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Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redguard57
That article was based on a 2.5 hour experiment. I doubt that pace could be maintained.
A similar story in Seattle during the summer tourist season showed panhandlers around the Pike Place Market clearing $200/day tax free. That would be close to $70k/year, if it were sustainable, but in the off season that will go way down with only the locals who largely ignore them to beg from.
Say you dropped out of 11th grade, are 25 years old, and have one set of clothes with holes, no place to shower or sleep, horrible credit, no job, no car, and are malnourished and weak but still able to do light everyday tasks such as getting dressed. You will be given $25.00 in cash at sunrise on Day 1. Explain, step-by-step, how a person in this situation is supposed to "bootstrap" their way into the middle class, and give an estimate of how long you think the process will take.
Are you assuming that the person has no family, friends or church family too?
If so, that would also probably mean they have some sort of personality challenges or substance abuse issues that have driven away all their personal support systems.
Your scenario sounds more similar to the immigrant that comes over the border and stands at Home Depot or U-Haul looking for day labor work, saving the cash, sharing rooms with other day laborers or family, then building enough savings to get a vehicle and their own place. I've seen that happen several times.
Politics aside, legal or not, a person who makes the effort to move to another country will make the effort to earn a living.
Are you assuming that the person has no family, friends or church family too?
If so, that would also probably mean they have some sort of personality challenges or substance abuse issues that have driven away all their personal support systems.
Your scenario sounds more similar to the immigrant that comes over the border and stands at Home Depot or U-Haul looking for day labor work, saving the cash, sharing rooms with other day laborers or family, then building enough savings to get a vehicle and their own place. I've seen that happen several times.
Politics aside, legal or not, a person who makes the effort to move to another country will make the effort to earn a living.
A number of things can result in social isolation - death of a family member, relocation, or social deficits such as Autism.
You have him using public assistance at least twice - the homeless shelter and the food stamps. If you look back, my comment was in response to a poster arguing for total abolition of all public assistance. The remark I made is to be understood as asking how one would do it without any welfare, food stamps, shelters, etc.
Let me answer your question. I did infact mention getting rid of public assistance. I said nothing of private assistance or assistance from churches, or many other organizations that help those in need. In my area we have a program for people that are drug addicted, homeless, or in other dire situations. The local churches take turns feeding these people. The Rescue Mission takes them in, they are given counseling, removed from the streets, placed in a dormitory and taught how to take care for themselves. The program takes about a year. To support themselves they have two area thrift stores where they can work. Many people donate cars that are then fixed up by the people living at this shelter. They learn skills from detailing the cars to servicing them to repairing them. They also learn how to sell the cars. In the area they also have homes for women with children. They have a year to live in the home and during that year they are taught how to get a job, they are given clothes from the thrift store so that they can be presentable. Their kids are helped out in school. Many people donate to this program. Over the years many people have graduated from the program and went on to have a great life.
In my own Church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we have programs that help people all over the world. First is the Fast Offering program where members fast for two meals on fast Sunday and donate the money that they would have spent on those meals to the Church. That money is first used locally within the congragation that the money came from. Money that is not used is spent over a wider area untill what is left is donated to areas that have little. We also have an amazing welfare program of our own where people are helped out. Instead of giving for free though they are allowed to help out for the things that they are given. These people are given opportunities to serve in the community to give back and in turn are given the feeling that they gave back.
Private donations and private assistance is so much better for the entire Nation, for the world for that matter. It is so much better to take someone and teach them how to take care of themselves than to just give them assistance. The Governments program is designed to keep people from bettering themselves. It is designed to keep people down. It does not help build people up. The money would be better spent by giving it to groups like our local Rescue Mission and other Churches. These places have a better track record at helping people move up and into better situations. I am not saying that they will become rich by going thru the program. I am not even saying that they will make it into the middle class. I have seen many though that have picked themselves up and are supporting themselves now without the help of the Government.
Let me answer your question. I did infact mention getting rid of public assistance. I said nothing of private assistance or assistance from churches, or many other organizations that help those in need. In my area we have a program for people that are drug addicted, homeless, or in other dire situations. The local churches take turns feeding these people. The Rescue Mission takes them in, they are given counseling, removed from the streets, placed in a dormitory and taught how to take care for themselves. The program takes about a year. To support themselves they have two area thrift stores where they can work. Many people donate cars that are then fixed up by the people living at this shelter. They learn skills from detailing the cars to servicing them to repairing them. They also learn how to sell the cars. In the area they also have homes for women with children. They have a year to live in the home and during that year they are taught how to get a job, they are given clothes from the thrift store so that they can be presentable. Their kids are helped out in school. Many people donate to this program. Over the years many people have graduated from the program and went on to have a great life.
In my own Church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we have programs that help people all over the world. First is the Fast Offering program where members fast for two meals on fast Sunday and donate the money that they would have spent on those meals to the Church. That money is first used locally within the congragation that the money came from. Money that is not used is spent over a wider area untill what is left is donated to areas that have little. We also have an amazing welfare program of our own where people are helped out. Instead of giving for free though they are allowed to help out for the things that they are given. These people are given opportunities to serve in the community to give back and in turn are given the feeling that they gave back.
