Philadelphia 2035 (King of Prussia, Montgomery, Wall: community college, African American, professor)

[Pine to Vine]

Originally Posted by kyb01

Underneath that one is some talk that Viacom and CBS may be up for grabs.

And didn't Comcast want to buy Verizon the other potential suitor for 21st Century Fox?

With people cutting the cord, they know they need to seek acquisitions to grow.

[cpomp]

http://www.phillymag.com/news/2017/1...te-pew-report/

Essentially no change in poverty for Philadelphia this year :/

The Philadelphia region also has the largest poverty disparity in the nation between the city and the suburbs. I think many of knew that already.

[thedirtypirate]

Originally Posted by cpomp

Philly

Essentially no change in poverty for Philadelphia this year :/

The Philadelphia region also has the largest poverty disparity in the nation between the city and the suburbs. I think many of knew that already.

I don't really get how articles like these get published. I get it they want to highlight a report from our local charitable trust, but Pew puts out reports all the time.

At least provide some substance of 'why' and 'what'. For instance, the author states that the poverty rate has grow by X% since 1972, fully discounting the fact the city's overall population took a rather large nose dive. As pointed out by a similar article (literally last month), there are less people living in Poverty today than there was then, even with the percentage increase. The city limits are arbitrary and small, so it isn't really that surprising that the "hood" would grow while at the same time slowly empty out.

Also none of these authors ever take the time to explain why there is such a large disparity between suburbs and city. Income source discrimination is the biggest factor imo. If landlords couldn't turn you down for paying rent with government assistance, poor people would move to other parts of PA. But they can't.

Combine that with massive Open Space Conservation in places like Bucks that artificially raises the suburban prices, you get a relatively healthy 7mn person metro where all the poor people basically live in a few cities and towns (places where landlords deem it 'okay' for the poor to live).

[FamousBlueRaincoat]

Originally Posted by thedirtypirate

I don't really get how articles like these get published. I get it they want to highlight a report from our local charitable trust, but Pew puts out reports all the time.

At least provide some substance of 'why' and 'what'. For instance, the author states that the poverty rate has grow by X% since 1972, fully discounting the fact the city's overall population took a rather large nose dive. As pointed out by a similar article (literally last month), there are less people living in Poverty today than there was then, even with the percentage increase. The city limits are arbitrary and small, so it isn't really that surprising that the "hood" would grow while at the same time slowly empty out.

Are any of the factors you point out any different from other cities and metro areas around the country, and how?

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by cpomp

Philly

Essentially no change in poverty for Philadelphia this year :/

The Philadelphia region also has the largest poverty disparity in the nation between the city and the suburbs. I think many of knew that already.

Inspite of this Philadelphia does not have the number of homeless people one would expect given that dismal poverty stat.

I'm trying to find the article where that was discussed.

[thedirtypirate]

Originally Posted by MarketStEl

"Desolate" really isn't the right term for that stretch of Washington Avenue.

It's just that most of the businesses along it are not retail stores. Many are wholesalers and companies in the building and design trades that don't need to lure passers-by in.

I am concerned about the possible loss of the historic tax credit too, however.

I never really hung out much on that side of Washington, but it just so happens that in the last few days I have gone to Chick's and Huong Tram along the avenue. I had good experiences at both places. So you are right, it isn't like there is nothing. But like a lot of Philadelphia streets, it could still use some landscaping improvements.

[thedirtypirate]

Originally Posted by FamousBlueRaincoat

Are any of the factors you point out any different from other cities and metro areas around the country, and how?

