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Actually, no money has circulated since 1933.
A Federal Reserve Note (dollar bill) is an IOU. (See Title 12 USC Sec. 411).
REAL MONEY - Money which has real metallic, intrinsic value as distinguished from paper currency, checks and drafts.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1264
MONEY - In usual and ordinary acceptation it means coins and paper currency used as a circulating medium of exchange, and does not embrace notes, bonds, evidences of debt, or other personal or real estate. Lane v. Railey, 280 Ky. 319, 133 S.W. 2d 74, 79, 81.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1005
NOTE - An instrument containing an express and absolute promise of signer (i.e. maker) to pay to a specified person or order, or bearer, a definite sum of money at a specified time. An instrument that is a promise to pay other than a certificate of deposit. U.C.C. 3-104(2)(d)
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1060
A "dollar bill" is not a dollar, nor is it money, since money does not embrace notes (debt).
How bad is it? The public debt, in terms of gold bullion, computes to over 800 billion ounces of gold stamped into coin.
Problem #1 : Fort Knox Depository (allegedly) holds 147.4 million ounces of gold (approx. $2.9 billion gold dollars worth).
Problem #2 : World wide supply of gold is estimated at 5.2 billion ounces. ($104 billion dollars worth).
Problem #3: World wide mining (2011) : 88 million oz production ($1.7 billion U.S.) At that rate, for Americans to pay off the national debt, currently 16.25 T dollars, would require them to acquire all the worlds gold for the next 9,500 years - IF - the debt and interest were frozen RIGHT NOW.
As to the quaint image of falling off a cliff - we're about to go SPLAT.
Is that you Glen?
We don't live on a gold standard, good thing we don't, the net worth of this privately held wealth is in excess of $60trillion, not counting this country's mineral rights, our natural resources and much of the value of the derivative markets. We'd have a tough time equaling that little pile of shiny metal (half the world's available supply) to the nation's actual worth by any other standard.
We don't live on a gold standard, good thing we don't, the net worth of this privately held wealth is in excess of $60trillion, not counting this country's mineral rights, our natural resources and much of the value of the derivative markets. We'd have a tough time equaling that little pile of shiny metal (half the world's available supply) to the nation's actual worth by any other standard.
If you would, please find the specific law that defines a unit dollar.
If it conflicts with the Coinage Act of 1792, et seq, I would be interested in reading it.
Oh, and if you know of a law that redefines the dollar bill (which is NOT a dollar) and voids Title 12 USC sec. 411, please let us know.
And based on the FACT that dollar bills are borrowed, at usury, into existence, the maximum number can never exceed the public debt (nearing 16 Trillion). But since "dollar bills" are IOUs, they have a minus value.
So can you tell us where are those $60 Trillion "dollars" to be used in evaluating that "privately held wealth". Because you can't have something worth that which does not nor will exist.
And since the world supply (est.) is 5.2 billion ounces, and Fort Knox only has 147.4 million ounces, methinks your math is off a wee bit.
And let's not forget that Congress has no power to create money.
Art. 1, Sec. 8, states that Congress has the power to coin money (stamp bullion) or borrow money.
If it had the power to create money, why would it need the power to borrow it?
If you prefer not to read law, I understand. You're taking your cue from Congress, which enacts laws it does not read.
If you're going to quote my post and respond to it, I'd appreciate if you posted it up correctly and didn't strike my name out.
You do understand that everything has value, gold has value, land, minerals, water, buildings, tool, machinery, infrastructure, and on and on. I suspect you live in a gold or paper money world. If a piece of shiny metal can be given an arbitrary value, so can anything else.
$60 trillion or more. That include the value of equities. It doesn't include the huge, $224 trillion or more, amount being played with on the derivatives market.
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics
If you would, please find the specific law that defines a unit dollar.
If it conflicts with the Coinage Act of 1792, et seq, I would be interested in reading it.
Oh, and if you know of a law that redefines the dollar bill (which is NOT a dollar) and voids Title 12 USC sec. 411, please let us know.
And based on the FACT that dollar bills are borrowed, at usury, into existence, the maximum number can never exceed the public debt (nearing 16 Trillion). But since "dollar bills" are IOUs, they have a minus value.
So can you tell us where are those $60 Trillion "dollars" to be used in evaluating that "privately held wealth". Because you can't have something worth that which does not nor will exist.
And since the world supply (est.) is 5.2 billion ounces, and Fort Knox only has 147.4 million ounces, methinks your math is off a wee bit.
And let's not forget that Congress has no power to create money.
Art. 1, Sec. 8, states that Congress has the power to coin money (stamp bullion) or borrow money.
If it had the power to create money, why would it need the power to borrow it?
If you prefer not to read law, I understand. You're taking your cue from Congress, which enacts laws it does not read.
You do understand that everything has value, gold has value, land, minerals, water, buildings, tool, machinery, infrastructure, and on and on. I suspect you live in a gold or paper money world. If a piece of shiny metal can be given an arbitrary value, so can anything else.
$60 trillion or more. That include the value of equities. It doesn't include the huge, $224 trillion or more, amount being played with on the derivatives market.
Value is one thing.
Money tokens are something else.
As to the law, a unit dollar is a silver coin. A one ounce gold coin is equivalent to 20 unit dollars (aka "double eagle"). Silver was demonetized in the Coinage Act of 1873.
