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Old 01-21-2013, 11:42 PM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,452,870 times
Reputation: 14266

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Quick - conservatives! Tell us how this is also a "liberal media conspiracy" just like Sandy Hook was!

KUChief? What's the spin?
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:44 PM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,452,870 times
Reputation: 14266
Quote:
Originally Posted by chucksnee View Post
Gun violence has gone down over the years, And you are advocating the government step in....with more laws....

There are ignorant people out there, there always will be....

It's time anti gun people learn the argument, before arguing....
Gun violence is actually many multiples higher in this nation than other developed first-world nations in North America, Europe, and Asia. You can't refute that.
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Old 01-22-2013, 03:59 AM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,264,758 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spudee View Post
I'm afraid I'll have to disagree with your statement above that "banning one type of gun is worthless and just a 'feel good measure". In 1996, following the Port Arthur massacre here in Australia, our Prime Minister, John Howard, stepped up and following discussions with all State leaders, State and Federal gun laws were tightened. All Semi-auto weapons, including assault rifles, sporting rifles and shotguns, were banned. The results of banning these weapons, as well as the tightening of gun laws lead to the following: "Between 1991 and 2001, the number of firearm-related deaths in Australia declined 47%.[25] According to a 2011 report from the Australian government, "...the number of victims of homicide has been in decline since 1996. In 1996, there were 354 victims and 260 victims in 2010. This is a decrease of 27 percent." And furthermore, "The proportion of homicide victims killed by offenders using firearms in 2009–10 represented a decrease of 18 percentage points from the peak of 31 percent in 1995–96 (the year in which the Port Arthur massacre occurred with the death of 35 people, which subsequently led to the introduction of stringent firearms legislation)." [3]
Well that isn't true at all. The homicide rate in Australia was rising from 1996 to 2001 and then started its' decline.

http://www.ssaa.org.au/capital-news/...un-buyback.pdf

Abstract:

The 1996-97 National Firearms Agreement (NFA) in Australia introduced strict gun
laws, primarily as a reaction to the mass shooting in Port Arthur, Tasmania in 1996,
where 35 people were killed. Despite the fact that several researchers using the same
data have examined the impact of the NFA on firearm deaths, a consensus does not
appear to have been reached. In this paper, we re-analyze the same data on firearm
deaths used in previous research, using tests for unknown structural breaks as a means
to identifying impacts of the NFA. The results of these tests suggest that the NFA did
not have any large effects on reducing firearm homicide or suicide rates.


Australian Institute of Criminology - Violent crime


  • Recorded assault increased again in 2007, to 840 per 100,000, compared with 623 per 100,000 in 1996. The 2007 rate was the highest recorded since 1996.
  • The rate for robbery peaked in 2001. Rates have declined by 38 percent since 2001, to 86 per 100,000 per year.
  • The rate of kidnapping remained between three and four per 100,000 per year from 1996 to 2007.
  • The homicide rate was 1.9 per 100,000 in 1996 (which includes the 35 victims of the Port Arthur massacre) and was at its highest in 1999, at 2.0 per 100,000. In 2007, the rate was 1.3 per 100,000, the lowest recorded (since 1996).
  • The rate of recorded sexual assault increased between 1997 and 2007, from 78 to 94 persons per 100,000 per year.
Let's compare to the USA


Bureau of Justice Statistics Violent Crime Rate Trends




Bureau of Justice Statistics Violent Crime Rate Trends
National Crime Victimization Survey Violent Crime Trends, 1973-2008

If guns bans were effective why would the USA not show increases in violent crime of murder rates and Australia would? Particularly when we consider the fact that the USA has always been more violent?

Joyce Lee Malcolm: Two Cautionary Tales of Gun Control - WSJ.com
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Old 01-22-2013, 04:01 AM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,264,758 times
Reputation: 3444
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient View Post
Gun violence is actually many multiples higher in this nation than other developed first-world nations in North America, Europe, and Asia. You can't refute that.
It is and always has been, even when the gun laws were comparable. What solution do you propose to deal with gangs, drugs, and the border?
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Old 01-22-2013, 06:03 AM
 
46,306 posts, read 27,108,503 times
Reputation: 11130
Quote:
Originally Posted by ellemint View Post
No one is trying to ban all guns. Banning assault weapons is not banning all guns.
Here lies the problem, the problem is the Hi-Cap magizines (not clips) I'm sorry, but my Ruger 10/22 is capable of accepting a 25 round magizne....how is that an assault rifle?

You ban the magaizne, you just banned my non-assault plinking rifle....
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Old 01-22-2013, 06:06 AM
 
46,306 posts, read 27,108,503 times
Reputation: 11130
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient View Post
Gun violence is actually many multiples higher in this nation than other developed first-world nations in North America, Europe, and Asia. You can't refute that.
No doubt, however, are we talking gang related violence, or all around suscide, homicide, one report even tlaked about "gun powder burns"....

You'll have to be more specific....
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Old 01-22-2013, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,706,970 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post
</lurk>

Not even close. New Mexico is a very "blue" state. Nevada is FAR more libertarian leaning than New Mexico, and I wouldn't think that Nevada is the "most" libertarian - I would think that honor would probably go to Wyoming, or maybe Montana.

<lurk>
Try living there for a few years and get back to us about that. All I will say is that "blue" in New Mexico is not at all like "blue" in say, NYC. I've never seen a private citizen wearing a holstered gun in the supermarket in NYC.


BTW:

New Mexico lawmakers join other states rejecting Obama gun control laws - Long Island Civil Liberties | Examiner.com
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Old 01-22-2013, 12:33 PM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,706,970 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by ellemint View Post
My point was that liberty-loving gun owners seem to think all attempts to reduce gun violence must be done by legislation, laws, restrictions by government.

I am suggesting they might want to also look at their own behaviors and responsibilities. For example, the pastor in New Mexico who along with 4 other family members was just murdered by his son, the household kept several weapons rather casually in a closet. The pastor apparently had 10 children. A house full of children, a troubled son, and a bunch of unsecured weapons---why does that seem like a recipe for disaster? There is no legislation in the world that can enforce common sense.
It's a rather common mindset there. Adults have guns, kids have guns (I know someone in Las Cruces who gave their eight year old a rifle this past Christmas).
Heck, when I was a kid (not in New Mexico, but Ohio) my grandparents kept a loaded shotgun behind the kitchen door.

It is, what it is.
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Old 01-22-2013, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,771 posts, read 104,756,288 times
Reputation: 49248
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
It's a rather common mindset there. Adults have guns, kids have guns (I know someone in Las Cruces who gave their eight year old a rifle this past Christmas).
Heck, when I was a kid (not in New Mexico, but Ohio) my grandparents kept a loaded shotgun behind the kitchen door.

It is, what it is.
good post, I think my dad kept his pistol loaded, under the matress when I was a kid. I am not positive cause we knew not to touch those guns. Even my bratty little brothers knew, dad's guns were off limits. And yes, you are right, even though some think NM is blue, it isn't really all that one sided. Even though we only lived there 7 years we saw a good balance of both parties.
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Old 01-22-2013, 05:00 PM
 
1,546 posts, read 2,552,562 times
Reputation: 1400
Default Violent Video Player Teen Killed Mother, Siblings & Father

Another Mentally Disturbed Person with Access to Guns. Wanted to kill his girlfriends parents and a whole lot of people at Walmart too.

New Mexico Teen Who Killed Family Planned to Shoot Up Walmart: Cops - ABC News
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