Suburban counties surrounding Boston, Washington DC, and NYC all have laws that make it illegal for landlords to deny rent based off of section 8

States with SOI Discrimination Protection for Section 8 voucher holders

• Connecticut
• District of Columbia
• Maine
• Massachusetts
• New Jersey
• North Dakota
• Oklahoma
• Oregon
• Vermont

Counties with SOI Discrimination Protection for Section 8 voucher holders

• Marin County, California
• Miami-Dade County, Florida
• Cook County, Illinois
• Howard County, Maryland
• Montgomery County, Maryland
• Nassau County, New York
• Westchester County, New York
• King County, Washington
• Dane County, Wisconsin5
• Suffolk County, New York

Cities with SOI Discrimination Protection for Section 8 voucher holders

• Corte Madera, California
• East Palo Alto, California
• San Francisco, California
• Santa Monica, California
• Urbana, Illinois
• Iowa City, Iowa
• Frederick, Maryland
• Grand Rapids, Michigan
• Minneapolis, Minnesota
• Saint Louis, Missouri
• Buffalo, New York
• New York City, New York
• Syracuse, New York
• Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
• Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
• Borough of State College, Pennsylvania
• Memphis, Tennessee
• Bellevue, Washington6
• Kirkland, Washington2
• Redmond, Washington3
• Seattle, Washington
• Tumwater, Washington
• Vancouver, Washington
• Madison, Wisconsin
• Cambridge, Massachusetts
• Quincy, Massachusetts
• Hamburg, New York
• South Euclid, Ohio

Where Are Section 8 Housing Voucher Holders Protected by SOI Anti-Discrimination Laws?

[FamousBlueRaincoat]

Originally Posted by thedirtypirate

Suburban counties surrounding Boston, Washington DC, and NYC all have laws that make it illegal for landlords to deny rent based off of section 8




Where Are Section 8 Housing Voucher Holders Protected by SOI Anti-Discrimination Laws?

Interesting, thanks. I actually didn't realize that Philadelphian landlords couldn't discriminate. Helps explains some things.

My old hometown of Minneapolis made the list pretty recently apparently- must be driving my old landlord crazy, she was kind of a crusader for nice, affordable, private market apartments and despised public housing and section 8 (I paid 600 for a nice one bedroom, all utilities included, even high speed internet, no credit check). I honestly wouldn't be surprised if she just dropped out of the market, I can't even imagine her taking money from the government. Would be like superman taking kryptonite.

Basically a lot of suburbs all over the country try to keep poor people out though. Much of what's been built since WWII (except for projects) is simply not designed for poor people. The landscape of many suburbs is designed to keep the poor out, with it's mandate on multiple vehicles per household and the single family home. Some obvious historical market solutions like accessory units and boarding houses are illegal. Another obviously historical market solution - the aging of formerly desirable property - is happening, and my guess is that that will help spread people out to the suburbs.

The lack of jobs situation in Philadelphia in my opinion also hurts Philadelphia's numbers, in my opinion. In two ways. Making it hard for people in Philadelphia to get non-poverty jobs, as well as keeping people with good jobs outside of the city (closer to their jobs).

Thanks for the info, though.

[cpomp]

Originally Posted by FamousBlueRaincoat

Interesting, thanks. I actually didn't realize that Philadelphian landlords couldn't discriminate. Helps explains some things.

My old hometown of Minneapolis made the list pretty recently apparently- must be driving my old landlord crazy, she was kind of a crusader for nice, affordable, private market apartments and despised public housing and section 8 (I paid 600 for a nice one bedroom, all utilities included, even high speed internet, no credit check). I honestly wouldn't be surprised if she just dropped out of the market, I can't even imagine her taking money from the government. Would be like superman taking kryptonite.

Basically a lot of suburbs all over the country try to keep poor people out though. Much of what's been built since WWII (except for projects) is simply not designed for poor people. The landscape of many suburbs is designed to keep the poor out, with it's mandate on multiple vehicles per household and the single family home. Some obvious historical market solutions like accessory units and boarding houses are illegal. Another obviously historical market solution - the aging of formerly desirable property - is happening, and my guess is that that will help spread people out to the suburbs.

The lack of jobs situation in Philadelphia in my opinion also hurts Philadelphia's numbers, in my opinion. In two ways. Making it hard for people in Philadelphia to get non-poverty jobs, as well as keeping people with good jobs outside of the city (closer to their jobs).

Thanks for the info, though.

Isn't there some sort of municipality law in PA that mandates for a certain % of affordable housing or senior housing, hence why senior housing the exclusive choice for developers because township residents and planners somehow got around that mandate.

