Californians have ruined Montana (Great Falls, Bozeman: low income, sales, how much)

[BDahl]

Being born and raised in Montana, I have seen immense changes in the state us Montanans are proud to call our home. Growing up in Great Falls, things were easygoing; being near large farming areas, there was a general sense of respect among everybody you met. A sense of trust among the common stranger was normal. You could go into the store and leave your vehicle running without worry and you could leave your door unlocked while you were out of the house. The average Montanan was, and to this very day is, just out to make a living. Not to get as rich as you can and as quick as you can, like every Californian's dream.

Feeling the need for change, my family decided to move to Belgrade. Living there for only a year, we moved to our current location, Three Forks. We have lived in Three Forks for 9 years now. Nine years ago, Bozeman was not what it is today. Nine years ago, the basic fundamentals of Montana were kept strong. I can still remember the day when everybody would give a flip of the hand (wave) while driving as they met another person going the other way. Basic ideals like this have been lost. Today, the way to say hi is to snub everybody around you.

Driving to and from Bozeman has become a real pain in the butt recently, because people drive like madmen. Urbanites traveling to Montana, listen carefully. The Montanan way to drive on the interstate includes only one rule. When passing another person, DO NOT come within 3-4 car lengths either behind or in front of the person you are passing. Nobody is rushing you to get back in the right lane as soon as you can and nobody wants to risk getting in a wreck because you cut them off. This is Montana for heaven's sake! We don't even have a million people living here, around 930,000 to be close, that is not even a third of the population in L.A. itself! So don't drive like you are in L.A.!

Finally, what is really killing the true Montanans is the Californians that come to Montana because it (heavy sarcasm) "is sooooooo cheap." I am getting sick and tired of Californians saying that a $200,000-$250,000 is a deal that is too good to be true. Recently, when I was over at an older relative’s house, A Californian couple that was slightly related had 'come by' for a week to help take care of them. While talking to them one night, the issue of the prices of housing and land in the area had come up. My mother had mentioned that prices here are becoming so high that she feels that neither my brother, sister, nor I would have the chance to own a house someday. Mind you, we are not a low income family. She had also mentioned that a few years ago we were looking at a house that was in a pretty rural part of Montana but it turned out that we could not be able to afford it at the time. When the Californian relative asked how much it was at the time, my mom replied, "$150,000."

STOP! Now if your jaw is on the floor and you are saying, "THAT"S IT?!?!," you have passed the test for being a genuine Californian. For a Montanan, that is a lot of money.

I could have just slapped her right there for her response. I am so sick and tired of Californians thinking that Montana is so cheap. They are what are hurting the average Montanan citizen. They come here, buy houses with cash on the spot and resell them for twice, sometimes three times, as much right away so they can build their 'dream mansion' out in the middle of a Montana wilderness scene. Leaving them with all they ever wished for and us with an inability to live and succeed.

This is why I say that Californians have ruined Montana. Their own greed and the attitude that they are out to get every dollar they can get their grubby hands on is what is destroying us from the bottom up. I could go on about plenty more but I will let this digest with everybody that takes care to read this. Soon I will follow up on the changes i have seen in the Bozeman area.

I am 16 years old and I am a Senior in high school this year. My parents and I live in a single wide "manufactured home." I am perfectly content with where I live and I have no desire to be better than everybody else, Life is not about being better than your neighbor, it is about helping your neighbor; in turn life becomes better for the both of you.

[kabb36]

BDahl-

As a Californian, I completely understand what you are saying. We want to move to Montana precisely because of the way it is down here. People are not nice. Everyone's out to have bigger and better than the other guy. Appearances are everything. I hate it! And I've lived here all my life.

My husband and I do not own a home down here and do not have a pile of cash to buy a home up there. We will have to work in Montana just as we have to work down here. We would be perfectly happy with a manufactured home and a yard big enough for our dogs and to grow a garden.

As far as the way people drive, you are soooo right. I am so tired of having people ride my bumper because theyare in a hurry. It's hurry, hurry, hurry around here. I just want a slow pace where I can enjoy life.

So, please don't automatically dislike every Californian that you meet. I promise, some of us aren't so bad.

