Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Hi,
We're planning on building a home in Nashville and was wondering if we should install a heat pump or gas pack for heating and cooling. The home will be a two story house with around 3100sqf of living space. The home will have a running gas line for the gas fireplace and gas water heater. The builder recommends using a gas pack, but from what I have researched, it seems the heat pump would be cheaper to run in this area. Am I correct about this? What do you guys recommend? Since I already will have to activate the gas line and be charged the service fee, would it make sense to just go with the gas pack? Or would I save more money with the heat pump? I currently have a heat pump in my current home and understand that sometimes during cold weather it has a hard time keeping the house warm and I am ok with this because we can always put on more clothes or light up the gas fireplace for a little while. Also, with the new increase in electric rates from TVA, would a heat pump still be cheaper? I would ultimately want to go with a duel fuel system (hybrid system), but the quote I received is too pricey.
Thank you everyone,
Pete
I stayed with a friend in Austin TX many times during the winters a couple of decades ago. Most winter nights her heat pump would perform OK but a couple of times I was there when the temp got down to 20 or the teens, that system ran continuously and the house was cold. Wasn't very pleasant getting up in the morning. Austin maybe has a 10 degree warmer winter climate than Nashville. What you might do is put a couple of gas wall units in if you're going to go with a heat pump.
If you had asked this question twenty years ago I would have said definitely go with the gaspack. However, natural gas prices have risen so much in the past few years that it doesn't quite make as much sense economically as it once did. It used to be that the extra cost of a gaspack would pay for itself in a few years; I'm not sure whether that's true any more.
A gaspack is basically just a heat pump and a small gas furnace combined in an outdoor unit. The heat pump part will provide the cooling, while heating will be provided by the gas furnace part of the unit. I'm not sure whether the heat pump is ever used to provide part of the heat when the temperatures are mild, or whether all heating is provide by gas (I'd have to do some research). If you use just a heat pump the auxiliary heating elements will kick in when the temperatures get down into the twenties or below. Those heating elements are not particularly efficient.
Here's my suggestions:
1. Talk to the mechanical subcontractor rather than just the builder. The mechanical guy can provide you with more information about cost to install and the cost to run using typical Nashville weather conditions. You may be looking at a "pay back" of your initial additional cost in five years, or ten years, or never. I'm just not sure because I haven't looking at the figures using current gas prices.
2. Ask yourself if you would just like the warmer air that a gas unit provides. A proper heat pump unit is capable of providing enough heat to keep the house completely comfortable in all but the most extreme weather. I use a heat pump alone and there's no problem keeping it comfortable for me in winter (the unit does had to work hard when it gets down into the teens or below; which, thankfully, isn't all that often). However, some people still prefer gas because the air coming directly out of the registers is warmer, and therefore the house just feels warmer. If you or other members of the household tend to be "cold blooded" you might want to lean a little towards getting the gas pack.
Again, I think your best bet would be to talk to a knowledgeable and honest mechanical contractor. You want one who will explain the pros and cons of both system without trying to sell you the gaspack just because it's more expensive.
Good luck with it. Let us know what you decide and why. It might help the next person who comes along and asks a similar question.
It's a personal choice. I chose electric and I'll offer my own un-scientific reasons for my personal decision:
My new house (completed in December 2007) is in a subdivision where all the houses have gas heat, but I had to be the "different" one by insisting on 100% electric (a/c-heat pump, water heater, clothes dryer, stove/oven). I do have a gas fireplace, but it's not on an active gas connection. At $15/month just to be connected to gas (even if I never turn it on), I told the gas company it was too outrageous to consider. It feels a little bit better to only be paying an electric bill each month and not an electric and a gas bill.
Why did I choose an electric heat pump? For starters, in my area the electric company offered cash incentives to builders that went with energy efficient electric heat pump systems. Also, the newer systems are remarkably more efficient in their energy use. This past winter was colder than average for me and the house was often too warm and we were lowering the settings.
My other reason for choosing electric is because I had gas in my previous home. It was an aging system and that's where cost really came into play. Gas systems seem to have a lot more wear and tear parts that are costly to replace if you are not the one doing the replacements. Ignitors wear out rapidly. Gas scares me, so I'm the last one that will attempt to replace an ignitor. But there were other parts the gas system had that were costly to replace, too. Sure, electric systems have their costs associated with them, but they are not running on combustion which is just going to be a lot harder on the parts than electricity.
Finally, I considered the long term prospects of gas and electric in terms of availability. Gas availability is a big unknown to me, but electric can be generated in a variety of different ways: coal, nuclear, solar, wind, hydroelectric and perhaps more ideas are being developed as well. So many gas systems are also running electricity, that in a power failure often a gas system is disabled as well. Frankly I just don't like gas much, but like I said, it's a personal choice.
