Riots Break Out in Spain-25% Unemployment

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by Repubocrat

Actually this 5% statistic is wrong!

No it isn't.

The source is the OECD's annual report.

Originally Posted by Repubocrat

I have several German friends with and without college degrees who are way more educated, worldly and aware of international affairs than the average American.

I work with "educated" American people who have college degrees who still don't know the difference between "lose" and "loose"- pretty sad!

No kidding. That's because in the US students spend all their time in divorce class, and then talking about the "hole in the ozone layer that we created" (I heard a teacher say that during an observation at a school) and then talking about how wonderful the UN is and then why Susie has two mommies, and Tommy's daddy always has his hands down his other daddy's pants.

Originally Posted by Repubocrat

Germany does not have the same income/class inequalities that we have here in the USA, therefore, I think a person of any race that has what it takes to go to a good university will find his/her way to higher education through dedication and hard work, regardless of race or social class.

That's not entirely true.

There's still some West/East dichotomy, plus the North/South dichotomy. And then the Turks (and other gastarbiters). Even so, that isn't nearly as bad as Italy, with Sicilians, Calebresians, Neapolitans, Romans (from the area around Rome), Tuscans, Venetians etc. And that isn't as bad as Romania with Romanians, Serbs, Magyars, Jews, Germans, Ruthenians, Slovaks, Ukrainians, Russians and Bulgars. And then the North Koreans and Libyans.

Still, it's all based on merit.

Demographically...

Mircea

Originally Posted by doc1

Pretty enlightening posts re Germany's eduacation system.

Does the German system have set asides that keep from having under-represented classes of people in their higher education system?

Something similar to the Affirmative Action programs that many US colleges have?

No, the Euro-States aren't on that.

In Romania no one runs around with graphs screaming "discrimination" because Jews are over/under represented, or Serbs are over/under represented, or Magyars or Germans or the others are over/under represented.

Their system -- and not just Germany's -- is highly efficient. That's one reason students who earn the right to go to university can go for free. You have to remember that many of those countries have huge social welfare budgets, but very limited income/revenues, and deficits and debt are limited by Treaty.

What that does is force them to constantly re-invent themselves. Here in the US if something isn't working (in education) the answer is always "Give us more money." In Europe, if something isn't working, then it is either reformed so that it does work, or it is eliminated, because there is no more money to give.

I suppose you could ask does their education system reflect their attitudes, or are their attitudes shaped by the education system?

I worked as a paralegal, but now, I can't get a job as a paralegal, because I have to take a certification test. Take the test. I can't because I don't have a degree as a paralegal, and how stupid would it be for me to waste 2 years of my time and lots of money to sit in a classroom and have someone tell me how to do things I've been doing for years and years.

And I guess the point is that many jobs or professions in the US require university degrees, but that is not true in Europe, due to the fact that either no degree is required or at most vocational training is required.

And that relates to efficiency which reduces costs which allows more people to be educated or trained, if you are using your educational resources efficiently.

Here in the US, you waste money on students by keeping them in school to age 18, even though 2 more years of education will do nothing for them, or your, or your country, or your economy, so kick their asses out at age 16.

That's what they do in Europe. That frees up time, money, space and resources for those students who are productive and learning able.

In Europe, a kid would graduate at 16, and then maybe go to a training academy for a year studying more advanced language and writing, and then go to a 2 year vocational school to be a paralegal/legal secretary.

In Europe, you wouldn't go to university for 2-4 years to be a phlebotomist. You'd graduate high school at 16, then go to a 2 year school studying physiology and human anatomy and things related to be phlebotomist, but you also have transferable skills to other medical fields later.

They take a more practical approach, you either have the brains and intelligence, or you don't and no amount of feel-goodness or dumbed down curriculum will change that.

Pedagogically...

Mircea