a woman (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first had sex
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female vaginal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a woman (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of woman performed oral sex on in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male anal sex partners in lifetime (males 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average age people first performed oral sex on a man (18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male oral sex partners in lifetime (18+)
Sexual Behavior - People using protection when performing oral sex (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of times people have vaginal or anal sex a year
Sexual Behavior - People having sex without condom (%)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of male vaginal sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Average number of female sex partners in lifetime (females 18+)
Sexual Behavior - Circumcised males 18+ (%)
Sleep Disorders - Average hours sleeping at night
Sleep Disorders - People that has trouble sleeping (%)
Smoking-Cigarette Use - People smoking cigarettes (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with smell (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ having problems with taste (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had wisdom teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had tonsils teeth removed (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a loss of consciousness because of a head injury (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had a broken nose or other serious injury to face or skull (%)
Taste & Smell - People 40+ that ever had two or more sinus infections (%)
Weight - Average height (inches)
Weight - Average weight (pounds)
Weight - Average BMI
Weight - People that are obese (%)
Weight - People that ever were obese (%)
Weight - People trying to lose weight (%)