I know someone with a house about as large as the one you're building and they have a two-zone a/c with electric heat pump system (replacement system was installed last year). They've been quite happy with their electric bills. Of course, we're all about to be hit with a 20% rate increase for electricity. I don't know what natural gas prices will be like this winter. Perhaps someone else can offer their advice and knowledge on that one.
It's a personal choice. I chose electric and I'll offer my own un-scientific reasons for my personal decision:
My new house (completed in December 2007) is in a subdivision where all the houses have gas heat, but I had to be the "different" one by insisting on 100% electric (a/c-heat pump, water heater, clothes dryer, stove/oven). I do have a gas fireplace, but it's not on an active gas connection. At $15/month just to be connected to gas (even if I never turn it on), I told the gas company it was too outrageous to consider. It feels a little bit better to only be paying an electric bill each month and not an electric and a gas bill.
Why did I choose an electric heat pump? For starters, in my area the electric company offered cash incentives to builders that went with energy efficient electric heat pump systems. Also, the newer systems are remarkably more efficient in their energy use. This past winter was colder than average for me and the house was often too warm and we were lowering the settings.
My other reason for choosing electric is because I had gas in my previous home. It was an aging system and that's where cost really came into play. Gas systems seem to have a lot more wear and tear parts that are costly to replace if you are not the one doing the replacements. Ignitors wear out rapidly. Gas scares me, so I'm the last one that will attempt to replace an ignitor. But there were other parts the gas system had that were costly to replace, too. Sure, electric systems have their costs associated with them, but they are not running on combustion which is just going to be a lot harder on the parts than electricity.
Finally, I considered the long term prospects of gas and electric in terms of availability. Gas availability is a big unknown to me, but electric can be generated in a variety of different ways: coal, nuclear, solar, wind, hydroelectric and perhaps more ideas are being developed as well. So many gas systems are also running electricity, that in a power failure often a gas system is disabled as well. Frankly I just don't like gas much, but like I said, it's a personal choice.
I know someone with a house about as large as the one you're building and they have a two-zone a/c with electric heat pump system (replacement system was installed last year). They've been quite happy with their electric bills. Of course, we're all about to be hit with a 20% rate increase for electricity. I don't know what natural gas prices will be like this winter. Perhaps someone else can offer their advice and knowledge on that one.
MiddleTNResident,
I'm not a big fan of gas either. I don't like the fact I have to pay the gas company $10-$15 each month just to have my gas activated. Plus I like having one less bill. Unfortunately, I can't convert everything from gas to electric because everyone in the subdivision is required to have a gas lamp. I'm in a tricky situation. I will still have to pay to have my gas activated because of the gas lamp, so that makes me think if I would be better off with the gas pack. BTW, many people have told me gas packs are very efficient. Is this true, or are they blowing smoke in my face?
Thanks!
Just saw on the news that oil is expected to increase 36% over last year and Natural gas is expected to increase 24%. Electric could be the best alternative. Electricity here is relatively cheap compared to other parts of the country, even with TVA's proposed 20% increase.
I just read an article from a local paper (written this week) stating that natural gas prices are up by 65%. Meanwhile NES, which I assume will be your electric provider, is increasing rates by 15% as of Oct. 1. That's a bit better than the 20% increase TVA is charging to our electric companies. At least they didn't pass the full 20% on to the home user. Businesses could take a bigger hit which worries me as to how our employers will be impacted, and our jobs.
My electric provider is CEMC and they are raising my rates by 14% as of October 1.
Of course the situation could change from year to year as to which energy source is going to be the better one in price. I'm personally thinking that electric will be more reasonablea as long as the companies are able to use multiple means of generating it.
First of all, I hope you are planning on two systems. A 2 story house really does not do that well with only one system.
2nd, a gas pak is usually used on a crawlspace house because it is one package (heat and a/c in one box) and the return and supply ducts have to run to the unit.
Sometimes gas pak system ducts create a ventilation problem in crawlspaces, so that is a design issue that should be dealt with. It the space is not high enough, the ducts block the cross ventilation in the crawlspace.
If I was building a house today, I would install a heat pump with gas back up heat. You have the lower cost of electric heat when the temps are moderate, and the benefit of gas heat when you really need it. When a heat pump is using the aux. or emergency heat, gas is probably cheaper than electric. Those heat strips will make your meter spin like crazy - AND the heat is still not as warm as gas heat (temps coming out of registers).
Heat pumps work very well down to 32 degrees. Once the temps go below 32, they loose efficiency. When the temps go below zero, they are pretty much worthless, you might as well crank up the oven and turn on a fan.
I know in Knoxville, heat pumps work really well, we get very few days below 32, and even less below zero. I don't know about Nashville, but my guess it's not that much different.
I have both types of heating in my house by the way.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
