[ram2]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

This is just a rhetoric point used by people who want to distract attention from the fact that we need to fix the roads. Less than 5% of the trucks on the road are anywhere near the limit and Michigan requires more axles for the heavy loads. It may have an impact on the condition of the roads, but it is a tiny impact. Not spending enough on the roads for the past 20 years is the biggest imact. Freeze thaw is next. Age/traffic comes next. The heavy truck issue is probably fiteenth or twentieth on the causes of road problems. And no. The amoutn of tax dollars that goes to roads in Michigan is nto on par with the amounts in nearby states. Plus we have fewer users paying for the same number, or more roads in most instances.

Maretials vary from place to place in every state. Mostly it is controlled by Federal standards since most roads have some federal money in them these days. Concrete generally lasts longer, but it is harder to patch and comepletely inflexible. It also costs a ton more. Asphalt mixes are pretty much the same, there are some differences, some types are experiemental. The same is true of concrete.

Ohio has more money for roads. One of the biggest reasons is the turnpike. The tolls pay for maintenance of the turnpike. However the people travelling through still buy gas and pay taxes on the gas. This generates money for roads that these people do not use. Thus, even with the same tax rates, Ohio and indiana would have more moeny for their roads. However I think both states also have higher taxes for roads. I know Indiana does, I cannot remember Ohio.

Even if Michigan could have toll roads, we are not a pass through state. Thuse we do not have thousands of people driving through our state to elsewhere to help us pay for our roads. Other than tourists (hunters) we pretty much have to pay for our roads on our own. I really do not care which pocket they take the funds from: gas tax; registration fee; sales tax; any way they do it, it is coming form my bank account. I do care about whether they do something to reduce waste and be more efficient. I think they are working on that. One of the new bills will prioiritized road work based on use (traffic) this makes more sense. Resurfacing roads that get six cars a day while heavily used roads fall apart makes no sense.They also need to quit wasting money on band aids and invest the money to really fix the roads for a change.

Numerous fallacies here. First of all, truck weight DOES make a difference - have you noticed those weigh stations along the freeways? They are not there just for the tourists. Also, the maximum allowable truck weight was increased in 1974 in compensation for the 55mph speed limit so truckers could balance slower speeds with more cargo.

I-75 in northern Ohio is not a toll road but is in better condition than I-75 in southern Michigan. Same weather conditions. The gas tax money collected on the Ohio Turnpike is only used for maintenance on the Turnpike.

Gas tax money is diverted for other pork barrel projects. Jennifer Granholm used state gas tax money to build a turtle fence along US31 by Muskegon. This did nothing to fix potholes. The politicians also let contractors get away with sub-standard work. When I-275 in the western suburbs of Detroit was repaved in 1999, the road was supposed to have a 20 year warranty. However, the politicians caved in to the contractor, John Carlo Construction, and that warranty was nullified.

[ram2]

If Michigan does not have thousands of people driving through like other states, then there should be less wear and tear of Michigan's roads due to reduced usage.

[scorpio516]

Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly

Come up North. The roads here are crap. The only exceptions are a few places they have resurfaced freeways (shovel ready, etc). Other than that, lots o pot holes. My wife destroyed a tire 3 weeks ago. Not sure how SoCal swung good roads when the rest of the state is pathetic.

As a related side bar, we recently drove into OR and immediately could feel the difference. Not only were OR roads much smoother, they also seem to drain rain water much better. I've never figured out why CA roads tend to collect water so effectively, it's a hydroplaning test on a grand scale. I know, rhetorical question. They are designed and built cheap, that means flat as a pancake and crummy materials.

Roads in Sac are pretty good. But also hold water, and Californians don't know how to drive in the rain .

There is one pretty crappy road near me. It's got some cracks. Last time I was in Michigan, 3 years ago, almost EVERY road was worse than the worst road in the Sacramento suburbs, even the road up to 7000' (which get hundreds of inches of snow and chains are legal too)

[Retroit]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

I spend at least $1000 per year per car reparing damage caused by potholes and patches.

I've spent $0 in my lifetime for repairs. You must have to drive on some pretty bad roads? (Or exaggerating?)

I also question your source for claiming that the freeze-thaw cycle is not the primary cause. The roads pretty much anywhere down south are much better. I doubt they all pay as much as California in gas taxes.

But I do support higher gas taxes for better roads.

[jmz768]

I've hit a pothole so big and so hard that I was sure that I had broken something. Ends up that nothing was broken. There's no way possible that somebody is incurring $1,000 a year in car repairs due to the roads.

[ram2]

Originally Posted by Retroit

I've spent $0 in my lifetime for repairs. You must have to drive on some pretty bad roads? (Or exaggerating?)

I also question your source for claiming that the freeze-thaw cycle is not the primary cause. The roads pretty much anywhere down south are much better. I doubt they all pay as much as California in gas taxes.

But I do support higher gas taxes for better roads.

So why didn't the roads get fixed when John Engler raised the state gas tax?

[Bydand]

MI roads are only worse than SOME other places. Spend some time in the NE, you will quickly appreciate the road conditions in MI. Plus once you get out of the busy SE corner of the State, the roads get markedly better because of the lower traffic volumes on them.

[ram2]

The Pennsylvania Turnpike has high tolls and that road is terrible.

[michigan83]

MI roads are only worse than SOME other places. Spend some time in the NE, you will quickly appreciate the road conditions in MI. Plus once you get out of the busy SE corner of the State, the roads get markedly better because of the lower traffic volumes on them.

I agree that the roads in SE Michigan are MUCH worse than the rest of the state. In Ann Arbor, you can practically watch the roads fall apart before your eyes. I couldn't believe how destroyed the roads were in Ann Arbor.

I am in the Lansing area, and the roads aren't too bad. I would describe them as acceptable. And a lot of our rural state highways are very nice, actually, compared to other states. Smooth pavement and nice wide shoulders that you don't see on other state highways.

But I still get jealous when I travel through southern states. Drove across Maryland two weeks ago and it was like riding on a cloud... a dream come true.

[roozie1]

i am glad i do not live in Michigan