Watch for Kangaroos on the Greenway (Reston, Leesburg: coupon, how much, houses)

[VRE332]

Australian Company Buys Up Dulles Greenway - Reston, VA Patch

[NC211]

All the more reason for tax payers to insist that VDOT streamline Rt. 7 better, and get busy connecting up certain roads in the area that clearly are not linked to influence usage of the Greenway. Namely to Old Ox Road from the Brambleton area.


There is a clause in the ability to raise tolls that, if they get to the point where they're harmful to the economic health of the community, then they must be lowered....aka....if home buying slows or home prices need to compress. So, looks like the "Green" Way will be costing more greenbacks to use...again (and again).


The financing structure of the road is a reverse coupon setup. The original financing to get it built defaulted almost immediately. Basically, if you borrowed $100m for 30 years, you'd expect your outstanding balance in the 30th year to be $0. But, with their crazy structure, in year 30, your outstanding balance is more than the original amount you borrowed. This means that more and more of the income the road generates, the more has to go to paying the debt, and less to investors and even less to maintenance and upkeep.


The whole thing was a political scam to begin with. They just pushed out the time frame for when VA takes it over for like another 50 years or so (reverse coupon influence). I'm willing to bet that if someone dug deep enough into the workings of this arrangement, they'd find some pretty questionable legal/political evidence.

[VRE332]

https://www.google.com/finance?cid=12554815

[FCNova]

I really don't get the whining. I mean I get it, people want to have their cake(move way out where homes are cheaper) and eat it too(not have to pay the piper when it comes to commuting from there). But I don't get why people don't recognize how silly they sound. Harmful to economic health of the community? I hope that's a joke. There are plenty of other roads people can take if they don't want to use the Greenway. I don't hear people who commute over one of the bridges in VA/MD/DC that bottleneck badly declaring it's harmful to our economic health not having more options. Why are people out in Ashburn special snowflakes?

[spencgr]

Originally Posted by FCNova

I really don't get the whining. I mean I get it, people want to have their cake(move way out where homes are cheaper) and eat it too(not have to pay the piper when it comes to commuting from there). But I don't get why people don't recognize how silly they sound. Harmful to economic health of the community? I hope that's a joke. There are plenty of other roads people can take if they don't want to use the Greenway. I don't hear people who commute over one of the bridges in VA/MD/DC that bottleneck badly declaring it's harmful to our economic health not having more options. Why are people out in Ashburn special snowflakes?

I live in Western Loudoun and take the Greenway daily. I don't complain about the cost and expect it to go up over time. I am fine with paying the amount to have fast, free-flowing traffic for a period of my commute. The cost will always be the right amount to keep the right amount of vehicles on the road to keep it free-flowing.


I'd be super pissed if they dropped the price, thus increasing the traffic.

[NC211]

Originally Posted by FCNova

I really don't get the whining. I mean I get it, people want to have their cake(move way out where homes are cheaper) and eat it too(not have to pay the piper when it comes to commuting from there). But I don't get why people don't recognize how silly they sound. Harmful to economic health of the community? I hope that's a joke. There are plenty of other roads people can take if they don't want to use the Greenway. I don't hear people who commute over one of the bridges in VA/MD/DC that bottleneck badly declaring it's harmful to our economic health not having more options. Why are people out in Ashburn special snowflakes?

People paying $6+ to cross that bridge, each way?


No, there are not "plenty of other roads" people can take. It's Rt. 7. It's 28. And it's a small handful of side roads that connect to 28, all jammed up during rush hour. Don't make it sound like it's just a locational inconvenience to folks to avoid the greenway.


I use the greenway too, twice everyday. I spend thousands on tolls for the convenience, and I really couldn't care less about it.


But, I use the entire greenway. I used to use just the last couple of miles of it before moving to Leesburg....and yet paid the same $6 each time. That, is BS.


No, it's not a joke. It is written in the toll raising policy as one of the 3 checks & balances each time they seek approval to raise the rate. They have to prove that what they're wanting to raise it too, isn't beyond the economic grasp of those who actually would/could use it on a daily basis. Clearly the owners are aware of it, as they mention the housing and income increases for the area in that article.