[connie]

Originally Posted by BDahl

Being born and raised in Montana, I have seen immense changes in the state us Montanans are proud to call our home. Growing up in Great Falls, things were easygoing; being near large farming areas, there was a general sense of respect among everybody you met. A sense of trust among the common stranger was normal. You could go into the store and leave your vehicle running without worry and you could leave your door unlocked while you were out of the house. The average Montanan was, and to this very day is, just out to make a living. Not to get as rich as you can and as quick as you can, like every Californian's dream.


Finally, what is really killing the true Montanans is the Californians that come to Montana because it (heavy sarcasm) "is sooooooo cheap." I am getting sick and tired of Californians saying that a $200,000-$250,000 is a deal that is too good to be true. Recently, when I was over at an older relative’s house, A Californian couple that was slightly related had 'come by' for a week to help take care of them. While talking to them one night, the issue of the prices of housing and land in the area had come up. My mother had mentioned that prices here are becoming so high that she feels that neither my brother, sister, nor I would have the chance to own a house someday. Mind you, we are not a low income family. She had also mentioned that a few years ago we were looking at a house that was in a pretty rural part of Montana but it turned out that we could not be able to afford it at the time. When the Californian relative asked how much it was at the time, my mom replied, "$150,000."

STOP! Now if your jaw is on the floor and you are saying, "THAT"S IT?!?!," you have passed the test for being a genuine Californian. For a Montanan, that is a lot of money.

I could have just slapped her right there for her response. I am so sick and tired of Californians thinking that Montana is so cheap. They are what are hurting the average Montanan citizen. They come here, buy houses with cash on the spot and resell them for twice, sometimes three times, as much right away so they can build their 'dream mansion' out in the middle of a Montana wilderness scene. Leaving them with all they ever wished for and us with an inability to live and succeed.

This is why I say that Californians have ruined Montana. Their own greed and the attitude that they are out to get every dollar they can get their grubby hands on is what is destroying us from the bottom up. I could go on about plenty more but I will let this digest with everybody that takes care to read this. Soon I will follow up on the changes i have seen in the Bozeman area.

I am 16 years old and I am a Senior in high school this year. My parents and I live in a single wide "manufactured home." I am perfectly content with where I live and I have no desire to be better than everybody else, Life is not about being better than your neighbor, it is about helping your neighbor; in turn life becomes better for the both of you.

I've never been on this thread because we are Californians moving to North Carolina, not Montana. But I saw it on the main board and read your post. Your points are well taken, and we will keep it in mind when we move. I felt bad when I read the part about "cheap" housing. We made a few comments about the prices when we visited North Carolina last year - we apologized to the realtor because we understood we had been a bit insensitive. We are from Fresno, and we understand how it feels to have people from the Bay Area or LA move to our town and be excited because it is so "cheap."

Just wanted to say that your post is well taken and we are Californians who will keep your points in mind.

[Marks]

Originally Posted by BDahl

This is why I say that Californians have ruined Montana.

BDahl,

Very good points! I can hear the frustration in your post. I’m very sorry this has happened to you, and as a Californian, I apologize to you, your family, and Montanans for this typical behavior and attitude.

My wife and I are very conservative Christians and we are looking to move out of communist California (don’t worry not to Montana) to the south. Not all Californians are like you described, I would hope you would understand that? Some of us consider ourselves “trapped” here for one reason or another.

We are not looking to get rich. We are not looking to build an empire. We are not looking to change a culture whether it be Montana or South Carolina. We simply desire to get out of an awful toilet state which we think is beyond reclaiming, start over, and live in peace the rest of our days. We too have had the folks from the Bay Area and LA come here (Sacramento) and say the things you mention. They come here from LA with a truck full of cash and have done nothing but drive up the prices, which makes homes here for the middle class unreachable.

Your post was a reminder, as I try and tell others on the Southern forums were looking at, to be respectful when moving into another state being mindful of the customs and “ways” they have. I feel when moving to a new home state one should attempt to assimilate into the society not ruin it. Thanks again.

