Whats Wrong With Idaho The Reddest and Whitest of All States is all in for Obamacare (Bush, issues)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Do you have a way to nail down how many people signed up unwillingly vs. those who signed up happily? Neither do I. We do know that there are some of each, because you can read their stories all over the internet. But those are anecdotes, not data.
The only numbers we have that are something like concrete are the election numbers. Polling numbers are snapshots of the state of public opinion, and I know of none that targets only those who have signed up for either ACA policies or the Medicaid expansion.
Time will tell.
The polling data on Obamacare is probably the only thing showing people's feeling on the law. It's consistently ranked high in the unfavorable column with the latest polls holding steady with a majority who do not view Obamacare unfavorably. This, even after the so-called success story, the left is trying to claim. People didn't like the idea of Obamacare and have continued to not like it now that it's rolled out.
The polling data on Obamacare is probably the only thing showing people's feeling on the law. It's consistently ranked high in the unfavorable column with the latest polls holding steady with a majority who do not view Obamacare unfavorably. This, even after the so-called success story, the left is trying to claim. People didn't like the idea of Obamacare and have continued to not like it now that it's rolled out.
That's true. But as far as I know, those numbers include both those who have obtained insurance through the ACA or are liable for the penalty, and those who haven't/aren't. I was responding to the contention that most or all of those who have signed up did so under duress. I say that we have no way to know that at this point.
The polling data on Obamacare is probably the only thing showing people's feeling on the law. It's consistently ranked high in the unfavorable column with the latest polls holding steady with a majority who do not view Obamacare unfavorably. This, even after the so-called success story, the left is trying to claim. People didn't like the idea of Obamacare and have continued to not like it now that it's rolled out.
Actually the polling data when they ask about specific parts of the law, is VERY positive.
Its when they use the term "obamacare" that it goes negative. This of course shows just how effective the propaganda campaign against it is.
Its awe inspiring to me. I actually am impressed by the effectiveness of the propaganda campaign. Someone should do a study where they lay out all the parts, ask opinions, and estimate the cost of the propaganda vs's its effectiveness. Maybe contrast it with Romneycare, and see if you could correlate money vs effectiveness of the lies....
Actually the polling data when they ask about specific parts of the law, is VERY positive.
Its when they use the term "obamacare" that it goes negative. This of course shows just how effective the propaganda campaign against it is.
Its awe inspiring to me. I actually am impressed by the effectiveness of the propaganda campaign. Someone should do a study where they lay out all the parts, ask opinions, and estimate the cost of the propaganda vs's its effectiveness. Maybe contrast it with Romneycare, and see if you could correlate money vs effectiveness of the lies....
How's the mandate portion polling? Almost every Republican I know has always said there were certain areas that needed addressing and which, on part, Obamacare the law did address. However, it went too far, as liberals always seem to do, and turned it into this current boondoggle. Once they did that, knowing they created an inferior product no one would voluntarily support, they mandated it by law so they could try and "force" its success. Give me the polling data on the mandate, the single most onerous competent of Obamacare, and then you've proven to me that people actually like Obamacare. Otherwise, I stand by my statements.
How's the mandate portion polling? Almost every Republican I know has always said there were certain areas that needed addressing and which, on part, Obamacare the law did address. However, it went too far, as liberals always seem to do, and turned it into this current boondoggle. Once they did that, knowing they created an inferior product no one would voluntarily support, they mandated it by law so they could try and "force" its success. Give me the polling data on the mandate, the single most onerous competent of Obamacare, and then you've proven to me that people actually like Obamacare. Otherwise, I stand by my statements.
The reason for the mandate is actuarial. Like any insurance pool, it needs to be large enough to pencil out. I'm sure this was a huge issue as the ACA was developed, I doubt it surprises anyone that this is the biggest problem people have with it.
