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I made myself pretty clear in my response....it's totally environmental. In bad environment the chances are higher. In a more loving or family type environment mistakes will be made and that is known....and the conequences will be dealt with.
Do you give everyone @ 16 an abortion or just the ones that won't turn out to be sh*t......If so how do you know which ones will and won't?
What's so hard about those questions?
Is it okay for the girl in the bad environment to have the abortion then?
Even a very loving environment isn't going to solve all the problems...what if the girl continues the pregnancy then decides she CANNOT give it up? Love doesn't pay the bills or buy diapers or watch the baby so that girl can finish high school. I know someone who is living proof of this... got raped at age 15, had the baby, family promised to help, but family was working-poor. Never was able to finish high school. No college, lots of pressures, family to busy paying bills to really help this CHILD learn to parent or even give her a break now and then. Lots of later problems with the child.. none of those talking her out of abortion were much help at all after that point.
She was reluctant to have sex with her BF but he imposed they should for "love
She figures out shes pregnant no matter what and is now scared
She knew what she did was wrong and she wasn't comfortable with it.
She knows her parents will be ill
So the decision is made for her mistake (and his) to abort
She has the abortion and comes out feeling like a huge burden has been lifted.
What has this child learned @ 16 years old?
She has learned her choices though wrong could be easily fixed by this abortion.
She learned that she really has no consequences to having sexual intercourse.
She learned it didn't really matter how bad the mistake it was it can be fixed....without serious recourse (depending on if she already leans to sociopathic behaviors or not as to if she'll ever feel guilty about the abortion). It's human nature to form bonds.....if you can't do that then it's psychological thing.
She learned she can be irresponsible and it doesn't matter.
So that leaves the question which is worse...accepting the consequences of your actions and dealing with the problem or taking the easy way out and the destruction of your morals.
These things have far deeper impacts on personality and behavior than it appears on top. Even the "Nani" will show you how rewarding negative actions with positive reinforcement is a bad idea. See drug abusers still at home with the parents supporting it.
I am amazed at the doubletalk by those who bill themselves as compassionate on this site.
This girl is terrified.
She aborts and also does not feel good about that but feels as though it is the lesser of the evils that all of her choices present to her.
She, afterwards, says it was a close call.
She is grateful for the compassion of the doctor and medical team who aborted her.
She vows never, NEVER to trust a jerk man again when he talks about birth control.
She will not have sex for a very long time afterwards, so frightened was she, and when she does
she chooses a better fellow,
she vows to go on the pill NO MATTER IF IT RUINS HER HEALTH
because almost anything is better than what she went through.
Yes, and she keeps it to herself, her dirty little secret because although she would do it again in the same circumstances, she knows there are prejudiced people out there who would condemn her for her choice.
That, sir, is much more typical.
The silent majority, not the little promiscuous uncaring and unfeeling and irresponsible little character that you portray.
It is hard to understand people as unfeeling and judgmental and cold-hearted as the person who posted under your id. I do not believe that you are as cruel as you sound. If you have a daughter I hope you do not say to her what you have just posted here. Let her keep the illusion of a father's love for as long as she can. It is healthier for her.
Last edited by goldengrain; 07-24-2008 at 12:46 PM..
Look in this thread at pennyG's statement....now you have.....chielgrl.....now you have seen two.
Please tell me where I have ever said I'm pro-abortion.
I am pro-choice. A woman's right to choose.
As in keep your laws off of my body type of vision.
I would never force anyone to do anything with their body, including carrying a fetus to term, there's the difference between me and you.
So, please, don't misrepresent me or out and out lie about my view on the subject. You're clearly anti-choice and want to control what women do.
Please tell me where I have ever said I'm pro-abortion.
I am pro-choice. A woman's right to choose.
As in keep your laws off of my body type of vision.
I would never force anyone to do anything with their body, including carrying a fetus to term, there's the difference between me and you.
So, please, don't misrepresent me or out and out lie about my view on the subject. You're clearly anti-choice and want to control what women do.
I'm strongly pro-choice and a woman should be allowed to whatever she wants. I encourage abortion. If a woman is pregnant, then abortion is the best option.
Oh, please. Enjoying sex does not make one a sociopath. Do you have a degree in Psychiatry?
It’s certain that BigJon has no degree in spelling and/or grammar. His lack of education in a subject matter still doesn’t stop him from being an expert in that area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475
"So, instead, she should be punished, to learn a lesson, with a child."
I want to talk about this a sec.
Before abortions there was no choice to if you are punished or not.
Can we agree this is probably one of the biggest choices for a teen couple in their life to have sex?
Can we agree it's probably a horrible decision?
