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You have a serious hang up on this. I suggest you move along and live your life the best you can. Nothing is stopping you from doing that but your own self indulgence into the pits of racism of 200 years ago that have consumed you.
So, because I am knowledgeable about American history I have a "hang up"
Read my other post. I do a lot of genealogical research and local history research of the Great Lakes region. My research actually reinforces my beliefs of how fortunate I am to have been born in this era. Also it makes me appreciate the evolution of the American psyche when it comes to race - meaning we are all much better today on this subject than our forefathers/mothers were and we are much better off because of it.
Learning about history is not having a hang up or being angry. It's too bad that you think that way. I think learning broadens one's perspective and should make them more appreciative of what they have. For black Americans, I think them learning about our demographic's history will make them less likely to make excuses for why they cannot achieve their goals.
You may not know but in black families, our grandparents/parents frequently scolded us about various mis-deeds by telling us to "think of the slaves" and how they did not have the opportunities that we have so we need to take advantage of those opportunities. I have always done so and do it more so now that I truly am aware of how bad not only my enslaved ancestors had it but my "free" ancestors as well. Their fight in the school system that I actually attended (!) is where I got a good education and it is the reason why I am a the comfortable economic status that I am in today. I don't want other black children to not know to take advantage of the gift of an education that they were given.
We get it. Slavery sucked. Jim Crow laws sucked. Segregation sucked. Not many are disputing those facts. However, blaming people today for what happened 150 years ago, or even 50 years ago, is idiotic scapegoating. If you want to be angry at the racists of today, feel free, and I'll be angry right alongside you. However, any argument that one group of people is owed anything due to what another group's ancestors did is a nonstarter.
I think it's interesting so many of you don't want to know about the history of our nation.
My comment was specifically about the opportunities that European immigrants enjoyed versus black Americans. That quote did not come from the Jim Crow south, nor was it about slavery. It was about a free black community who was denied access to public education before and after the Civil War, even after they joined the war effort and participated in a very high level.
I don't blame anyone for anything today because none of the players are alive today. However, I think it is important to note that white immigrants were given opportunities that blacks could not have access to. So the idea that they didn't benefit from the traditionally enforced and legally enforced racism is incorrect.
I read the article and not just the snippet posted in the OP and its main point was not that whites are responsible for slavery.
It's main point was that racist symbols should be in museums and that their display in public parks and grounds antagonizes minority groups and causes divisions within our society same as they did in the past.
If the symbolism is truly so offensive why did it take so long to go after it? Shouldn't it have been a big issue in the 60s/70s, civil rights era...
We get it. Slavery sucked. Jim Crow laws sucked. Segregation sucked. Not many are disputing those facts. However, blaming people today for what happened 150 years ago, or even 50 years ago, is idiotic scapegoating. If you want to be angry at the racists of today, feel free, and I'll be angry right alongside you. However, any argument that one group of people is owed anything due to what another group's ancestors did is a nonstarter.
It's the same thing with many Mexicans and Indians today. "The whites stole our land". Nothing was stolen and those people of the past are all dead now. They play the eternal victim when even they weren't alive back then. They love living in the past which ironically they weren't even a part of either.
I think it's interesting so many of you don't want to know about the history of our nation.
My comment was specifically about the opportunities that European immigrants enjoyed versus black Americans. That quote did not come from the Jim Crow south, nor was it about slavery. It was about a free black community who was denied access to public education before and after the Civil War, even after they joined the war effort and participated in a very high level.
I don't blame anyone for anything today because none of the players are alive today. However, I think it is important to note that white immigrants were given opportunities that blacks could not have access to. So the idea that they didn't benefit from the traditionally enforced and legally enforced racism is incorrect.
You don't think people benefit today from those being brought here? You could be barefoot living in a thatched hut if history was different.
I was talking to a specific person, not blacks as a whole group. I used the example of many people of every color who make good choices and make better lives. The person I was speaking to wishes to remain a victim, splits hairs, and gets nowhere because of self imposed limitations. It felt like I was arguing with a teenager who is too clever by half.
Lots of people victimize themselves, I agree.
But often it seems as if people believe that all blacks think we are victims we don't. I think a lot of very poor and lazy black people think they are victims of white people. However, I also know a lot of poor and lazy white people and they think they are victims of a variety of entities - including liberals, blacks, "the government," their parents, the "system," etc.
Lazy people are apt to blame others for their laziness.
LOL - humor flag on
Muslims have been enslaving infidels for over a thousand years - and still do.
But no one seems to notice their peccadilloes - at least not on the left wing nutjob side.
LOST EXCERPT from Start Wars
"But sir, nobody worries about upsetting a christian."
"That's 'cause christians don't pull people's arms out of their sockets when they lose. Muslims are known to do that."
You don't think people benefit today from those being brought here? You could be barefoot living in a thatched hut if history was different.
I would not be here if my ancestors did not come from multiple places. I have European ancestry. As stated, I have some "free" ancestry and those ancestors were black and white people who freely married each other and reproduced.
I have also stated in the thread that slavery for me is a non-issue. It is what happened after the Civil War.
I also know a lot of Africans from various African nations and none of them lived in a "thatched hut."
I think it's interesting so many of you don't want to know about the history of our nation.
My comment was specifically about the opportunities that European immigrants enjoyed versus black Americans. That quote did not come from the Jim Crow south, nor was it about slavery. It was about a free black community who was denied access to public education before and after the Civil War, even after they joined the war effort and participated in a very high level.
I don't blame anyone for anything today because none of the players are alive today. However, I think it is important to note that white immigrants were given opportunities that blacks could not have access to. So the idea that they didn't benefit from the traditionally enforced and legally enforced racism is incorrect.
I'm a huge fan of history, and little that you have stated here is new information. As terrible as the history is, that doesn't mean the descendants of the victims/survivors of that history are owed anything by the descendants of the other side.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory
It's the same thing with many Mexicans and Indians today. "The whites stole our land". Nothing was stolen and those people of the past are all dead now. They play the eternal victim when even they weren't alive back then. They love living in the past which ironically they weren't even a part of either.
I know very few American Indians who are still complaining about the past. Considering that a portion of my family still lives on reservations, that's saying something.
If the symbolism is truly so offensive why did it take so long to go after it? Shouldn't it have been a big issue in the 60s/70s, civil rights era...
On the bold - they were.
That is why it is important for people to know about our nation's history and especially local history.
Many of the monuments were not placed until the 1940s-1970s which was the climax of the Civil Rights Movement.
The Civil Rights era actually started immediately after the Civil War and it climaxed in the 1960s. A majority of these monuments in question were placed as a direct response to black activsim in the late 19th and early 20th century when blacks were VERY active in anti-lynching movements/campaigns and trying to get congress to pass anti-lynching legislation. They occurred again after WW1 when black soldiers came home and whites in many communities felt they were "acting out of their place" and the monuments were placed as a reminder of "their place." They again got in high mode after WW2 when the same thing occurred.
The Stone Mountain relief in GA was not finished until the 1970s and it was partially funded by the KKK and was used as an intimidation movement against Civil Rights activists, including MLK who was from GA. Various black people and organizations have always lobbied to have them removed. Please also note that in SC there was a call to remove the Confederate Flag from their capital for YEARS. It didn't occur until Dylan Roof killed those black church parishioners. One of the parishioners murdered had been involved for over a decade trying to get SC to remove the Confederate flag and other monuments. They removed the flag and many of the monuments in his memory.
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They love living in the past which ironically they weren't even a part of either.