Private donations and private assistance is so much better for the entire Nation, for the world for that matter. It is so much better to take someone and teach them how to take care of themselves than to just give them assistance. The Governments program is designed to keep people from bettering themselves. It is designed to keep people down. It does not help build people up. The money would be better spent by giving it to groups like our local Rescue Mission and other Churches. These places have a better track record at helping people move up and into better situations. I am not saying that they will become rich by going thru the program. I am not even saying that they will make it into the middle class. I have seen many though that have picked themselves up and are supporting themselves now without the help of the Government.
Ok, but then the question is this: If public assistance were to be abolished, how would the churches, charities, and other relevant non-profits manage the exploding demand for the assistance? Do they even have the capacity to take on 100% of what is currently done by public assistance, IN ADDITION to what they already do to help the needy?
I think a much better idea is to reform the welfare system to remove the perverse anti-work incentives, by (1) Doing away with "cliffs" - so that you never end up worse off by earning more, (2) Allow all work-related expenses to be deducted from income used to qualify, e.g. work clothes, commuting, and daycare; and (3) Move the wait list position of someone who landed a job back gradually, rather than suddenly, so that they will not be worse off if they work for 3 months and then lose the job, than they would have been had they not gotten the job in the first place. Section 8 housing has wait lists that are very long in some areas. If someone gets a job, they should be kept in the front of the waitlist for the first 6 months, and then moved back so that they are behind 15% of the list, and then after another 6 months, move them back to being behind 30% of the list, and so on. This way, no one would be scared away from working due to the fact that they would lose the benefit and be unable to get it back if the job headed south.
ETA: If it turns out that this proposal is not revenue-neutral before employment effects, benefits could be cut slightly or wait lists grown a bit longer overall. the point is to make it distributed in such as way as to encourage work, which as you rightfully point out, the current system fails at quite miserably due to the cliff effect, etc.
You are being scammed by your insurance company. Shop around for a better quote. $25 a month for registration isn't going to break your budget.
The budget I posted included an amortized purchase cost, which is the same as a replacement cost. Buy a $12,000 vehicle and drive it for 10 years. Your purchase cost is $100/month, if you have enough discipline to put that $100 in a car fund and not spend it. If you finance it, your purchase cost will be more like $300/month, because you will have to carry collision insurance and pay interest.
No, sir. That's what it costs to insure a vehicle around here. I live in the northeast, btw.
Increasing pay also increases inflation. It does nothing to increase the standard of living long term. If Walmart employees want more money than they can do the same thing that all of us did that make more money. Create value for the employer. Many do this by increasing their skill set or knowledge level. They learn a trade, or get an education in a specific field. I know a guy that was a janitor. He came here from another country. Somewhere along the way someone gave him a computer for his kids, I think he told me. The computer had a copy of MS Office. He spent time learning how to use Word, then he picked up Power Point. Eventually he had learned how to work Excel and the remainder of the programs. I asked him how he was able to do all that. He said he started with the help section then started looking online for answers. Eventually he had mastered the programs. He heard someone talk about how they were having a problem with the program and it would take a while for someone to help them out. We all know how corporate can be at times. This guy opened his mouth and told that person that they didn't need to wait for anyone to help but that he could fix the problem. I bet they were a bit taken back that the janitor could fix the problem but let him take a look anyway. After a few minutes he had helped them work thru the issue. The word got out that he had helped that person and it wasn't too long before he had another job working for the company. I met him when we were working on our MBA's. Always thought that was a cool story.
Increase value to make more money. Don't change the value of the effort it takes to make money.
The big problem is that creating value for an employer does not always translate into an increases in pay. Perhaps it did for you, I have experienced the exact opposite in my career at times.
I think a much better idea is to reform the welfare system to remove the perverse anti-work incentives
Universal Basic Income. Every adult gets it. No means testing. Children have other support, along with a smaller stipend, eliminating the cash benefit of having children.
Now that credit underwriting is the norm in auto insurance, there are probably a lot of people today paying astronomical insurance premiums.
12 years ago I was paying $30 per month for car insurance, before I landed in hospital and lost my income for a spell. I came out of that with trashed credit I can't fix on a poverty level income, so I can easily see car insurance cost an arm and leg if I wanted to get back on the road.
It also makes a difference how long you have had a driver's license continuously. This is one reason you shouldn't let it expire.
A similar story in Seattle during the summer tourist season showed panhandlers around the Pike Place Market clearing $200/day tax free. That would be close to $70k/year, if it were sustainable, but in the off season that will go way down with only the locals who largely ignore them to beg from.
From what I read from some blogs where the writers used to be homeless, they said you also have to deal with competition. You're not going to get the best spots consistently - people will fight you, hurt you for that high dollar panhandling spot so you can't expect to hold a spot like that more than a few days. Police will also run you out depending on the town.
Also, they said it's more exhausting and more dangerous than it looks and most people can't panhandle for 8 hours straight every day.
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