Mark

[Lehi]

Originally Posted by BDahl

<a lot of snippage of a good rant>I am so sick and tired of Californians thinking that Montana is so cheap. They are what are hurting the average Montanan citizen. They come here, buy houses with cash on the spot and resell them for twice, sometimes three times, as much right away so they can build their 'dream mansion' out in the middle of a Montana wilderness scene. Leaving them with all they ever wished for and us with an inability to live and succeed.<more snippage>

Not that it'll make you feel any better but I feel your pain and it's not only happening in Montana.

[mountain_time_Blues]

Could interchange Montana with North Carolina. And Change Cali with a multitude of states. Alot of the arguments you raise about what is happening to Montana could easily be said about North Carolina. Rising house prices, lossing our cultre, coarsening of our values ect. ect. ... It seems some people are actually suspicious of you if you're nice to them.

They want to escape the higher taxes but demand all these social services that increase the taxes nulling the benifit of moving here. But for every rude, unpleasant, ego filled, loud, anyoning, tansplant there is 1 other person who really wants to move not just for the "cheaper" living and warmer climate but for the whole experince of moving to the south. They want to be North Carolinians not New Yorkers who happen to live in North Carolina.

Yup it get's frustrating watching your state morphe into something you don't recognize anymore.

[anonymous]

I'll agree with most of what's been said. I'm a South Carolinian, and it is very difficult to watch your home state change into something you can't stand.

BDahl, my advice is to not become bitter over it. From California to Montana, or from New York to South Carolina, it's often the same story. But, remember that you can't change it, so it is ultimately up to you to adapt to those changes.

[MoMark]

I am 16 years old and I am a Senior in high school this year. My parents and I live in a single wide "manufactured home." I am perfectly content with where I live and I have no desire to be better than everybody else, Life is not about being better than your neighbor, it is about helping your neighbor; in turn life becomes better for the both of you.[/quote]

Well, if your writing is an example of the Montana school system, I'm very impressed. That may explain why many want to move to Montana as well and have their kids gain the same efficient writing skills as you exhibit. I know you're sixteen, and it may seem that you're being invaded, but it's hard for me to imagine you at the age of 7 being so aware of running cars left in parking lots or the correct number of car lengths to use when passing a car on a Montana roadway in the idyllic Montana you refer to nine years ago. And I know this isn't going to ring well with you, but $150,000 for a house is considered cheap in 90% of America. I'm a native Californian myself who moved to Missouri after selling out. I paid cash for my home on acreage in southwest Missouri. I am very thankful that prices here were so low in comparison to California and elsewhere and I took advantage of the high sales prices in CA and the low prices in MO, just like the other Californians (and probably ex-Seattlites) are doing in Montana. I openly marveled at how "cheap" everything was too...without regard to how that might sound to people here. The shock between the two realities is truly massive, but your point is well taken and we should be more considerate and conscientious of the disparity to avoid inadvertently offending the "natives". I am guilty of it. People here still wave to you when you drive past them. That isn't normal to me and I have to remind myself to do it to be polite and remember to look and wave too. However, don't be too quick to harshly condemn those ex-Californians. They're doing what you would do too if you were in their position with the same desires and wants for a better life for your family. It also takes time to acclimate to a friendlier and more relaxed environment and disgard one's defenses learned automatically in California. I promise you it's not intentional rudeness. I can tell you again, anyone in California thinking about moving to Montana who reads your post will probably be even more attracted to the state having seen the quality of your writing, which reflects on a good educational system. Don't be bitter this young, just do as well as you can in school and make your own impact when you're able.

[elfyum]

I too was thinking "16???!!!" That sounds like a post from someone much older & wiser. It is definately well written & well taken! Are you still out there BDahl?

[BDahl]

Yes I am still here... just reading your replies...

Originally Posted by MoMark

Don't be bitter this young, just do as well as you can in school and make your own impact when you're able.

Originally Posted by anonymous

BDahl, my advice is to not become bitter over it.

I am not becomming bitter over this whole thing. In comparison, look at the Coral Reefs. People are not becoming bitter from the dying and polluted reefs as much as they are grieving over the slow, steady loss of them. The reefs are dying right in front of their eyes and they can not do anything about the problem. The cause of their problem? The carelessness of other people, all for the sake of their pleasure.

Just a quick thought. Well I have a busy Saturday lined up for me so I will reply more later tonight. TTFN!