So with the horrible decision made and the consequences at hand. The parents (assuming they need permission) take them to the clinic to show them their wrong doing is not so bad. Even though that decision was and still is throughout the entire life one of the most important decisions one can make. You don't sleep with someone just because...Well you do with birth control and the ability to have abortion....i.e....see the statistics for VD's
Whoa, you’re way off base here. There have always been abortions. Some women used herbs, others knitting needles and hangars.
A little judgmental about parents and their kids aren’t you? Unless you’ve been in that situation yourself, and are you talking about your personal experience, you don’t know what goes on in a particular family unit.
I made myself pretty clear in my response....it's totally environmental. In bad environment the chances are higher. In a more loving or family type environment mistakes will be made and that is known....and the conequences will be dealt with.
Do you give everyone @ 16 an abortion or just the ones that won't turn out to be sh*t......If so how do you know which ones will and won't?
I’d let anyone who wanted an abortion have one. It’s not my place (although I see that you think it is yours) to presume that I have the right to tell someone else how to live their life and what to do with their body.
I would never presume to insert myself into the most private of matters of someone else.
I'm strongly pro-choice and a woman should be allowed to whatever she wants. I encourage abortion. If a woman is pregnant, then abortion is the best option.
I don't encourage anything for anyone else, except for some education.
I don't have enough information to presume what another person can/should do.
The term "partial-birth abortion" is primarily used in political discourse — chiefly regarding the legality of abortion in the United States. The term is not recognized as a medical term by the American Medical Association nor the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists. This term was first suggested in 1995 by pro-life congressman Charles T. Canady, while developing the original proposed Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Keri Folmar, the lawyer responsible for the bill's language, says the term developed in early 1995 in a meeting between her, Charles T. Canady, and National Right to Life Committee lobbyist Douglas Johnson Canady could not find this particular abortion practice named in any medical textbook, and therefore he and his aides named it.
"Partial-birth abortion" was first used in the media on 4 June 1995 in a Washington Times article covering the bill. The signing of the Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act was seen as a political victory for the pro-life movement, though the law was soon declared unconstitutional by some federal courts, and was eventually upheld by the Supreme Court in a 5-4 decision. In the U.S., a federal statute defines "partial-birth abortion" as any abortion in which the fetus is extracted "past the navel [of the fetus] . . . outside the body of the mother," or "in the case of head-first presentation, the entire fetal head is outside the body of the mother," in order to cause death of the fetus. The U.S. Supreme Court has held that the terms "partial-birth abortion" and "intact dilation and extraction" are basically synonymous. However, there are cases where these overlapping terms do not coincide. For example, the procedure may be used to remove a deceased fetus (e.g. due to a miscarriage or feticide) that is developed enough to require dilation of the cervix for its extraction. Removing a dead fetus does not meet the federal legal definition of "partial-birth abortion," which specifies that partial live delivery must precede "the overt act, other than completion of delivery, that kills the partially delivered living fetus.”
There are conditions under which the procedure is the safest, least expensive, least invasive, most humane, and medically most appropriate means for accomplishing an entirely legal abortion. The statute seeks to replace the best medical judgment available with some of the worst political judgment available. Not much of a trade-off...
No, just pointing out that use of the term <I>innocent</I> with that of <I>fetus</I> is entirely nonsensical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475
Now your assuming. Ask many women how they feel after having sex with someone they weren't 100% on....
No, just offering an observation that your reply had nothing to do with, namely that the Sex = Guilt delusion suffered by social conservatives makes it possible to predict with some accuracy what their opinions on a particular issue will be simply by reasoning whether any side of that issue will result in some people somewhere being more likely to have sex. If there is, that's the side that social con's will stand against. Social con's hate sex.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475
Hmmm...your assuming a 16 year old could never achieve anything after having a baby...
No, I'm relying on statistics related to what amounts to child abuse on two counts, statistics which show that 16-year olds compelled to bear a child end up with lower education, lower income, and lower numbers of children than their non-parenting peers. It is a life-altering act to force a teenager to give birth, and nearly all of those alterations are starkly for the worse. One less abortion though, so I guess you'd be all smiles over it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475
Your playing with what ifs.....there are two sides....what about the woman that regrets that abortion her entire life...
There are some of those. The decision of what to do when confronted by an unwanted pregnancy is a serious one. There are quite literally no good ways out of that particular situation, and all women finding themselves in it would be well counseled to give the matter their most serious, careful, and deliberate thought. The final choice of what to do is not so important. What is important is that the woman comes to the choice that in her own heart is the one that she herself feels she can live with most comfortably. Many, perhaps most, will invite counsel from those they might love or respect, but in the end, it is the woman's decision to make. No one -- no one at all -- has any more right or any more qualification to decide than the woman herself. Ultimately, most women do reach the right decision, act on it, and then successfully live out the rest of their lives. But for various reasons some do not. Things are not likely to go as well when that happens.
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