Nobody is whining about the commute. I wouldn't live in this congested mess of a town, period. I love suburban living and fully aware and fully comfortable with my commute, have been for over 5 years now and counting. I'm just saying, the whole setup of the greenway smells like crap.


What I suspect we'll see, is finally some proper distance-based fees, instead of one fee for all. But, do I think $6 will be from Leesburg to Dulles? Nope. I suspect $6 will be from where the last metro station will be in Broadlands and go up from there the further west you go.


I can afford it, no problem. And I completely agree that it's nice to have that luxury and not have to deal with the traffic nightmare that is Rt. 7. Raise it to $20, I don't give a hoot.


But, I also acknowledge that I am not the "norm" for the area who the greenway impacts, snowflake.

[elias9193]

They should get rid of the toll plaza its a big waste of time and money convert the greenway to EZ- pass and charge based on the mileage you use, just like on the Beltway and I 95. That would suit me just fine.

[FCNova]

Originally Posted by NC211

People paying $6+ to cross that bridge, each way?


No, there are not "plenty of other roads" people can take. It's Rt. 7. It's 28. And it's a small handful of side roads that connect to 28, all jammed up during rush hour. Don't make it sound like it's just a locational inconvenience to folks to avoid the greenway.

Nobody HAS to pay $6 each way in Ashburn. JC the sense of entitlement. I'm sure if there were options to do that to get across the various bridges faster yes people would pay it though. People actually do pay $6+ each way on the 495 express lanes sometimes to bypass 495 traffic.

And yes the multiple routes out of Ashburn is plenty of other roads. You can take 7 east, you can use Waxpool to cut through to 28, you could go down to route 50 if you're on the southern end of Ashburn. Old Ox is being widened so that will be a decent cut-through to 28 or 267 as well. You just don't like these routes because they back up with traffic. I wonder why?? Oh yeah they're free. If you move to Ashburn you're either paying with time on busy roads or money on the tollroads. Everyone has that information before they buy in Ashburn/Aldie/South Riding/etc.

I quickly crossed Ashburn off my list and paid a premium for a small old house in Vienna because the road infrastructure is lacking, and getting worse by the year. If people want to complain about VDOT not keeping up that's a fair complaint, although I don't really know if it's their fault or the people that continue to buy houses and encourage the developers to throw them up as fast as possible. Complaining that the Greenway is a hardship and they should be forced to lower their prices is a joke.

[NC211]

Originally Posted by FCNova

Nobody HAS to pay $6 each way in Ashburn. JC the sense of entitlement. I'm sure if there were options to do that to get across the various bridges faster yes people would pay it though. People actually do pay $6+ each way on the 495 express lanes sometimes to bypass 495 traffic.

And yes the multiple routes out of Ashburn is plenty of other roads. You can take 7 east, you can use Waxpool to cut through to 28, you could go down to route 50 if you're on the southern end of Ashburn. You just don't like them because they back up with traffic. I wonder why?? Oh yeah they're free. If you move to Ashburn you're either paying with time on busy roads or money on the tollroads. Everyone has that information before they buy in Ashburn/Aldie/South Riding/etc.

I quickly crossed Ashburn off my list and paid a premium for a small old house in Vienna because the road infrastructure is lacking, and getting worse by the year. If people want to complain about VDOT not keeping up that's a fair complaint, although I don't really know if it's their fault or the people that continue to buy houses and encourage the developers to throw them up as fast as possible. Complaining that the Greenway is a hardship and they should be forced to lower their prices is a joke.

I'm not going down this rabbit hole. Been there and done that one too many times. Whatever you say, amigo.

[FCNova]

Originally Posted by NC211

I can afford it, no problem. And I completely agree that it's nice to have that luxury and not have to deal with the traffic nightmare that is Rt. 7. Raise it to $20, I don't give a hoot.


But, I also acknowledge that I am not the "norm" for the area who the greenway impacts, snowflake.

I'm trying to understand this statement. Are you trying to tell me that people move out to Ashburn and then can't afford the Greenway, but for some reason shouldn't have to suck it up and deal with the traffic nightmares, because...

How much hand holding do these snowflakes need?