SEPA (excluding Philadelphia) also has the benefit of not needing its core city to get by. I still think Delaware, Chester, Montgomery, and Bucks County carry the region and the whole state for that matter I cannot think of another major metro area where that is the case.

There was also an article posted recently on Philly.com about Philaddelphia's growing affordability problem. I actually commented stating that Philadelphia does not have an affordability problem, it has a problem with lack of jobs and opportunities and programs for people to get out of poverty. Build all the affordable housing you want, that does nothing to fix the problem.

And as many have said before this all comes down to crappy city leadership who are more concerned about the Frank Rizzo statue and increased parking.

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by cpomp

Isn't there some sort of municipality law in PA that mandates for a certain % of affordable housing or senior housing, hence why senior housing the exclusive choice for developers because township residents and planners somehow got around that mandate.

SEPA (excluding Philadelphia) also has the benefit of not needing its core city to get by. I still think Delaware, Chester, Montgomery, and Bucks County carry the region and the whole state for that matter I cannot think of another major metro area where that is the case.

There was also an article posted recently on Philly.com about Philaddelphia's growing affordability problem. I actually commented stating that Philadelphia does not have an affordability problem, it has a problem with lack of jobs and opportunities and programs for people to get out of poverty. Build all the affordable housing you want, that does nothing to fix the problem.

And as many have said before this all comes down to crappy city leadership who are more concerned about the Frank Rizzo statue and increased parking.

1. No, there isn't; if there were, we wouldn't have Councilwoman Maria Quiñones-Sánchez trying to push a bill through City Council mandating an affordable-housing set-aside for new multifamily buildings (10+ units, 10% set-aside) in exchange for density and height bonuses.

What Pennsylvania does have is a law requiring every municipality in the state to provide for every type of development within its zoning code. This at least in theory outlaws "snob zoning" - the mandating of minimum lot sizes that make lower-income or multifamily housing impossible to build within a municipality's borders. I don't think Pennsylvania even has the "Mount Laurel" requirement New Jersey has, which is a mandate that every municipality make provision for low-income housing within its borders or compensate in some way if it doesn't. Senior housing is popular where such provision exists, of course, because it doesn't carry the potential downsides general low-income housing does.

2. Your second paragraph is an example of a fallacy common among suburbanites and put to rest by a paper Richard Voith, then of the Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia and now a partner at Econsult Corporation, wrote in the late 1990s. It was titled "Do Suburbs Need Cities?" It was a study of the economic performance of U.S. metropolitan areas. It found that metropolitan economies were indeed intertwined: the suburbs of cities with strong economies did better than those of cities with weak ones. And if your assertion that the suburbs could carry the region is true, then I guess you haven't been to Detroit or St. Louis lately, for they too would probably fall into the same category - Detroit most emphatically so.

Were a bomb to be dropped on Broad and Market streets tomorrow morning, the shock waves would indeed be felt in the collar counties. The city core of Philadelphia remains the region's single largest employment center, and the bi-directional commuter flows on the Schuylkill Expressway should indicate that it still plays a major role in the regional economy even if King of Prussia runs a strong third to Center City and University City in employment and the total employment figures in the four collar counties outstrip those for Philadelphia - so do their populations taken together.

3. Several commentators and observers, including Yours Truly and journalist-turned-political-activist Jon Geeting, have also made that point. (Here's Geeting making that point in an article that appeared in Next City in 2014.) We also have a large supply of affordable housing already - it's just not located in the neighborhoods everyone wants to live in now, and much of it needs fixing up. The city has a Housing Trust Fund one of whose purposes is to provide grants to low-income homeowners so they can make basic systems repairs on their homes - and thus have the potential to cash in on their one sizable asset sometime down the road. (That is one of the reasons why I give two cheers for gentrification.) The fund gets its assets from the real estate transfer tax, and the less new construction we have, the less that will go into the fund.

I happen to believe that income diversity does matter as much as if not more than racial and ethnic diversity in breaking a bunch of vicious circles - and I also note that most Americans seem to be uncomfortable with the prospect of living in income-diverse neighborhoods. I think that Germantown and Mt. Airy both show the latent potential of income diversity and would like to see them as models for the future.