If Obamacare is "not likely" to be repealed it's high time to change those odds, eh? Also, why hasn't the OP broadcasted Ted Cruz's comments hither and yon - you know, where he said recently that "every word" of Obamacare must be repealed? Ted Cruz should also have a better handle on what Republicans as a whole are doing than McMorris Rogers does, considering that her district has a Cook PVI of R +6 and Cruz's district (which is all of Texas) has a PVI of R +10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowne
Didn't she also say 85% of the enrollees were receiving Medicaid coverage and the program would be unsustainable. Win!
Studies have shown that Medicaid recipients do not receive better health outcomes than those who are uninsured, and even those who have shown a health benefit certainly haven't demonstrated sufficient benefit to justify the $415 billion spent on Medicaid per year, a number that will rapidly grow if Obamacare is not repealed or dismantled. To put that number into perspective, if you set aside just one year's worth of Medicaid spending you could build a nationwide high speed rail system, which would be quite beneficial to the health and lifestyle of a broad section of the population that would use it, two things that cannot be said for Medicaid spending. Just imagine how weary super-commuters that don't like to drive much could reduce their commute time, their risk of an accident, their quality of life, and the quality of driving for other commuters.
If all you Democrats wanted to do was expand Medicaid, why couldn't you have just done that and not stripped people's health insurance away from them that they liked and wanted to keep, and were depending upon in some cases for lifesaving treatment? Why couldn't you have just done that and kept your promise to the American public* instead of stripping them of their health insurance choices?
*You know, like honorable civilized public servants would do, not a bunch of fraudsters engaged in thuggery and corruption for their own benefit (or for the benefit of the insurance companies - individual mandate, anyone?).
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514
The fat lady did sing. She sang a nice aria on November 6, 2012. Sorry you missed it. It was lovely.
Oh, the fat lady sang a long time before 2012 (source). Now it's time for the skinny lady to sing in November.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacqueg
Well, we had a pretty major election where the ACA was a major issue. Do those numbers count?
No, because that election was conducted based on phantasms of what the ACA as a hypothetical concept would look like - it's quite telling that favorability numbers for "this thing"* have plummeted now that people are actually seeing it in operate in their own lives. News flash: now that we've passed it and seen what is in it, we don't like it. That's why Democrats are peddling vague platitudes** about "fixing it", because they know that the thing is finished in the minds of the voters. Even if it was a major issue, if you wanted to repeal the ACA would you like to vote for Romney, the man who essentially created it? That was a major turn-off to people in the primaries, in case you forgot, and those people turned off and unenthusiastic translate to fewer votes for Romney.
**When questioned and pressed by their opponents, Democratic candidates haven't been able to name a single fix they would support that addresses the problems that make it unpopular.
Quote:
I do think it is safe to say that we will not go back to the status quo pre-ACA. And I think that is a *good* thing.
The thing only passed by a couple of votes - let's say on that night in 2010 that there was a bit less bribery or a few more Democrats changed their minds, or some such. Let us also say that Republicans took the House and the Senate in 2010. There was (and to a lesser extent still is) a big demand for health care reform of some kind - Republicans would surely have created and passed their own reforms if Obamacare wasn't the health care lightning rod and if they didn't have to deal with Harry Reid obstructing all their bills. Heck, there was a Republican plan some were trying to push as early as 2007 (source). Not that I (or the Tea Party) like it too much, but it's very likely that sans-Obamacare some version of health care reform would have happened.
Does anyone doubt that the Republicans have done some internal polling on Obamacare? Is it just a coincidence that on Friday a low news day Boehner and one of his lieutenants McMorris-Rodgers announces thats its time to move past the ACA. I have a hard time seeing McMorris-Rodgers showing up in her Tea Party inspired district finding anyone complaining about "Obamacare". It looks like most of her Tea Party constituents are on Obamacare, if they arent they are on Medicare..thats how the Republican party rolls...
Last edited by borregokid; 04-27-2014 at 06:53 PM..
I know because the core design of the law was bad, not to mention all of the wholly unnecessary components added to it. There is more than one way to skin a cat.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
). Now it's time for the skinny lady to sing in November.