FDR stole all the gold money in 1933, and criminalized the possession of it by "free" Americans.
A "dollar bill" is a variable, not a constant, when it comes to trade value.
And money tokens do not "give value". Money tokens should 'hold value' - temporarily - until a future trade for real goods and / or services. But don't wait too long - hyperinflation is draining that as we ponder these words.
The reality is the sum of all goods and services.
The illusion is that they have some arbitrary value, denominated in a repudiated worthless note.
(No par value since 1933)
And those who hold wealth denominated in "dollar bills" have a surprise awaiting them.
Value is one thing.
Money tokens are something else.
As to the law, a unit dollar is a silver coin. A one ounce gold coin is equivalent to 20 unit dollars (aka "double eagle"). Silver was demonetized in the Coinage Act of 1873.
FDR stole all the gold money in 1933, and criminalized the possession of it by "free" Americans.
A "dollar bill" is a variable, not a constant, when it comes to trade value.
And money tokens do not "give value". Money tokens should 'hold value' - temporarily - until a future trade for real goods and / or services. But don't wait too long - hyperinflation is draining that as we ponder these words.
The reality is the sum of all goods and services.
The illusion is that they have some arbitrary value, denominated in a repudiated worthless note.
(No par value since 1933)
And those who hold wealth denominated in "dollar bills" have a surprise awaiting them.
Pursuant to law, enacted under the auspices of the U.S. constitution, certain axioms about money exist.
The following definitions highlight the distinction - - -
REAL MONEY - Money which has real metallic, intrinsic value as distinguished from paper currency, checks and drafts.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1264
MONEY - In usual and ordinary acceptation it means coins and paper currency used as a circulating medium of exchange, and does not embrace notes, bonds, evidences of debt, or other personal or real estate. Lane v. Railey, 280 Ky. 319, 133 S.W. 2d 74, 79, 81.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1005
NOTE - An instrument containing an express and absolute promise of signer (i.e. maker) to pay to a specified person or order, or bearer, a definite sum of money at a specified time. An instrument that is a promise to pay other than a certificate of deposit. U.C.C. 3-104(2)(d)
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 1060
The U.S. constitution limits states to "gold and silver coin" as tender in payment (not discharge) of debt.
Note: none of the aforementioned diminish the right of the people to issue their own medium of exchange (not "money"). A popular example is the coupon denominated in a service or product. (ex: "One free Micky D burger")
When one tenders a coupon, and receives the promised item or service, a transaction has occurred.
If producers could issue coupons denominated in their product as a means to finance their operation - pay for raw materials and labor - they would not be under the same pressure to "get market share" to acquire sufficient money tokens (scarce and burdened with usury).
Local communities, who are cash starved, could revitalize their economies with such a simple medium of exchange.
Ultimately, that is the real function of money - to facilitate trade.
And trade is a vital component of prosperity - the production, trade and enjoyment of surplus usable goods and services.
As to the "Fiscal Cliff" - one may have to take a detour and stop using their money token system with all its trapdoors and hidden charges. I don't see the benefit of working a major portion of one's life for the benefit of others, under the compulsion of laws that were imposed by fraudulent consent.
Exercising rights not subject to taxation is evidently more rewarding than being a recipient of privileges that are subject to taxation, regulation and restriction.
We are indeed, on the way to collapse, as neither party has the political will to curb the insane spending. In the end, it may be the best thing to happen to conservatives, who will be able to form a separate nation in the ashes of the old US.
WOW, If I had a nickel for every end of the world statement that came from some neocon that could not accept that the USA is moving on. You are no different than the people who yelled that desegregation was a communist plot to destroy America. LOL I think Charlie Manson had the same idea that after the Race Wars he would rise up and lead the new nation. It was called Helterskelter. LOL What do you call it? The second coming? The new revolution? I am sure you will tag some patriotic name to it, but in the end its just insanity.
WOW, If I had a nickel for every end of the world statement that came from some neocon that could not accept that the USA is moving on. You are no different than the people who yelled that desegregation was a communist plot to destroy America. LOL I think Charlie Manson had the same idea that after the Race Wars he would rise up and lead the new nation. It was called Helterskelter. LOL What do you call it? The second coming? The new revolution? I am sure you will tag some patriotic name to it, but in the end its just insanity.
And this personal attack is a rebuttal of what fact?
To authorize more "dollar bills", Congress has to go deeper into debt. And to pay the interest on those "dollar bills", Congress has to go deeper into debt. (See: Title 12 USC sec. 411).
Congress borrows MORE each year than it pays in interest on the debt. That’s what Bernie Madoff went to prison for doing in the private sector. No “investor” will ever see his principal returned.
(2011 : $1.56 trillion deficit; $208.7 billion for interest payments)
And this insanity cannot be questioned, pursuant to clause 4, 14th amendment, USCON.
The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law... shall not be questioned.
There it is. An impossible to repay public debt that CANNOT be questioned.
They're insane and you can't do anything to stop them.
Then it is a very good thing that nobody is proposing that as a solution.
No, I have been. A 10% tax on financial wealthy of the extremely wealthy (including the non profit churches) would put things back in order in a few short years. Time for those that have taken some much from this country to return a portion of it. Call it a retroactive income tax if you like, but it is time the ppl that ran up this debt with the raids on the treasury and their unfunded wars catch up on their dues.
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