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As for hosting, what personal services does the Holiday Inn provide? The difference between public accommodations and private accommodations is that when I am a host in my home, ALL the services I provide are personal. But when I am a host for a public function, the services I provide are professional, not personal. Professional, because I am being reimbursed for my efforts monetarily. The Holiday Inn is being reimbursed for its services. The Wildwood Inn is being reimbursed for its services. That fact alone requires the inn's owners to supply its services in a professional manner. Discrimination is not professional.
And that's the heart of my question. What if providing those services is in violation of a person's religious beliefs. Now you are weighing one person's civil rights against another. The courts are asked to do this often so this would not be a unique case in that respect. The uniqueness in this particular case is if sexual orientation is a civil right. In Vermont, it is, but what if the inn owners sue the state of Vermont, saying they violated their civil rights based upon discrimination of religious beliefs? So again, has the state of Vermont violated the inn's owners civil rights?
And that's the heart of my question. What if providing those services is in violation of a person's religious beliefs. Now you are weighing one person's civil rights against another. The courts are asked to do this often so this would not be a unique case in that respect. The uniqueness in this particular case is if sexual orientation is a civil right. In Vermont, it is, but what if the inn owners sue the state of Vermont, saying they violated their civil rights based upon discrimination of religious beliefs? So again, has the state of Vermont violated the inn's owners civil rights?
What professional services would it be a violation of religious beliefs to provide? Making sure guests have bathroom facilities that are clean and functional? Making sure the caterer gets set up to serve guests? Making sure the band has functioning electric outlets? Greeting people at the door and directing them to the right reception area? How does showing professional hospitality to anyone violate religious beliefs?
Calvinist thinks the Civil Rights of Americans is something that needs "public support"! If that were the case we still would have blacks sitting in the back of a bus and women not being able to vote!
No. I think a "Civil Right" is something that isn't based on an immoral behavior.
I realize you're late to this conversation, but this entire discussion has to do with Vermont's civil rights laws.
The fact that you might not consider the provision of equal rights to gays and lesbians in your twisted picture of what's right and wrong is entirely beside the point.
Still, let's give you a fair chance: go ahead and present any evidence of any substantial inroads into the activities of churches by the so-called liberal courts.
If a couple thinks that they can sue to get a private establishment to do something that goes against the belief system of the proprietor, why wouldn't they think they can sue to force a church to go against their beliefs?
Prior to this lawsuit had such an establishment been sued based on sexual activity?
What professional services would it be a violation of religious beliefs to provide? Making sure guests have bathroom facilities that are clean and functional? Making sure the caterer gets set up to serve guests? Making sure the band has functioning electric outlets? Greeting people at the door and directing them to the right reception area? How does showing professional hospitality to anyone violate religious beliefs?
The owners at the inn felt providing those services did violate their religious beliefs. Maybe they thought it showed de facto support of something their religious beliefs do not support? Who knows? However, the basic question remains...did the state of Vermont violate the inn owner's civil rights? Tough question but I am sure as these sexual orientation discrimination laws are challenged, that will be at the forefront.
What professional services would it be a violation of religious beliefs to provide? Making sure guests have bathroom facilities that are clean and functional? Making sure the caterer gets set up to serve guests? Making sure the band has functioning electric outlets? Greeting people at the door and directing them to the right reception area? How does showing professional hospitality to anyone violate religious beliefs?
How about allowing a "marriage" to take place in their establishment?
It's not the same as race. It's a serious violation of their religious beliefs to take part in a homosexual wedding. They're under no obligation to serve anyone either, it's their business.
Your last statement is ridiculous. I don't know of any credible mainstream religion that opposes saving a person's life regardless of who they are.
Oh really? Would you be a-ok with a Hindu business owner kicking out a customer for being Christian?
How about allowing a "marriage" to take place in their establishment?
If the Holiday Inn allows a Bar Mitzvah to take place on their premises, does that mean that the Holiday Inn is anti-Christian and pro-Judaism? This was an inn, offering public accommodations. The owners were not asked to officiate at the wedding, they were asked to rent out accommodations for a reception. And the inn's owners allow homosexuals to rent out rooms, so when those homosexual couples have sex in those rooms, I guess the money paid for the room makes up for the religious offense, huh?
The owners at the inn felt providing those services did violate their religious beliefs. Maybe they thought it showed de facto support of something their religious beliefs do not support? Who knows? However, the basic question remains...did the state of Vermont violate the inn owner's civil rights? Tough question but I am sure as these sexual orientation discrimination laws are challenged, that will be at the forefront.
Once again, what services? Were they asked to bless the marriage? No. What services, specifically, violate religious tenets? They can't say that they are just opposed to homosexuality, since they have publicly stated that they rent out rooms to homosexuals to sleep in (and do what everyone else does in beds in inns/hotels/motels). So homosexuals can have sex in their rented rooms, but not wedding receptions? Because of the services provided? Changing the sheets after a couple has sex-okay, filling the water glass of homosexual diner-okay, but a sit-down dinner and dance-not okay?
If the Holiday Inn allows a Bar Mitzvah to take place on their premises, does that mean that the Holiday Inn is anti-Christian and pro-Judaism? This was an inn, offering public accommodations. The owners were not asked to officiate at the wedding, they were asked to rent out accommodations for a reception. And the inn's owners allow homosexuals to rent out rooms, so when those homosexual couples have sex in those rooms, I guess the money paid for the room makes up for the religious offense, huh?
What part of "Private establishment" do you not understand? They can reserve the right to serve whomever they want. And there is not a dang thing you can do about it. That's what this country is all about.
You don't like it? Move to Canada. We don't want you here if you don't want to respect my right to private ownership.
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