Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Celebrating Memorial Day!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-27-2011, 10:30 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,292 posts, read 20,780,433 times
Reputation: 9330

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee squared View Post
So you suggest what? No taxes on oil companies?


Actually, yes. Corporate taxes are just added to prices. You and I pay all corporate taxes.


But the stupid part is thinking that removing deductions will lower gas prices.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-27-2011, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,292 posts, read 20,780,433 times
Reputation: 9330
Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
SInce corporations have been granted the rights of a person why should they not have the responsibilities of a person, including paying taxes?

What rights of a person do they have? Can they marry? vote? drive a car?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 10:33 AM
 
Location: Great Falls, Montana
4,002 posts, read 3,911,213 times
Reputation: 1398
Obama couldn't find his ass if you handed it to him on a platter ..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,479 posts, read 59,863,147 times
Reputation: 24863
Even in as rigid a market for transportation fuels as ours, eventually there is a price where consumption takes a very rapid drop. When the demand falls profits drop even with raising prices. Perhaps this is just a nationwide marketing experiment to develop a realistic Price/Demand curve. The oil companies have nothing to lose unless they go too far past the break point and the demand does not increase even if they drop prices. Note prices seem to climb and then drop just about every decade. I wonder why?

BTW – Neither President Obama or the international petroleum marketers are “dumber than dirt”. Just saying so does not make it so except to the “true believers” that will accept anything that fits their delusions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 11:55 AM
 
Location: San Diego, CA
4,897 posts, read 8,329,207 times
Reputation: 1911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
So, gas prices are way up. Oil company profits are up. Oil companies take advantage of deductions that our government has determined will change their behavior.

So what does Obama propose??? Increase oil company taxes by removing the deductions. Now guess what happens when you increase taxes on oil companies????????


You guessed it. They INCREASE gas prices to cover the increased taxes.

Our fearless leader thinks we are dumb... and maybe we are, but not so dumb to believe his political rhetoric.

Raising taxes on oil companies will increase, not decrease, prices at the pump.
You're fundamentally wrong, which isn't surprising since you're blinded by hatred of Obama. It's not just tax deductions but also direct cash subsidies paid by the government to oil companies to do exactly what they would have done anyway at this market price (drill all they can drill) but also reductions in the royalty payment rate (how much we the people get for letting a company use a limited public resource on public land) and rules which require to the Federal government to not track how much oil is being pumped out of public land. We're supposed to just trust what ever the oil company says without verifying even though it is in the oil company's interests to under count (and so avoid as much of the royalty payments as possible).

The hard and unavoidable truth is that the oil companies already have massive market incentive to drill everything inch they can because prices are so high and will keep going higher as global demand increases in 3rd world especially Asia. Subsidies don't actually end up encouraging much drilling (in fact probably not any drilling) because the profit incentive is already astronomically high due to market forces so that subsidies are just a waste of money. If X is a really big number or even just a large number then the difference between X and X + 1 isn't much percentage wise. It's just a waste of taxpayer money right now, conservatives should be appalled the the government is screwing with the free market by arbitrarily picking winners and losers (based on subsidies) and tax payers should be more concerned with maximizing profit from the sale of public resources to the highest amount the market will sustain over the long term.

That means instead of lowering royalty payments for oil companies tax payers should be raising them because the demand is so great they're leaving money on the table wrt the sale of publicly owned resources. The government should not be giving free money to politically connected companies especially since the market already does a much better job based on supply and demand. We should end market distorting subsidies and let the market sort out the winners and losers without government pushing the scales in favor of firms which spend big on lobbyists.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,848,652 times
Reputation: 14116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkatt View Post
You keep the change, I would rather keep my dollars.
Hey, I didn't vote for him. But you might wanna look more closely at those dollar bills while your at it... they are just pieces of paper...tools for manipulation... with no intrinsic worth.

My fellow Americans, we've been had...hoodwinked...bamboozled! The Man isn't dumb, we are. We unwittingly playing his game.

