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To the people who want prayer: What about a Muslim prayer? Should Christians be forced to participate in a government sanctioned (unconstitutional) Muslim prayer?
I guess because the country was founded on Judea/Christian principles mostly.
But, I can see with the country being much more diverse these days that Christian prayer being imposed on others as offensive (I'm a Christian btw).
I know it's not "imposed" in a literal sense, but I have a lot of friends of various different religious beliefs, or those that have none at all, and believe that you should respect others' beliefs in a public event.
I will NEVER ignore Christ, but that is something that I can do PERSONALLY. HE who is The Lord in my opinion is satisfied with that.
I am not here to judge other people who believe differently than me. I have my beliefs, but respect the views of those who believe differently than me.
God gave each and every person the option to believe as they see fit.
I guess because the country was founded on Judea/Christian principles mostly.
But, I can see with the country being much more diverse these days that Christian prayer being imposed on others as offensive (I'm a Christian btw).
I know it's not "imposed" in a literal sense, but I have a lot of friends of various different religious beliefs, or those that have none at all, and believe that you should respect others' beliefs in a public event.
I will NEVER ignore Christ, but that is something that I can do PERSONALLY. HE who is The Lord in my opinion is satisfied with that.
I am not here to judge other people who believe differently than me. I have my beliefs, but respect the views of those who believe differently than me.
God gave each and every person the option to believe as they see fit.
The problem isn't that it's offensive, it's that it's wrong. The government should not endorse any religion. People who want government sponsored religion are free to move to Iran, but America is a secular democracy with separation of church and state.
"God" isn't mentioned anywhere in the Constitution and we weren't founded on Judeo-Christian principles. We were founded on Enlightenment and classical principles. Democracy isn't anywhere in the Bible.
No one is ever forced to pray, bow their heads or say Amen. To say they are is ridiculous. We have freedom OF religion in this country, not freedom FROM religion.
No one is ever forced to pray, bow their heads or say Amen. To say they are is ridiculous. We have freedom OF religion in this country, not freedom FROM religion.
This ruling is ridiculous.
We have freedom to not have GOVERNMENT endorse a religion.
The problem isn't that it's offensive, it's that it's wrong. The government should not endorse any religion. People who want government sponsored religion are free to move to Iran, but America is a secular democracy with separation of church and state.
"God" isn't mentioned anywhere in the Constitution and we weren't founded on Judeo-Christian principles. We were founded on Enlightenment and classical principles. Democracy isn't anywhere in the Bible.
I disagree to some extent. The Founding Fathers were definitely pro Judeo-Christian, which IMO were enlightened, especially at the time.
You can disagree with me on this small part of my argument, fine.
And I agree; government should NEVER endorse any religion. It doesn't negate what our Founding Fathers believed in. They more than any other agreed that government should never endorse a religion.
BTW, I never said that God was mentioned in the Constitution; please quit putting words in my mouth. I also never said Democracy was never mentioned in the Bible.
If you want to hate on me for my beliefs, that's fine. But please don't try and put words in my mouth.
I think you have bigger fish to fry than me, btw. I'm actually agreeing that people of different religions shouldn't be subjected to Christian prayer at a public event.
If you simply dislike me because I am firm in my beliefs that's fine. I will still continue to believe what I believe, you aren't going to change my mind.
I disagree to some extent. The Founding Fathers were definitely pro Judeo-Christian, which IMO were enlightened, especially at the time.
You can disagree with me on this small part of my argument, fine.
And I agree; government should NEVER endorse any religion. It doesn't negate what our Founding Fathers believed in. They more than any other agreed that government should never endorse a religion.
BTW, I never said that God was mentioned in the Constitution; please quit putting words in my mouth. I also never said Democracy was never mentioned in the Bible.
If you want to hate on me for my beliefs, that's fine. But please don't try and put words in my mouth.
I think you have bigger fish to fry than me, btw. I'm actually agreeing that people of different religions shouldn't be subjected to Christian prayer at a public event.
If you simply dislike me because I am firm in my beliefs that's fine. I will still continue to believe what I believe, you aren't going to change my mind.
I don't dislike you and I have nothing against religious people as long as they don't fly planes into buildings, try to teach religion in science classes, etc. What I'm telling you is that this country was not founded in Judeo-Christian principles at all. If you think otherwise, post examples from the Constitution. It's weird that evangelicals believe that to begin with. Jesus said "whatever you did not do for one of the least among you, you did not do for me" and yet this country was founded with legal slavery.
Yes, some of the founding fathers were Christians, but not all. Most of them believed in the deism, the idea that God created the universe but doesn't mess with it.
No one is ever forced to pray, bow their heads or say Amen. To say they are is ridiculous. We have freedom OF religion in this country, not freedom FROM religion.
This ruling is ridiculous.
Those who don't believe in Christianity are singled out. How is that fair to them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by schmidty223
That's a bad thing... Most of the nation is Christian. Bad Idea.
And? Should we make the official language of Texas Spanish if Spanish speakers outnumber English speakers? Numbers mean nothing.
Lots of people seem to say "get over it" now, but if another religion was forced upon them, they'd be upset.
My high school didn't have a prayer, but we had a separate event a week or two before graduation that had a lot of Christian themes that came up.
With good reason. If I were a Buddhist (for example), I wouldn't feel comfortable if my children were forced to sit through a Christian prayer. Celebrate your faith on your own time (not specifically you Westerner; just in general).
I wasn't really clear with my post, but what I meant to say is that in my experience, observers of other religions aren't the ones who are offended, it's only atheists.
Even though we are a secular society in name, there is a strong Judeo-Christian history here, and Christianity is the predominant religion. I'm not condoning it, and I'm not saying it's right, but it's inevitable that certain elements of religion are going to make their way into public ceremonies. Those of other faiths understand and respect that. I know that if I go to a country that is mostly Muslim (let's say Turkey, since they are heavily Muslim and not a theocracy), then I can reasonably expect that the Islamic faith is going to be brought up in large public gatherings. If I go to Thailand, then I can expect Buddhism will play a role in the government. No one is trying to force their religion on me, even if their practice of it can be ostentatious.
It's only atheists that get so upset and pouty about little things like this.
Last edited by Westerner92; 06-01-2011 at 06:51 PM..
I wasn't really clear with my post, but what I meant to say is that in my experience, observers of other religions aren't the ones who are offended, it's only atheists.
OK. Makes sense. I've seen both atheists and members of other faiths get upset.
Quote:
Even though we are a secular society in name, there is a strong Judeo-Christian history here, and Christianity is the predominant religion. It's inevitable that certain elements of religion are going to make their way into public ceremonies. Those of other faiths understand and respect that. I know that if I go to a country that is mostly Muslim (let's say Turkey, since they are heavily Muslim and not a theocracy), then I can reasonably expect that the Islamic faith is going to be brought up in large public gatherings. If I go to Thailand, then I can expect Buddhism will play a role in the government. No one is trying to force their religion on me, even if their practice of it can be ostentatious. I
t's only atheists that get so upset and pouty about little things like this.
It's really not a little thing, though.
I think a lot of people overlook these issues because they're in the majority. What if, down the line, Christians became the minority and Muslims were the religious majority? Would you want to sit through a Muslim prayer at a football game? Or would you want your children to have to say a Muslim prayer at the start of the school day?
At the end of the day, your faith should be something between you, your diety(ies), and other members of your religious community. "Non-believers" shouldn't be cast aside or singled out just because they're not in the majority.
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