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Old 04-20-2013, 06:53 PM
 
11,768 posts, read 10,266,597 times
Reputation: 3444

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marv101 View Post
The mindset and assertions by ACA supporters that 'the benefits to be provided next year will be more generous than this year's level of benefits guarantees that premiums are going to explode next year and in years to come.

The bill mandated the creation of 100+ agencies, bureaus, commissions and other micromanaging paper-shufflers which not only must be paid for, but which also have nothing to do with the providing of healthcare services to anybody.

Their ludicrous assertion that the ACA will introduce competition into the marketplace is also absurd; how is implementing a 2,700+ page bill and the accompanying 15,000+ pages of rules and regulations going to introduce any competition into the marketplace given those staggering administration costs, on top of total inflexibility from Preskident Obama & Sebellius?

Overseeing the installation of the exchanges in many states is another 'unanticipated expense' that this administration failed to account for as well.

There aren't nearly enough Excedrin tablets in every drugstore in America for the Democrats who bamboozled us with this ever-expanding financial trainwreck to have to swallow if and/or when they finally realize what this albatross and/or self-inflicted hangman's noose will do for them come election season.
Well, thank god we passed it or else we would never have found out what is in it.
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Old 04-20-2013, 07:47 PM
 
Location: mancos
7,788 posts, read 8,032,105 times
Reputation: 6701
Wow this is sure getting complicated.I am in my 60's and have always paid cash for any medical expenses since '87 when I lost my ins.I was going to have my false teeth relined but that money has to go to my obamacare fine for paying cash instead of using a third party to pay for me after I pay them.I paid cash for my false teeth and don't feel I should have to give them up to obama.The country is freaking crazy with this nut around.Oh heck maybe I'll go down to social services and just get it free and beat the obama fine.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:31 PM
 
805 posts, read 1,161,841 times
Reputation: 720
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmking View Post
It doesn't. To me it show's how powerful these insurance companies are. To sway the federal government to move 100% into their corner at the expense of Americans and compromising the credibility of the US Supreme Court. I know what Obama wanted and he did not get it. A compromise was made with the opposite isle and the insurance companies who wrote the bill in place today. I'm sure the same thing took place decades ago. For-profit health insurance companies can not be the primary deliverer of health care in this nation. They need to be supplemental in nature and regulated.
Single payer all the way!
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:34 PM
 
805 posts, read 1,161,841 times
Reputation: 720
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
Obama said healthcare costs would DROP 3,000%, and used this lie to justify voting for the bill.

So anyone who says "its always climbed" as justification to just excuse whats taking place would indeed be a mindless kook.

Hey, college costs have always climbed, so I guess we shouldnt worry about what it costs to send your kids to school right?
how can costs drop 3,000%? A 100% drop in prices would mean something becomes free.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:38 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,826 posts, read 24,917,786 times
Reputation: 28526
The only thing Obama has fixed was an election.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:42 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,826 posts, read 24,917,786 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_the_facts View Post
how can costs drop 3,000%? A 100% drop in prices would mean something becomes free.
Let's use imaginary numbers here.

20 is 100% more than 10. 30 is 300% more than 10.


Edit.... I just saw you meant drop. I'm intrigued myself.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:43 PM
 
805 posts, read 1,161,841 times
Reputation: 720
The higher costs are due to insurers can no longer refuse to cover someone because of pre-existing conditions. Those individuals will be more expensive to cover than individuals without pre-existing conditions. Nonetheless, the overall quality of life of individuals with pre-existing conditions will increase as a result of them now being able to access affordable health care, something which will lead to fewer health complications, less emergency care, and longer lifespans. Paying a little more for insurance to insure everyone (or near everyone in the case of the ACA) is covered is price worth paying, in my opinion.

