Make the Twin Cities even better !!! (St. Paul, Duluth: how much, subsidized, taxes)

[wherespankakehouse?]

Saints ballpark in lower downtown St. Paul

outdoor football stadium for Vikings in the suburbs

redevelopment of downtown east/Metrodome, including a central park

better access to free parking in downtown Mpls on nights and weekends- would it be possible to extend the LRT just north of Target Field and create a Ft. Snelling sized park & ride that's a lot closer to the downtown core? Otherwise, I'm guessing that the ABC Ramps are well under capacity for most nights and weekends as is(?)

a true light rail network connecting the downtowns, airport, MOA, U of M, & Uptown *in progress*

free public transportation between Uptown/Downtown on evenings and weekends, whether that's accomplished by LRT, streetcar, or shuttle bus. (e.g. downtown Denver, Humphrey-Lindberg)

extend the North Star line to St. Cloud

invest in infrastructure and education

smart growth metropolitan boundaries (e.g. Portland)

a/ the Twin Cities has established a comprehensive mass transit network, forget HSR and build a grade separated maglev to Chicago/Milwaukee/Madison/LaCrosse/Rochester


To help pay for it (as previously stated):

MOA Casino that capitalizes on out-of-state revenues

legalize and tax marijuana

let the grocery stores sell beer on a Sunday

[wherespankakehouse?]

do not give historical designation status to building such as Cedar Riverside Plaza

[Min-Chi-Cbus]

I thought they were already designated "historic", for some reason...

[wherespankakehouse?]

no, I believe you're right. I think a major renovation is planned or already under way.


On a related note, does anyone know if there has ever been an estimate on what it would take to rebuild the Metropolitan Building? I know the cost would be astronomical. Would it even be possible to create a reasonable facsimile given the building materials and modern building codes?

[audadvnc]

If you have the money, you can get a building renovated in what would be indistinguishable from the original, but it can be tremendously expensive (think twice to three times the cost of a new structure before you even consider the expensive add-on fixtures like original chandeliers). OTOH you'd get new plumbing in a really interesting structure.

[wherespankakehouse?]

bring back Peanuts and Camp Snoopy to the MOA



About

I thought this site had some interesting ideas. I'm not sure how many of them are actually feasible. I like the idea of daylighting Bassett Creek, restoration of St. Anthony Falls, and Great Northern Gardens.

[djconklin]

>also better light rail. which hopefully will allow more places to live in and around downtown, on both sides of the river.
===
Light rail is the wrong way to go--you are locked into where you laid the tracks. It would better to run busses every 5 minutes or so.

[golfgal]

Originally Posted by wherespankakehouse?

bring back Peanuts and Camp Snoopy to the MOA



About

I thought this site had some interesting ideas. I'm not sure how many of them are actually feasible. I like the idea of daylighting Bassett Creek, restoration of St. Anthony Falls, and Great Northern Gardens.

The Peanut's gang is moving to Valleyfair.

[FamousBlueRaincoat]

Originally Posted by djconklin

>also better light rail. which hopefully will allow more places to live in and around downtown, on both sides of the river.
===
Light rail is the wrong way to go--you are locked into where you laid the tracks. It would better to run busses every 5 minutes or so.

Rail is generally a better way to move people as long if you do it right. For one thing, rail is more respected, meaning regular people are more likely to ride because buses are for "poor people." It doesn't make a lot of sense to me, since I ride the bus. More importantly, rail goes faster than the bus (and even cars, if done right), making public transportation an actual efficient and logical thing to depend on. But there are a ton more "respectable" people riding the Light Rail from downtown to the MOA than there are riding the Route 5 bus from Downtown to the MOA. Or any of the buses that run pretty much the same route a couple of blocks in any direction, like the 14 or 22.

The Twin Cities are developed enough that everybody knows where people are going, where they live, where they work, where they shop, and how they get there. Not much has changed since it was all laid out.

The Twin Cities bus system in the city is actually pretty much exactly the same as the street car lines were, if you compare a map of the streetcar lines of almost 100 years ago to the current Metro Transit map. The few street car lines that don't have corresponding buses, are just because those neighborhoods were knocked down, like Rondo. You can avoid that problem by not knocking down neighborhoods.

It's pretty much the same in any city - here in Philadelphia, where i live now, demographics and populations have shifted rapidly - yet the only changes in the Subway and El have been to *lengthen* the route in the same directions. Regional rail stops in the same towns. Some of the routes were shortened by people without foresight, and one of the main goals here is actually to lengthen the routes to how they were formerly. There are still about 6-8 street car lines that run as street cars, down the same commercial corridors they always have and where people still live. And although most of the system has changed to buses, a lot of the original tracks and power lines still exist and are visible, and they're planning on converting a whole slew of them back into streetcars.

Not that there aren't arguments against rail...I can think of a couple off the top of my head even though I'm a huge supporter of rail...that's just not one of them.

[K-Luv]

Originally Posted by djconklin

>also better light rail. which hopefully will allow more places to live in and around downtown, on both sides of the river.
===
Light rail is the wrong way to go--you are locked into where you laid the tracks. It would better to run busses every 5 minutes or so.

Lite Rail has its disadvantages, but one major advantage is that operating costs are generally cheaper over bus systems. Another main advantage (or disadvantage depending on view) is that they can also run on any source of generated electricity; i.e., nuclear, water turbine, wind turbine, coal, natural gas, oil, etc..

The Lite Rail line definitely needs to be expanded. Connecting DT MPLS with St. Paul is a must. A connecting line to Roseville would be good, too. Also, a line needs to be built from DT MPLS, through Uptown, and then to perhaps Southdale.

One thing that I think the MSP metro could really use is commuter rail. Having the Northstar line continue to St. Cloud is only a portion of it. There should be another line connecting MSP to Duluth, one going to Mankato, one going to Rochester, one going to Eau Claire, and one going to possibly Wynona and/or La Crosse.