Silly monkeys, every one of us!

Last edited by Chango; 04-27-2011 at 12:11 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 12:04 PM
 
8,289 posts, read 13,582,938 times
Reputation: 5019
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
So, gas prices are way up. Oil company profits are up. Oil companies take advantage of deductions that our government has determined will change their behavior.

So what does Obama propose??? Increase oil company taxes by removing the deductions. Now guess what happens when you increase taxes on oil companies????????


You guessed it. They INCREASE gas prices to cover the increased taxes.

Our fearless leader thinks we are dumb... and maybe we are, but not so dumb to believe his political rhetoric.

Raising taxes on oil companies will increase, not decrease, prices at the pump.
Only a fool would defend the obscene profits Oil companies make! They don't need a reason to increase "gas prices" since we as Consumers are held hostage and beholden to them!

The only thing that will make Oil companies drop their prices is a drop in consumption and that is coming!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 12:25 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Western Massachusetts
45,983 posts, read 53,595,264 times
Reputation: 15184
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjtwet View Post
who do you think is going to pay that tax? Oil companies will just raise their prices to cover the loss of revenue from the tax. Whose going to ultimately;y pay for this tax? The consumer that is who

No, the price is set by supply and demand. Oil companies can't raise price above market rates. Ending oil companies subsidies will increase their costs slightly, which could possibly lower the supply (some oil production would be less profitable), then raising prices.

But if oil prices are higher, it's already profitable anyway, and so ending subsidies won't raise prices.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 12:26 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,292 posts, read 20,780,433 times
Reputation: 9330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oerdin View Post
You're fundamentally wrong, which isn't surprising since you're blinded by hatred of Obama. It's not just tax deductions but also direct cash subsidies paid by the government to oil companies to do exactly what they would have done anyway at this market price (drill all they can drill) but also reductions in the royalty payment rate (how much we the people get for letting a company use a limited public resource on public land) and rules which require to the Federal government to not track how much oil is being pumped out of public land. We're supposed to just trust what ever the oil company says without verifying even though it is in the oil company's interests to under count (and so avoid as much of the royalty payments as possible).

The hard and unavoidable truth is that the oil companies already have massive market incentive to drill everything inch they can because prices are so high and will keep going higher as global demand increases in 3rd world especially Asia. Subsidies don't actually end up encouraging much drilling (in fact probably not any drilling) because the profit incentive is already astronomically high due to market forces so that subsidies are just a waste of money. If X is a really big number or even just a large number then the difference between X and X + 1 isn't much percentage wise. It's just a waste of taxpayer money right now, conservatives should be appalled the the government is screwing with the free market by arbitrarily picking winners and losers (based on subsidies) and tax payers should be more concerned with maximizing profit from the sale of public resources to the highest amount the market will sustain over the long term.

That means instead of lowering royalty payments for oil companies tax payers should be raising them because the demand is so great they're leaving money on the table wrt the sale of publicly owned resources. The government should not be giving free money to politically connected companies especially since the market already does a much better job based on supply and demand. We should end market distorting subsidies and let the market sort out the winners and losers without government pushing the scales in favor of firms which spend big on lobbyists.

You are fundamentally wrong due to your blind following of Obama.

I never said I agreed with tax incentives for oil companies and I totally support ending all "market distorting subsidies". Our bloated government has implemented tax and other incentives by the thousands over the years and totally destroyed the concept of a free market.

What I said is that raising their costs (regardless of the method used) will not lower gas prices. Obama is telling the voters that he is trying to lower gas prices but his actions will have the opposite effect.

And by the way, some of these subsidies are for hiring US workers (which I do not agree with, but the voters love them).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-27-2011, 12:27 PM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,351 posts, read 54,507,973 times
Reputation: 40819
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
What rights of a person do they have? Can they marry? vote? drive a car?
If you're really interested read the SCOTUS decision.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top