Also, many states already prohibit denial of coverage based on pre-existing conditions. Consequently, insurance costs are unlikely to rise as much in such states. In fact, insurance costs may actually go down in those states (or at least go up at slower rate than they would have absent Obamacare). That would be because of a broadening of the insurance pool, where the individual mandate results in more healthy individuals purchasing insurance, and, as a result, lower per enrollee insurance costs.

That being said, the ACA did not do enough to reduce health insurance costs and should have included prescription drug reform measures (such as allowing reimportation of prescription drugs from other countries and patent law reform).
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:48 PM
 
805 posts, read 1,161,841 times
Reputation: 720
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
Let's use imaginary numbers here.

20 is 100% more than 10. 30 is 300% more than 10.
I was referring to costs dropping 3000%. I am aware that costs can rise 3000%, but they cannot drop 3000%, unless instead of you paying for health care, you are paid every time you use a health care service.

So, yes, if 10 increases 100%, that would be 20. But, if the price of something is 10 and it goes down 100%, then it becomes 0. A 50% decline from 10, however, would be 5. A 3000% decline from ten would be -290.
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Old 04-22-2013, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Tampa Florida
22,229 posts, read 17,861,032 times
Reputation: 4585
The decreasing costs of HC .... why?

Here’s why health-care costs are slowing
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Old 04-22-2013, 07:40 PM
 
Location: Ohio
24,621 posts, read 19,173,997 times
Reputation: 21743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
What they will want to do is write as many policies as possible.....which helps them spread fixed costs and lower their expense ratios. That increases thier profit margins across all business.
I'm just not seeing it.

Coverage under an employer-sponsored plan is affordable to a particular employee if the employee’s required contribution (within the meaning of § 5000A(e)(1)(B)) to the plan does not exceed 9.5 percent of the employee’s household income for the taxable year.

Source: Section 36B(c)(2)(C)(i)

The 9.5 percent may be adjusted after 2014 to reflect rates of premium growth relative to growth in income and after 2018 to reflect rates of premium growth relative to growth in the consumer price index.

Source: Proposed Treasury Regulation §§ 1.36B-0 through 1.36B-5

The employee's annual cost for health care coverage is limited to 9.5% of W-2 Wages for 2013 for Calendar Year 2014.

So......how easy is that?.....just take 9.5% of your 2013 W-2 Wages and that is what you will [most likely] pay for health care coverage for 2014. Your spouse will also pay 9.5% of 2013 W-2 Wages.

Starting in 2015, you and your spouse will pay 9.5% of their Modified Adjusted Gross Household Income.

Let's look at the tax data....

Table 1.4 All Returns: Sources of Income, Adjustments, and Tax Items, by Size of Adjusted Gross Income

Bracket: $25,000 under $30,000
# of Returns Filed: 8,950,075
Adjusted Gross Income: $245,309,107,000
Wages/Salary: $193,814,226,000

Source: Statistics of Income--2010 Individual Income Tax Returns Internal Revenue Service Washington, DC

So, uh, wait a minute......does not compute....

MAGI: $245,309,107,000
Wage: $193,814,226,000
---------------------------
$51,494,881,000

So, what's that $51.5 Billion? Oh, nothing.....that's just Wealth for the $25,000 to $30,000 Crowd....nothing to see here....the 1% have all the Wealth......this is just a mix up in The Matrix.....you weren’t supposed to see that…..as you were.....carry on.....

Anyway, the whole point is that for 2014, the $25,000 to $30,000 MAGI Crowd will pay 9.5% of $193 Billion for health plan coverage through their employer.

But....and this is the important point....starting in 2015, the $25,000 to $30,000 MAGI Crowd will pay 9.5% each of $245 Billion for health plan coverage through their employer.

In other words....

2014: Husband + Wife = 9.5%
2015: Husband + Wife = 19%


How many households do you think can afford to pay 19%?

Obamacrap™ will effectively force a single-payer system.

Note that as two wage-earner households drop coverage for one spouse, what happens to the so-called “pool” that’s supposed to reduce costs?

Mathematically....

Mircea
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