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This is a big debate and as was stated above it really depends child by child. There is no perfect solution. Some children actually regress when put in this situation. Kids need to be challenged and sometimes( not saying with all kids but sometimes) being the oldest kid in class can be detrimental to their performance both academically and emotionally. There are tons of studies out there supporting both positions, just google it.
Well, I have one of those kids who is top in his class. Public schools are disappointing academically no matter what (have experience with one child summer birthday "held back" and one Nov Birthday). And I've read plenty about it. Also, ask any teacher, they will say the older kids in the grade do better (and that is what the more recent studies are showing).
We can debate what to do with summer birthdays (still glad I held back my super smart summer birthday kid, because socially it has been the right thing)...but the situation in this thread is a NOVEMBER birthday. The cutoff in NJ is Oct 1 in virtually all districts. The November birthday should be with the class he/she is supposed to be in, otherwise he/she will be more than a year younger than some kids in the grade which is likely not the right place for her, socially.
IMO, just figure out what to do next year and then send her with the right class, and be happy she is more mature. It will come in very handy later when the girls get mean and the academics get harder.
Right. Girls can be mean...do you really know what goes on in schools these days? A more mature girl is much more likely to be socially and emotionally equipped to handle it.
A November birthday puts the child in the best possible position within the class. No judgments about "holding back" like those with summer birthdays, mature for the grade, academically on top. The top private schools actually won't take them younger...so if you ever think you'd want a top private school...know that they won't like it that she is young for the grade.
Also, do you really want to send a 17yo to college?!
Remember, this is a 16-year decision, not a 1-year decision. And there are plenty of Kindergarten enrichment programs if you want more challenge and/or a full schedule next year.
I wish I could find the article. It was actually pretty harsh about the reality of K being the new 1st grade and parents be SURE they are prepared, and she recommended all summer birthdays (June-Sept) be held back. Not for a "competitive edge" but for the reality of today's classrooms with inclusion classes (meaning most attention is on special ed kids or those at risk of not being proficient on standardized tests), crowded classrooms, higher levels of academics, competition, and social skills necessary to do well in school.
The article was in some sort of NJ Parenting magazine and it was written by the Director at Gil St. Bernards school.
This is a big debate and as was stated above it really depends child by child. There is no perfect solution. Some children actually regress when put in this situation. Kids need to be challenged and sometimes( not saying with all kids but sometimes) being the oldest kid in class can be detrimental to their performance both academically and emotionally. There are tons of studies out there supporting both positions, just google it.
I agree that it depends on the child some kids are more mature then others, however she's still going to be the youngest in the class so even if she's the most mature 5 year old you've ever met it doesn't mean that she's not going to wind up in a class with some of the most mature 6 year olds you've ever met.
Then there's the practice of red shirtting to consider where some people purposely sign their children up for kindergarten a year late so some of these kids may already be 7 years old at the beginning of the year.
Kindergarten is a very interesting year because there's kids that are coming in at all different levels some kids come in having gone to in-depth pre-school programs and already know how to read, write, add and subtract, other kids may have been baby sat by someone who cared for them but didn't really expose to them to any educational materials beyond a box of crayons. Kindergarten teachers know this and expect this each September and do a great job of balancing everyone out with out boring the kids who've been exposed to more material.
It seems like such a hassle to jump through so many hoops; moving to far off towns and begging school boards to ignore the cut off just to get your kid into first grade a year ahead of their peers. If your child is truly so smart that the material is beneath them just wait a couple of months and the teacher may suggest the child be skipped. However, the more likely scenario is that the kid starts kindergarten is familiar with the material does well and gains confidence, begins to view herself as a good student which encourages her to continue to do well. She will adjust well socially because the kids in her class are closer to her age, there will be some that are more mature than others but for the most part everyone is on equal footing.
I agree that it depends on the child some kids are more mature then others, however she's still going to be the youngest in the class so even if she's the most mature 5 year old you've ever met it doesn't mean that she's not going to wind up in a class with some of the most mature 6 year olds you've ever met.
Then there's the practice of red shirtting to consider where some people purposely sign their children up for kindergarten a year late so some of these kids may already be 7 years old at the beginning of the year.
Kindergarten is a very interesting year because there's kids that are coming in at all different levels some kids come in having gone to in-depth pre-school programs and already know how to read, write, add and subtract, other kids may have been baby sat by someone who cared for them but didn't really expose to them to any educational materials beyond a box of crayons. Kindergarten teachers know this and expect this each September and do a great job of balancing everyone out with out boring the kids who've been exposed to more material.
It seems like such a hassle to jump through so many hoops; moving to far off towns and begging school boards to ignore the cut off just to get your kid into first grade a year ahead of their peers. If your child is truly so smart that the material is beneath them just wait a couple of months and the teacher may suggest the child be skipped. However, the more likely scenario is that the kid starts kindergarten is familiar with the material does well and gains confidence, begins to view herself as a good student which encourages her to continue to do well. She will adjust well socially because the kids in her class are closer to her age, there will be some that are more mature than others but for the most part everyone is on equal footing.
Yeh, check out the link I posted above. There are pluses and minuses.
It seems we are all getting a little off topic. The OP was asking for school systems with a cut off date of Nov 15th or later and it seems they need to be in a reasonable driving distance to Wayne. We are hardly helping them in their search with this debate.
I hate to break it to you but you are probably going to hear big fat "NO's" from the public schools with a birthday that late. My SIL is in West Windsor and missed the cut off by a couple of HOURS and no amount of begging and pleading worked, even though my nephew was definitely ready, she ended up having to shell out for another year of pre-school/daycare.
You can try a private school, they are usually more flexible with the cut off dates. Doesn't have to be anything fancy an inexpensive catholic school will do then once second grade comes you can move her into public.
But I'm a little confused you said she was in "junior kindergarten" is that like pre-k? And you are trying to get her into 1st grade? Can you just clarify how old she will be this coming November, what grade she was in and what you would like to see her start in Sept?
I missed it by 26 hours and was VERY ready for kindy and no go!
This is what I was told. My children made the cut off date, so I personally have not experienced this. It should be interesting to see what happens in Nov.
my friend put her DD in private school for K (november b'day), tried to have her tested to enter the public school for 1st grade, and they wouldn't budge. she ended up entering the public schools for 2nd grade. and despite all the gloom and doom about being the youngest, she's a socially well adjusted 7th grader with straight A's.
people, it's really easy. you know your child. if you think they are ready, they're ready. if they're not, they're not. if you push them ahead and if turns out maybe that wasn't a great idea, hold them back. or you can be like my other friend with a child with a Nov b'day - she held her back because everyone said "OHHH NOES, you don't want her being the youngest!!!!!". 2 years of that nonsense and she pushed her ahead and is thriving.
please, you don't need "studies" and scare tactics.
people, it's really easy. you know your child. if you think they are ready, they're ready. if they're not, they're not. if you push them ahead and if turns out maybe that wasn't a great idea, hold them back. or you can be like my other friend with a child with a Nov b'day - she held her back because everyone said "OHHH NOES, you don't want her being the youngest!!!!!". 2 years of that nonsense and she pushed her ahead and is thriving.
please, you don't need "studies" and scare tactics.
You may know your child but if it's a first child, you don't know the public school system. FYI, it is often *not* in the parents' control whether to retain or skip the child ahead after they are enrolled in public school. The school holds this power, and it will not be your decision. Also, different districts handle things differently. My district almost never retains children but the neighboring district does it all the time in the younger grades. But again, it is the school administrators' decision. You can appeal it but it will mean bureaucratic delays, relying on their biased testing, or paying $$$ for your own testing for them to just blow it off, and/or if you do succeed, less support for your child when they take a "told you so" mentality. This is a reality check, not a scare tactic.
Also, you don't know the other children and this is not school of the 70s or 80s when kids were innocent. There is a lot going on in the social environment of school for kids these days - just read about cyberbullying, Queen Bees and Wannabees, etc. It's not about 1st grade readiness (it is very easy for bright kids to learn to read in kindergarten or add/subtract - many of the kids know this)... it's about the social environment and the entire K-12 years and how they fit in.
You may know your child but if it's a first child, you don't know the public school system. FYI, it is often *not* in the parents' control whether to retain or skip the child ahead after they are enrolled in public school. The school holds this power, and it will not be your decision. Also, different districts handle things differently. My district almost never retains children but the neighboring district does it all the time in the younger grades. But again, it is the school administrators' decision. You can appeal it but it will mean bureaucratic delays, relying on their biased testing, or paying $$$ for your own testing for them to just blow it off, and/or if you do succeed, less support for your child when they take a "told you so" mentality. This is a reality check, not a scare tactic.
Also, you don't know the other children and this is not school of the 70s or 80s when kids were innocent. There is a lot going on in the social environment of school for kids these days - just read about cyberbullying, Queen Bees and Wannabees, etc. It's not about 1st grade readiness (it is very easy for bright kids to learn to read in kindergarten or add/subtract - many of the kids know this)... it's about the social environment and the entire K-12 years and how they fit in.
what do you mean it's not your choice to retain? skip ahead I understand, but i've never heard that you can't retain your child.
sheesh. sometimes i wonder if i should've held my kids back - may birthdays. not because they weren't ready emotionally or academically, but just to make them the "oldest" - which btw right now they WOULD not be because there are people holding back march and april kids. it's absolute insanity.
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